Libertarian ideas ever made you go..wtf?

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Mursilis

Diamond Member
Mar 11, 2001
7,756
11
81
I would love to hear your opinion on how we got here if we are not a collectivist species by nature that will war over shortages. Maybe god sent magic sperm a few thousand years ago and the human race are different then us? Libertarian philosophy is from a whacked bunch of sociopaths, go figure you guys dispute basic human nature.

No, we're social by nature and occasionally collectivist by necessity, but how selfless can we be if, almost without fail, when one human gains power over a group of humans, that human becomes corrupted?
 

BoberFett

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
37,562
9
81
You think you are a libertarian?!?!?! wtf?!?! hahahahaha.

You sit on your couch all day on the government dole. Thats not a libertarian. That would be like me saying people shouldn't pirate and then going home and bit torrenting the world.

If it were up to me, people like me wouldn't be paid to sit on their ass at home. But as long as morons like you continue with this ridiculous system I'm going to take advantage of it. Don't like it? Get rid of it.
 

Steeplerot

Lifer
Mar 29, 2004
13,051
6
81
No, we're social by nature and occasionally collectivist by necessity, but how selfless can we be if, almost without fail, when one human gains power over a group of humans, that human becomes corrupted?

Human collectivism becomes corrupted because free markets lead to exploitation of the masses through the elites gaining power through wealth accumulation it is a cycle of civilization itself, sooner or later the pitchforks come out and the wealth is redistributed so society can advance. The only reason we have freedoms now you take for granted to at least have some leverage over the rich who own the power is through democracy. Going back to being serfs for the monied is a false choice. Working together to find a balance is the only answer that has somewhat worked and will. Libertarianism is missing the big point, which is history itself and how people will always work together to overthrow exploitation sooner or later. Be it from corrupted governments or the inevitable oligarchies that evolve from capitalism.
 

Steeplerot

Lifer
Mar 29, 2004
13,051
6
81
If it were up to me, people like me wouldn't be paid to sit on their ass at home. But as long as morons like you continue with this ridiculous system I'm going to take advantage of it. Don't like it? Get rid of it.

:awe: In other words you are full of shit. Thanks for admitting it. Now why should anyone care what you have to say? Oh, you are a lonely drama queen who needs attention. Awe, heres a cookie.
 

frostedflakes

Diamond Member
Mar 1, 2005
7,925
1
81
Whats even more funny is this guy thinks he knows what a libertarian is. He has no idea! Wants to keep law enforcement and military spending as it is? What has this guy been smoking? He is clearly misinformed and has based his opinion on inaccurate information. This guy is sad.
Yeah never understood why so many people conflate libertarianism with neo-conservatism. Most libertarians want nothing to do with the modern Republican party.
 

Steeplerot

Lifer
Mar 29, 2004
13,051
6
81
Success through accusation stinks. A society based off of land ownership worked half-assed in the imperialist days centuries ago when there was plenty of land to steal (acquire), now that there are so many more people capitalism is literally a gun to the head of humanity sooner or later if human lives continues to have a monetary value susceptible to capitalisms cyclic nature in the longrun. That is not personal liberty and owning yourself. You prove your value to society by your talents, your labor contributed and who you are as a person to your fellow man. Those are the true value of labor and ones freedom that one should profit from, not what you are born into, or how much ass you can kiss to get over on one another when the planet has so much already.
 
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JSt0rm

Lifer
Sep 5, 2000
27,399
3,947
126
If it were up to me, people like me wouldn't be paid to sit on their ass at home. But as long as morons like you continue with this ridiculous system I'm going to take advantage of it. Don't like it? Get rid of it.

Seriously man?

Is this the logic you need to go through to feel ok about yourself? Man you must be the most self hating one on these forums.
 

JD50

Lifer
Sep 4, 2005
11,750
2,335
126
:awe: In other words you are full of shit. Thanks for admitting it. Now why should anyone care what you have to say? Oh, you are a lonely drama queen who needs attention. Awe, heres a cookie.

How's it any different from you not paying any extra taxes, even though you think taxes are too low?
 

JSt0rm

Lifer
Sep 5, 2000
27,399
3,947
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So is it a normal libertarian mindset to take advantage of the welfare system?

I dont fault boberfett for not being able to find a job. A lot of people cant find jobs right now and I cant even speak to his talents to know if he is even qualified to do anything of value (not meant as a slant I just dont know).

But the fact that he says he is doing it to stick it to the man reminds me of that southpark episode where the mexicans from the future come back in time and steal all the jobs and all the men of southpark have sex with each other so as not to create a future generation.

So how do other libertarians feel about this?
 

JD50

Lifer
Sep 4, 2005
11,750
2,335
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So is it a normal libertarian mindset to take advantage of the welfare system?

I dont fault boberfett for not being able to find a job. A lot of people cant find jobs right now and I cant even speak to his talents to know if he is even qualified to do anything of value (not meant as a slant I just dont know).

But the fact that he says he is doing it to stick it to the man reminds me of that southpark episode where the mexicans from the future come back in time and steal all the jobs and all the men of southpark have sex with each other so as not to create a future generation.

So how do other libertarians feel about this?

He's playing the game by the current rules, even if he doesn't agree with them. How do you feel about the rich Democrats that want to raise taxes on the rich? I'm pretty sure they're like everyone else and pay as little taxes as legally possible.
 

Steeplerot

Lifer
Mar 29, 2004
13,051
6
81
How's it any different from you not paying any extra taxes, even though you think taxes are too low?

Because we have a say over how much we tax ourselves in the long run. If you have a problem with that then as was said, voting is the answer, not money, not apathy. If we give up on democracy you are admitting the monied were right in the serfdom era and humans cannot work together to find common ground and a rational equilibrium to continue giving everyone as much chance as possible to further themselves. The rich do not know what is best for us. We proved this past few hundred years although it has been a very bumpy ride. To think we cannot handle democracy is a negative and rather nihilistic point of view of humanity that history does not show to be true. Hence why people give Libertarians crap about their philosophy being sociopathic.

It comes down to the irrational fear of everything government being out to screw you, this is crap and and just another excuse for people to be elitists to not give a shit. A big problem with humanity.

The government is not holding a gun to your heads, you have a choice on what taxes are, its the most important reason why we have democracy and it was fought for. The very notion of this total folly of everything government being bad and thinking business owners and monied know best would have made the founding fathers slap you upside the head with their still warm muskets from just fighting off a corporate oligarchy.
 
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BoberFett

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
37,562
9
81
:awe: In other words you are full of shit. Thanks for admitting it. Now why should anyone care what you have to say? Oh, you are a lonely drama queen who needs attention. Awe, heres a cookie.

Seriously man?

Is this the logic you need to go through to feel ok about yourself? Man you must be the most self hating one on these forums.

Seriously? That's the best you've got? You two need go back to Moonbeams School of Trolling and get a refund, because nothing sank in.
 

JD50

Lifer
Sep 4, 2005
11,750
2,335
126
Because we have a say over how much we tax ourselves in the long run. If you have a problem with that then as was said, voting is the answer, not money, not apathy. If we give up on democracy you are admitting the monied were right in the serfdom era and humans cannot work together to find common ground and a rational equilibrium to continue giving everyone as much chance as possible to further themselves. The rich do not know what is best for us. We proved this past few hundred years although it has been a very bumpy ride. To think we cannot handle democracy is a negative and rather nihilistic point of view of humanity that history does not show to be true. Hence why people give Libertarians crap about their philosophy being sociopathic.

It comes down to the irrational fear of everything government being out to screw you, this is crap and and just another excuse for people to be elitists to not give a shit. A big problem with humanity.

I don't have a problem with that, just pointing out that it's no different from what Bobberfett is doing. The rest of your rant irrelevant and a little too Craigish for me.
 

JD50

Lifer
Sep 4, 2005
11,750
2,335
126
Funny then that you want to keep electing them to lord over us. Who's the last Democrat president/candidate that wasn't wealthy?

Clearly he meant to say rich Republicans don't know what's good for us, obviously rich Democrats know what's best.
 

JSt0rm

Lifer
Sep 5, 2000
27,399
3,947
126
He's playing the game by the current rules, even if he doesn't agree with them. How do you feel about the rich Democrats that want to raise taxes on the rich? I'm pretty sure they're like everyone else and pay as little taxes as legally possible.

I understand your point but I then expect you to never be critical of LaQuanda Jackson who is also just "playing the game".
 

BoberFett

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
37,562
9
81
Clearly. You need to stop running away from yourself. Man up.

Why would I be running away from myself? My life is awesome. Silly wannabe troll, at least start with a reasonable premise. Starting a troll from way out in left field with no basis in reality will get you nowhere.
 

werepossum

Elite Member
Jul 10, 2006
29,873
463
126
There's nothing inherently unlibertarian about enjoying a benefit you're already forced to fund.
 

JSt0rm

Lifer
Sep 5, 2000
27,399
3,947
126
Why would I be running away from myself? My life is awesome. Silly wannabe troll, at least start with a reasonable premise. Starting a troll from way out in left field with no basis in reality will get you nowhere.

Unfortunately you have no idea what the good life is.

You are on welfare and hate welfare. Your life sucks.
 

TheDoc9

Senior member
May 26, 2006
264
0
0
Red, you're posts are very entertaining. You're one of those people that talks like he knows what he's talking about, but you actually don't.

If I'm reading your posts right, and it's difficult because they are a mixture of all kinds of strange ideas, libertarianism is the cause of all the problems in the world today. Things would just spin out of control faster if the world was libertarian. Only through being a liberal of the left right paradigm, can we be saved as a species.
 

BoberFett

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
37,562
9
81
I understand your point but I then expect you to never be critical of LaQuanda Jackson who is also just "playing the game".

You don't seem to understand the subtle difference between being critical of the system and critical of the individual. I play the game just like LaQuanda plays the game just like you play the game just like the Koch brothers play the game just like George Soros plays the game.