Lexus LS600L does 21 MPG (gas electric) thats one less than gasoline powered

[mzkhadir]

NYTIMES

 

[Vette73]

"The hybrid got 21 m.p.g. ? amazingly, 1 m.p.g. less than the nonhybrid version that I tested on the same urban roads and highways in and around New York City."

 

[drpootums]

the hybrid puts out more power though, and the goal for Lexus was to have a car with V12 power and smoothness with the fuel economy of a V8

 

[Riverhound777]

Originally posted by: drpootums
the hybrid puts out more power though, and the goal for Lexus was to have a car with V12 power and smoothness with the fuel economy of a V8

It is slower than the non-hybrid. All the hybrid junk adds 700 pounds, along with $30k. It is a failed experiment.

 

[Zenmervolt]

Originally posted by: drpootums
the hybrid puts out more power though, and the goal for Lexus was to have a car with V12 power and smoothness with the fuel economy of a V8

That was the goal. The result was a car that is slower than the V8 and has worse economy.

ZV

 

[nakedfrog]

Originally posted by: Zenmervolt

Originally posted by: drpootums
the hybrid puts out more power though, and the goal for Lexus was to have a car with V12 power and smoothness with the fuel economy of a V8

That was the goal. The result was a car that is slower than the V8 and has worse economy.

ZV

Ouch.

 

[NutBucket]

I just want to retrofit the LED headlights. I think that's my favorite feature of the car

 

[Zenmervolt]

Originally posted by: nakedfrog

Originally posted by: Zenmervolt

Originally posted by: drpootums
the hybrid puts out more power though, and the goal for Lexus was to have a car with V12 power and smoothness with the fuel economy of a V8

That was the goal. The result was a car that is slower than the V8 and has worse economy.

ZV

Ouch.

Don't get me wrong, the fact that the thing is 700 pounds heavier with AWD and only infinitesimally slower with only infinitesimally worse fuel economy is impressive, but they still botched the professed goal.

They will still sell like hotcakes though. Any time you can make a person look like they're being responsible without actually having to be responsible, you'll be popular. And this car does exactly that.

ZV

 

[Corporate Thug]

Originally posted by: Riverhound777

Originally posted by: drpootums
the hybrid puts out more power though, and the goal for Lexus was to have a car with V12 power and smoothness with the fuel economy of a V8

It is slower than the non-hybrid. All the hybrid junk adds 700 pounds, along with $30k. It is a failed experiment.

agreed

 

[Eli]

Originally posted by: Zenmervolt

Originally posted by: drpootums
the hybrid puts out more power though, and the goal for Lexus was to have a car with V12 power and smoothness with the fuel economy of a V8

That was the goal. The result was a car that is slower than the V8 and has worse economy.

ZV

Hmm.. That's odd. Doesn't seem like something Toyota would do.

 

[Eli]

Originally posted by: Zenmervolt

Originally posted by: nakedfrog

Originally posted by: Zenmervolt

Originally posted by: drpootums
the hybrid puts out more power though, and the goal for Lexus was to have a car with V12 power and smoothness with the fuel economy of a V8

That was the goal. The result was a car that is slower than the V8 and has worse economy.

ZV

Ouch.

Don't get me wrong, the fact that the thing is 700 pounds heavier with AWD and only infinitesimally slower with only infinitesimally worse fuel economy is impressive, but they still botched the professed goal.

They will still sell like hotcakes though. Any time you can make a person look like they're being responsible without actually having to be responsible, you'll be popular. And this car does exactly that.

ZV

Ahh.. Yeah. Leave it to ZV to put it into perspective.

The overall goal doesn't seem like it was met, due to numbers.. But yes, that is fairly impressive. It's the damn batteries. They kill in the weight department. If you supplant by using more powerful motors, you either sacrifice range.. or need to add more batteries, which is a losing battle.

Every car will eventually be a hybrid. There's no reason for them not to be. As the technology matures, prices will come down.. and as more R&D goes into it, weight will drop, etc.... It's a good thing.

 

[Zenmervolt]

Originally posted by: Eli
Every car will eventually be a hybrid. There's no reason for them not to be. As the technology matures, prices will come down.. and as more R&D goes into it, weight will drop, etc.... It's a good thing.

No, they won't. Hybrids are a stop-gap. The future is either bio-diesel or some form of hydrogen power. Possibly cellulosic ethanol if our politicians can get their heads out of their arses and stop the foolish corn subsidies.

ZV

 

[Gillbot]

Originally posted by: Zenmervolt

Originally posted by: nakedfrog

Originally posted by: Zenmervolt

Originally posted by: drpootums
the hybrid puts out more power though, and the goal for Lexus was to have a car with V12 power and smoothness with the fuel economy of a V8

That was the goal. The result was a car that is slower than the V8 and has worse economy.

ZV

Ouch.

Don't get me wrong, the fact that the thing is 700 pounds heavier with AWD and only infinitesimally slower with only infinitesimally worse fuel economy is impressive, but they still botched the professed goal.

They will still sell like hotcakes though. Any time you can make a person look like they're being responsible without actually having to be responsible, you'll be popular. And this car does exactly that.

ZV

+1

Hybrids are a marketing gimmic to pacify the masses into thinking they are doing some good while auto companies make huge profits from their ignorance.

 

[RU482]

Originally posted by: Eli
Hmm.. That's odd. Doesn't seem like something Toyota would do.

that made me laugh. It's not like Toyota is a rock in a vacuum, that will never change. Now that they are he biggest auto manufacturer, they are slowly becoming GM.

recalls up
quality down
silly business decisions more common
and so on

meanwhile, GM trends in the other direction

 

[theeedude]

That Lesux.
So basically they made it a porker, now it has to have that rubber band feeling CVT, and gets worse MPG, is slower, and I am sure that added weight is not doing it any favors in corners.
Don't worry, there are plenty of rich hippies in Hollywood and Marin County who'll want one so they can tell their neighbors how they are doing them a big favor by saving the environment.

 

[Pliablemoose]

Originally posted by: Gillbot

Originally posted by: Zenmervolt

Originally posted by: nakedfrog

Originally posted by: Zenmervolt

Originally posted by: drpootums
the hybrid puts out more power though, and the goal for Lexus was to have a car with V12 power and smoothness with the fuel economy of a V8

That was the goal. The result was a car that is slower than the V8 and has worse economy.

ZV

Ouch.

Don't get me wrong, the fact that the thing is 700 pounds heavier with AWD and only infinitesimally slower with only infinitesimally worse fuel economy is impressive, but they still botched the professed goal.

They will still sell like hotcakes though. Any time you can make a person look like they're being responsible without actually having to be responsible, you'll be popular. And this car does exactly that.

ZV

+1

Hybrids are a marketing gimmic to pacify the masses into thinking they are doing some good while auto companies make huge profits from their ignorance.

I read an interesting piece about how in a few years the hybrids may well be collecting in driveways, broken & too expensive/impracticable to fix, and how many of them will crawl along on ICE power alone after the batteries are toast.

Hmmm, a hybrid wrecking yard might be a lucrative business, the people that buy them aren't very cost conscious, and they'd love the idea of recycled parts, more green & all.

 

[ElFenix]

Originally posted by: Zenmervolt

No, they won't. Hybrids are a stop-gap. The future is either bio-diesel or some form of hydrogen power. Possibly cellulosic ethanol if our politicians can get their heads out of their arses and stop the foolish corn subsidies.

ZV

biodiesel hybrids. maybe even biodiesel generators with electric motors at the wheels like locomotives.

 

[Zenmervolt]

Originally posted by: ElFenix

Originally posted by: Zenmervolt

No, they won't. Hybrids are a stop-gap. The future is either bio-diesel or some form of hydrogen power. Possibly cellulosic ethanol if our politicians can get their heads out of their arses and stop the foolish corn subsidies.

ZV

biodiesel hybrids. maybe even biodiesel generators with electric motors at the wheels like locomotives.

No sense in the added complexity. Biodiesel will get to be cheap enough that the additional cost and complexity of a hybrid system will be superfluous.

ZV

 

[Dr. Detroit]

Future is biodiesel made by bioengineered pools of algae.

Count on it!

 

[Howard]

Originally posted by: Fmr12B
Future is biodiesel made by bioengineered pools of algae.

Count on it!

Hopefully we can. Biodiesel-producing algae farms seem kinda like a pipe dream, though.

 

[nweaver]

Algae is the most efficient crop for producing BD...


Hybrids are "cool" but this thread is spot on, they are a stop gap gimmick to make more money for the auto makers. The added complexity is what kills the deal. I had been debating about a Prius, or a Jetta TDI, and the thing I keep coming back to is that the TDI is a tried and true model. We have been making/working on diesel engines for a long time, and we didn't add some "miracle part" that makes it harder to work on, like the Prius with it's combined drivetrain.

 

[otispunkmeyer]

why do people keep thinking that lexus hybrids are aimed at more MPG.?

are they heck, its all about improving performance not saving the planet. ken livingstone however just isnt aware of this, and thus any car sporting a hybrid is congestion charge exempt.....yet if you have a small efficient diesel in say a VW polo...which puts out less co2 than lexus' big hybrids....you gotta pay the congestion charge. where is the logic in that?

 

[Zenmervolt]

Originally posted by: otispunkmeyer
why do people keep thinking that lexus hybrids are aimed at more MPG.?

Because Lexus said so.

Lexus' pitch was that it would deliver V-12 performance with V-8 economy. It delivers neither.

ZV

 

[Vette73]

Originally posted by: nweaver
Algae is the most efficient crop for producing BD...


Hybrids are "cool" but this thread is spot on, they are a stop gap gimmick to make more money for the auto makers. The added complexity is what kills the deal. I had been debating about a Prius, or a Jetta TDI, and the thing I keep coming back to is that the TDI is a tried and true model. We have been making/working on diesel engines for a long time, and we didn't add some "miracle part" that makes it harder to work on, like the Prius with it's combined drivetrain.

I have to disagree. A PLUG in hybrid would reduce the amount of fuel needed by quite a bit, even with a Diesel. So\ something that could use BD and run off battery would be quite a punch to oil producers.

 

[Fenixgoon]

Originally posted by: Marlin1975

Originally posted by: nweaver
Algae is the most efficient crop for producing BD...


Hybrids are "cool" but this thread is spot on, they are a stop gap gimmick to make more money for the auto makers. The added complexity is what kills the deal. I had been debating about a Prius, or a Jetta TDI, and the thing I keep coming back to is that the TDI is a tried and true model. We have been making/working on diesel engines for a long time, and we didn't add some "miracle part" that makes it harder to work on, like the Prius with it's combined drivetrain.

I have to disagree. A PLUG in hybrid would reduce the amount of fuel needed by quite a bit, even with a Diesel. So\ something that could use BD and run off battery would be quite a punch to oil producers.

a plugin hybrid also increases the demand for electricity, about which 51% in the US comes from coal.