Let's Play "Spot the Irony!"

[Perknose]

In January, co-owner Aaron Klein had denied a request to bake a cake for a lesbian wedding. “The Bible tells us to flee from sin,” his wife and business namesake, Melissa Klein told a Fox News columnist recently. “I don’t think making a cake for it helps.

[...]

The final nail in the coffin came in August when the slighted lesbian couple filed an anti-discrimination suit with the state. “The LGBT attacks are the reason we are shutting down the shop. They have killed our business through mob tactics,” Klein said. His wife added: “I guess in my mind I thought we lived in a lot nicer of a world where everybody tolerated everybody.”

Go! Go! Go!

Pro tip: There's a huge hint in the formatting!

 

[Sheik Yerbouti]

bwaaa hahahahha

Sorry, Nelson puts it much better than I can
To the bigoted bakery

 

[rudeguy]

cake politics:

Serious business

 

[drebo]

Are there no other bakeries in the town from which to purchase a cake?

Why would you want someone you yourself don't like to bake your wedding cake?

Seriously, this whole scenario is fucking stupid. Should LGBTQ be allowed to marry each other? Yes. Should a bakery be allowed to bake a cake made of whatever they want and sell it for whatever they want? Yes. Should the two be forced to do business with each other? No.

 

[s0me0nesmind1]

In all seriousness, if you don't want to serve someone why should you be forced to? I think this is pathetic on both sides of the aisle. Go across the street to another cake owner that isn't a dumbass.

 

[edro]

I don't know where I stand on the issue, but I want to post in this thread.

 

[KeithTalent]

Wake me when we are talking about pie.

KT

 

[rudeguy]

In all seriousness, if you don't want to serve someone why should you be forced to? I think this is pathetic on both sides of the aisle. Go across the street to another cake owner that isn't a dumbass.

I think capitalism worked.

Owners refused service to a customer they didn't want to serve.
Customer spread the word.
Owner lost business.
Owner had to close because of lack of business.

What I don't get is why so many people wanted the government involved.

 

[master_shake_]

i'm sick of the word tolerance.

why can't people accept that gay people exist?

 

[s0me0nesmind1]

I think capitalism worked.

Owners refused service to a customer they didn't want to serve.
Customer spread the word.
Owner lost business.
Owner had to close because of lack of business.

What I don't get is why so many people wanted the government involved.

So wait, what was their closing based on - Lawsuits from the LGBT or from an overall lack of business from spreading the rumors?


After thinking about it - Ultimately here is where I stand on the issue:
I think you shouldn't be able to refuse your business (In this sense, a store anyone can walk into) under the assumption it is a simple product that is already made: (EX: Come in and buy a batch of cookies). When you want your product customized to something that could be offensive... I think that is where I would draw the line and say the owner can legally refuse.

Let's mix up the scenario: A black woman has a business of making cakes. A Klan leader comes in and wants a festive dozen cakes with the KKK logo and lynchings on each of their cakes. Should the owner/Cake maker not be able to refuse that?

 

[Perknose]

Wake me when we are talking about pie.

KT

Ok. WAKE UP!

Lemon meringue pie, flamboyantly gay temptress of the palate or not?

 

[s0me0nesmind1]

i'm sick of the word tolerance.

why can't people accept that gay people exist?

I'm sick of the word tolerance.

Why can't people accept that some religious people are ignorant?

 

[KeithTalent]

Ok. WAKE UP!

Lemon meringue pie, flamboyantly gay temptress of the palate or not?

Damn. :wub:

KT

 

[feralkid]

I think capitalism worked.

Owners refused service to a customer they didn't want to serve.
Customer spread the word.
Owner lost business.
Owner had to close because of lack of business.

What I don't get is why so many people wanted the government involved.

How many times in all of these threads do you need to have the Constitution explained to you, Rudy?

 

[Jaskalas]

I see why the topic can be hot button.

We the people decided to use government to force others to cater to and serve others. We made a list of reasons you cannot refuse service, and orientation is on that list.

Does the ends justify the means?

Clearly we are being heavy handed in micromanaging other people, but I'm sure a lot of folks say that's worth the sacrifice to form a better society. That to participate in our society you cannot be a bigot.

 

[PingviN]

They should've just made the fucking cake. Idiots get what idiots deserve.

 

[feralkid]

I see why the topic can be hot button.

We the people decided to use government to force others to cater to and serve others. We made a list of reasons you cannot refuse service, and orientation is on that list.

Does the ends justify the means?

Clearly we are being heavy handed in micromanaging other people, but I'm sure a lot of folks say that's worth the sacrifice to form a better society. That to participate in our society you cannot be a bigot.

You can be a bigot all you want.

You just can't deny other people their rights because of your bigotry.

 

[tynopik]

We made a list of reasons you cannot refuse service, and orientation is on that list.

They weren't denied service because of their orientation

also,

<--- P&N

 

[SlitheryDee]

I think capitalism worked.

Owners refused service to a customer they didn't want to serve.
Customer spread the word.
Owner lost business.
Owner had to close because of lack of business.

What I don't get is why so many people wanted the government involved.

Was it exactly like that though? I wonder what they meant by "mob tactics". Perhaps they were subjected to a kind of concerted internet and real life assault that made remaining open intolerable.

Maybe that's the deeper irony here. Refusing service is a clear sign of a person holding a certain opinion, but I'm not sure I would call it intolerance. They may tolerate the LGBT community alright, they just want nothing to do with them. The LGBT community on the other hand appeared to not be able to tolerate that opinion one bit. They apparently hounded the business right out of business. Isn't that what someone who really cannot tolerate something would do? So the group that typically crusades against intolerance went on to participate in it. Is that irony, or just a contradiction? Sometimes I get the two mixed up.

 

[Perknose]

So the group that typically crusades against intolerance went on to participate in it.

Like the Montgomery Bus Boycott. Damn hypocritically intolerant negroes!

Sometimes I get the two mixed up.

:biggrin:

 

[brianmanahan]

i play music at weddings and wouldn't do it at a gay wedding, but i wouldn't say why. i'd just tell them i am too busy. much easier that way.

 

[rudeguy]

Was it exactly like that though? I wonder what they meant by "mob tactics". Perhaps they were subjected to a kind of concerted internet and real life assault that made remaining open intolerable.

Maybe that's the deeper irony here. Refusing service is a clear sign of a person holding a certain opinion, but I'm not sure I would call it intolerance. They may tolerate the LGBT community alright, they just want nothing to do with them. The LGBT community on the other hand appeared to not be able to tolerate that opinion one bit. They apparently hounded the business right out of business. Isn't that what someone who really cannot tolerate something would do? So the group that typically crusades against intolerance went on to participate in it. Is that irony, or just a contradiction? Sometimes I get the two mixed up.

Iunno

I would welcome and proactively advertise to gays and lesbians if I owned a small business. They are some of the best customers I have ever had. When I was in sales I had some really good gay customers. They spent more than the average customer, were fiercely loyal and always sent their friends in to see me. You would have to be an idiot to not want them as customers.

BUT it's perfectly legal to be an idiot.

 

[SlitheryDee]

Iunno

I would welcome and proactively advertise to gays and lesbians if I owned a small business. They are some of the best customers I have ever had. When I was in sales I had some really good gay customers. They spent more than the average customer, were fiercely loyal and always sent their friends in to see me. You would have to be an idiot to not want them as customers.

BUT it's perfectly legal to be an idiot.

Oh I agree. Their money is as green as anyone's. I've never seen the sense in refusing service to make a point, and it doesn't sound like the law was ever a factor in this case. Just societal consequences for making a lot of people angry. Perhaps all is as it should be.

 

[feralkid]

Was it exactly like that though? I wonder what they meant by "mob tactics". Perhaps they were subjected to a kind of concerted internet and real life assault that made remaining open intolerable.

Maybe that's the deeper irony here. Refusing service is a clear sign of a person holding a certain opinion, but I'm not sure I would call it intolerance. They may tolerate the LGBT community alright, they just want nothing to do with them. The LGBT community on the other hand appeared to not be able to tolerate that opinion one bit. They apparently hounded the business right out of business. Isn't that what someone who really cannot tolerate something would do? So the group that typically crusades against intolerance went on to participate in it. Is that irony, or just a contradiction? Sometimes I get the two mixed up.

No. That's Pretzel Logic.


Surely you're smarter than to believe that hash you just slung?

 

[Brainonska511]

They weren't denied service because of their orientation

They were buying a cake for a lesbian wedding, and the small context we are provided suggests that they were denied service because of their orientation.

In all seriousness, if you don't want to serve someone why should you be forced to? I think this is pathetic on both sides of the aisle. Go across the street to another cake owner that isn't a dumbass.

What if there was no bakery across the street? What if the other bakery was run by bigoted asshats as well and refused service?