LET ME JUST GET THIS STRAIGHT........ Plz read this

[AnitaPeterson]

Excellent link to those videos... I highly recommend them to everyone here... Kotb, the granddaddy of Islamist radicals, was saying that liberalism holds the seed of its own destruction - partially because of, you guesssed it, freedom of speech...

 

[CSMR]

Originally posted by: RichardE
See, the thing people don't get, is the people in the west will die for there freedom of speech. That is how important it is, we would rather die than lose it. Along with other freedoms. Anytime you see someone from the west get pissed off about it, you need to think of that. See yahoo, it is allowed to sell Nazi wear in the states, you can buy racist, bigoted, macho or anti (insert religion here) thing in the US/Canada and not be charged.

You are generalizing. I am in the west, and I would not give my life to defend freedom of speech. I wouldn't give a fig for Voltaire and his grandiose declaration. And it is not allowed to sell Nazi gear in the UK and many european countries to the best of my knowledge.

 

[Lurknomore]

Originally posted by: RichardE

Originally posted by: raildogg

Originally posted by: RichardE

Originally posted by: Shivetya

Originally posted by: elpres05

So please people, its my request, lets just not fight. There is no point in fighting, if you see any muslim making fun of christianity or other religions, he would be just as dead as these danish cartoonists. Its only after you commit something that you realize your mistake. Even if the danish newspapers don't publish apology, the cartoonists would be feeling guilty themselves.

I

I guess all those Palestinians who holed up with Arafat in that Christian church who used the Bible for toliet paper, and made a point of doing it, were being good little Muslims?


Face it, while Islam and some of its followers may have good ideals there are too many radicals who would just as soon drag it down to their level of hate to score points.

I am sure if you took a christian society, and made it extremly poor, than put in priests who made sure to teach the finer points of the bible (killing gays, people of other religions ect) you would find a society of chritian terrorists as well.

But that is not the case, so what's the point?

You could replace the word Christian with Raeliens or any other religion and say the same thing.

Also, don't blame all this on poverty because not all of the radicals are that worse off. Some are very educated and make a good living.

Why are the 10million plus Muslims in the states not rioting than?

That you would even suggest that it's "good" behavior on their part for not going to the extreme of rioting is very disturbing.

Oh, we're pissed off at the West- let's riot!
The West is racist!- let's riot!!
The Jews and the Western Media offend us- let's riot!!!
We want to show the West how "uncivil" they are with their offensive cartoons- let's riot, burn buildings, kill people, act like disgraceful pitiful rats.

Oops!- that last statement might have offended some Muslims.:roll:
Too bad, get used to it.

 

[RichardE]

Originally posted by: Lurknomore

Originally posted by: RichardE

Originally posted by: raildogg

Originally posted by: RichardE

Originally posted by: Shivetya

Originally posted by: elpres05

So please people, its my request, lets just not fight. There is no point in fighting, if you see any muslim making fun of christianity or other religions, he would be just as dead as these danish cartoonists. Its only after you commit something that you realize your mistake. Even if the danish newspapers don't publish apology, the cartoonists would be feeling guilty themselves.

I

I guess all those Palestinians who holed up with Arafat in that Christian church who used the Bible for toliet paper, and made a point of doing it, were being good little Muslims?


Face it, while Islam and some of its followers may have good ideals there are too many radicals who would just as soon drag it down to their level of hate to score points.

I am sure if you took a christian society, and made it extremly poor, than put in priests who made sure to teach the finer points of the bible (killing gays, people of other religions ect) you would find a society of chritian terrorists as well.

But that is not the case, so what's the point?

You could replace the word Christian with Raeliens or any other religion and say the same thing.

Also, don't blame all this on poverty because not all of the radicals are that worse off. Some are very educated and make a good living.

Why are the 10million plus Muslims in the states not rioting than?

That you would even suggest that it's "good" behavior on their part for not going to the extreme of rioting is very disturbing.

Oh, we're pissed off at the West- let's riot!
The West is racist!- let's riot!!
The Jews and the Western Media offend us- let's riot!!!
We want to show the West how "uncivil" they are with their offensive cartoons- let's riot, burn buildings, kill people, act like disgraceful pitiful rats.

Oops!- that last statement might have offended some Muslims.:roll:
Too bad, get used to it.

Umm..you make no sense regarding anything posted.

 

[Lurknomore]

Originally posted by: RichardE

Originally posted by: Lurknomore

Originally posted by: RichardE

Originally posted by: raildogg

Originally posted by: RichardE

Originally posted by: Shivetya

Originally posted by: elpres05

So please people, its my request, lets just not fight. There is no point in fighting, if you see any muslim making fun of christianity or other religions, he would be just as dead as these danish cartoonists. Its only after you commit something that you realize your mistake. Even if the danish newspapers don't publish apology, the cartoonists would be feeling guilty themselves.

I

I guess all those Palestinians who holed up with Arafat in that Christian church who used the Bible for toliet paper, and made a point of doing it, were being good little Muslims?


Face it, while Islam and some of its followers may have good ideals there are too many radicals who would just as soon drag it down to their level of hate to score points.

I am sure if you took a christian society, and made it extremly poor, than put in priests who made sure to teach the finer points of the bible (killing gays, people of other religions ect) you would find a society of chritian terrorists as well.

But that is not the case, so what's the point?

You could replace the word Christian with Raeliens or any other religion and say the same thing.

Also, don't blame all this on poverty because not all of the radicals are that worse off. Some are very educated and make a good living.

Why are the 10million plus Muslims in the states not rioting than?

That you would even suggest that it's "good" behavior on their part for not going to the extreme of rioting is very disturbing.

Oh, we're pissed off at the West- let's riot!
The West is racist!- let's riot!!
The Jews and the Western Media offend us- let's riot!!!
We want to show the West how "uncivil" they are with their offensive cartoons- let's riot, burn buildings, kill people, act like disgraceful pitiful rats.

Oops!- that last statement might have offended some Muslims.:roll:
Too bad, get used to it.

Umm..you make no sense regarding anything posted.

And so this is your reply?- very sad for you.
YOu really believe that a poor society of christians would act in the same manner, simply by being well versed?
Um wait, you'll use the same "no sense" argument again no doubt.

 

[bigasscow]

Originally posted by: elpres05
Don't get this wrong impression, depicting all prophets is prohibited but its not words of God, its what muslims call disrespect and the word cartoon is a lot of disrespect.

If depicting prophets is off limits, then is it safe to assume we have no idea what the prophets looked like?* If that is the case, then the likelyhood is pretty remote that any of the images in the papers are accurate, and therefore, are not the image of the prophet. Hence the image of the prophet has not been reproduced, and there's no need to go nuts.

*In the case of Christianity, were there is no ban on the images of prophets... Jeesus is a white hippy looking guy... figure that one out.

 

[Lurknomore]

Originally posted by: RichardE
I have to wonder, if the dictators who squander the oil funds of there country, and relish it a wasteland. Who are in bed with the oil companies, and with such an influc of money, give up on real leadership of there country, but instead just focus on there own interests, mainly oil. The result of all this being great poverty spread through there land, because lets face it, if they spent the oil on there country, on there infrastructure, social programs, educations, industries. They would be world leaders. I have to wonder, if these leaders who rape there countries wealth, and squander the greatest, wealthies source of revenue in history, if they are the ones to blame, instead of Islan. I have to wonder, why, 10 million plus muslims who live in the United States, why they are not rioting? Yet, there poor, futureless, hopeless brothers in religion, in the ME are. I have decided that I will blame the leaders of these countries, for making the conditions that these people live in, that resulted in there anger.

What is this gobblygook?
You make no sense at all, really sad.
Your beautiful "country" of Canada?- it's just a bunch of territories and wilderness, ready to be exploited, needing to be exploited. Heck, tar sands HELP your "country" develop, doesn't hinder it.

And those 10 million muslims- guess what. They've tasted the fruits of this society, have adapted to our lifestyle and have decided- hey's its not that bad. Many are quite secular, understanding the need for a material society. Many muslims are doctors and are exposed to womens bodies without shame. Muslims here are free to mingle with woman and people of other religions without fear of castigation by the more radical members of their faith. They see the need for a society that cannot use the weapon of riot simply because of "personal offense". Many are well-assimilated. Even if they're in the minority, it's better than being a majority citizen of a violent lawless society where unbridled faith rules and the ruling elite does nothing.

 

[RichardE]

Originally posted by: Lurknomore

Originally posted by: RichardE
I have to wonder, if the dictators who squander the oil funds of there country, and relish it a wasteland. Who are in bed with the oil companies, and with such an influc of money, give up on real leadership of there country, but instead just focus on there own interests, mainly oil. The result of all this being great poverty spread through there land, because lets face it, if they spent the oil on there country, on there infrastructure, social programs, educations, industries. They would be world leaders. I have to wonder, if these leaders who rape there countries wealth, and squander the greatest, wealthies source of revenue in history, if they are the ones to blame, instead of Islan. I have to wonder, why, 10 million plus muslims who live in the United States, why they are not rioting? Yet, there poor, futureless, hopeless brothers in religion, in the ME are. I have decided that I will blame the leaders of these countries, for making the conditions that these people live in, that resulted in there anger.

What is this gobblygook?
You make no sense at all, really sad.
Your beautiful "country" of Canada?- it's just a bunch of territories and wilderness, ready to be exploited, needing to be exploited. Heck, tar sands HELP your "country" develop, doesn't hinder it.

And those 10 million muslims- guess what. They've tasted the fruits of this society, have adapted to our lifestyle and have decided- hey's its not that bad. Many are quite secular, understanding the need for a material society. Many muslims are doctors and are exposed to womens bodies without shame. Muslims here are free to mingle with woman and people of other religions without fear of castigation by the more radical members of their faith. They see the need for a society that cannot use the weapon of riot simply because of "personal offense". Many are well-assimilated. Even if they're in the minority, it's better than being a majority citizen of a violent lawless society where unbridled faith rules and the ruling elite does nothing.

hmm..so in response you attack my country and prove my points, thanks.

 

[Lurknomore]

Originally posted by: RichardE

Originally posted by: Lurknomore

Originally posted by: RichardE
I have to wonder, if the dictators who squander the oil funds of there country, and relish it a wasteland. Who are in bed with the oil companies, and with such an influc of money, give up on real leadership of there country, but instead just focus on there own interests, mainly oil. The result of all this being great poverty spread through there land, because lets face it, if they spent the oil on there country, on there infrastructure, social programs, educations, industries. They would be world leaders. I have to wonder, if these leaders who rape there countries wealth, and squander the greatest, wealthies source of revenue in history, if they are the ones to blame, instead of Islan. I have to wonder, why, 10 million plus muslims who live in the United States, why they are not rioting? Yet, there poor, futureless, hopeless brothers in religion, in the ME are. I have decided that I will blame the leaders of these countries, for making the conditions that these people live in, that resulted in there anger.

What is this gobblygook?
You make no sense at all, really sad.
Your beautiful "country" of Canada?- it's just a bunch of territories and wilderness, ready to be exploited, needing to be exploited. Heck, tar sands HELP your "country" develop, doesn't hinder it.

And those 10 million muslims- guess what. They've tasted the fruits of this society, have adapted to our lifestyle and have decided- hey's its not that bad. Many are quite secular, understanding the need for a material society. Many muslims are doctors and are exposed to womens bodies without shame. Muslims here are free to mingle with woman and people of other religions without fear of castigation by the more radical members of their faith. They see the need for a society that cannot use the weapon of riot simply because of "personal offense". Many are well-assimilated. Even if they're in the minority, it's better than being a majority citizen of a violent lawless society where unbridled faith rules and the ruling elite does nothing.

hmm..so in response you attack my country and prove my points, thanks.

You have no points to be "proved".
And what did I say about your "country"? Didn't you read?

 

[RichardE]

Originally posted by: Lurknomore

Originally posted by: RichardE

Originally posted by: Lurknomore

Originally posted by: RichardE
I have to wonder, if the dictators who squander the oil funds of there country, and relish it a wasteland. Who are in bed with the oil companies, and with such an influc of money, give up on real leadership of there country, but instead just focus on there own interests, mainly oil. The result of all this being great poverty spread through there land, because lets face it, if they spent the oil on there country, on there infrastructure, social programs, educations, industries. They would be world leaders. I have to wonder, if these leaders who rape there countries wealth, and squander the greatest, wealthies source of revenue in history, if they are the ones to blame, instead of Islan. I have to wonder, why, 10 million plus muslims who live in the United States, why they are not rioting? Yet, there poor, futureless, hopeless brothers in religion, in the ME are. I have decided that I will blame the leaders of these countries, for making the conditions that these people live in, that resulted in there anger.

What is this gobblygook?
You make no sense at all, really sad.
Your beautiful "country" of Canada?- it's just a bunch of territories and wilderness, ready to be exploited, needing to be exploited. Heck, tar sands HELP your "country" develop, doesn't hinder it.

And those 10 million muslims- guess what. They've tasted the fruits of this society, have adapted to our lifestyle and have decided- hey's its not that bad. Many are quite secular, understanding the need for a material society. Many muslims are doctors and are exposed to womens bodies without shame. Muslims here are free to mingle with woman and people of other religions without fear of castigation by the more radical members of their faith. They see the need for a society that cannot use the weapon of riot simply because of "personal offense". Many are well-assimilated. Even if they're in the minority, it's better than being a majority citizen of a violent lawless society where unbridled faith rules and the ruling elite does nothing.

hmm..so in response you attack my country and prove my points, thanks.

You have no points to be "proved".
And what did I say about your "country"? Didn't you read?

Yes, my points to prove was that the riots in the ME are not caused by religion, but by the conditions, which you backed up. As well, most of our early sucess that helped our country and still does was on forestry, not oil, though I am not sure how you are trying to relate our oil and the poverty in the ME? Specially when the US produces more oil than we do. Honestly, from your post, I doubt you even understood what you were replying to, but needed to reply anyway with halfass comparrisions that made no sense.

 

[Lurknomore]

Originally posted by: RichardE

Originally posted by: Lurknomore

Originally posted by: RichardE

Originally posted by: Lurknomore

Originally posted by: RichardE
I have to wonder, if the dictators who squander the oil funds of there country, and relish it a wasteland. Who are in bed with the oil companies, and with such an influc of money, give up on real leadership of there country, but instead just focus on there own interests, mainly oil. The result of all this being great poverty spread through there land, because lets face it, if they spent the oil on there country, on there infrastructure, social programs, educations, industries. They would be world leaders. I have to wonder, if these leaders who rape there countries wealth, and squander the greatest, wealthies source of revenue in history, if they are the ones to blame, instead of Islan. I have to wonder, why, 10 million plus muslims who live in the United States, why they are not rioting? Yet, there poor, futureless, hopeless brothers in religion, in the ME are. I have decided that I will blame the leaders of these countries, for making the conditions that these people live in, that resulted in there anger.

What is this gobblygook?
You make no sense at all, really sad.
Your beautiful "country" of Canada?- it's just a bunch of territories and wilderness, ready to be exploited, needing to be exploited. Heck, tar sands HELP your "country" develop, doesn't hinder it.

And those 10 million muslims- guess what. They've tasted the fruits of this society, have adapted to our lifestyle and have decided- hey's its not that bad. Many are quite secular, understanding the need for a material society. Many muslims are doctors and are exposed to womens bodies without shame. Muslims here are free to mingle with woman and people of other religions without fear of castigation by the more radical members of their faith. They see the need for a society that cannot use the weapon of riot simply because of "personal offense". Many are well-assimilated. Even if they're in the minority, it's better than being a majority citizen of a violent lawless society where unbridled faith rules and the ruling elite does nothing.

hmm..so in response you attack my country and prove my points, thanks.

You have no points to be "proved".
And what did I say about your "country"? Didn't you read?

Yes, my points to prove was that the riots in the ME are not caused by religion, but by the conditions, which you backed up. As well, most of our early sucess that helped our country and still does was on forestry, not oil, though I am not sure how you are trying to relate our oil and the poverty in the ME? Specially when the US produces more oil than we do. Honestly, from your post, I doubt you even understood what you were replying to, but needed to reply anyway with halfass comparrisions that made no sense.

They haven't rioted here because they're adapted to a SECULAR lifestyle- poor or not.
The "conditions" here are caused by people realizing that a way to a richer life is not through using religion, but by keeping it out of their lives as much as possible.
Those in the ME believe that through by their FAITHS, and faith alone, they'll improve. Guess what, they've failed and disgraced themselves in the process. You seem to be trying to excuse their behavior while at the same time disparaging the success of wealthier nations.
Also, you forget that while we do produce more oil, you do have more potential capacity in the sands that you are more than willing to exploit. Yet you will cry and whine unless the revenue produced will go to your "social" programs. Kinda like people here who bash the cigarette industry yet have no qualms accepting the money for "health" programs.

 

[RichardE]

Originally posted by: Lurknomore

Originally posted by: RichardE

Originally posted by: Lurknomore

Originally posted by: RichardE

Originally posted by: Lurknomore

Originally posted by: RichardE
I have to wonder, if the dictators who squander the oil funds of there country, and relish it a wasteland. Who are in bed with the oil companies, and with such an influc of money, give up on real leadership of there country, but instead just focus on there own interests, mainly oil. The result of all this being great poverty spread through there land, because lets face it, if they spent the oil on there country, on there infrastructure, social programs, educations, industries. They would be world leaders. I have to wonder, if these leaders who rape there countries wealth, and squander the greatest, wealthies source of revenue in history, if they are the ones to blame, instead of Islan. I have to wonder, why, 10 million plus muslims who live in the United States, why they are not rioting? Yet, there poor, futureless, hopeless brothers in religion, in the ME are. I have decided that I will blame the leaders of these countries, for making the conditions that these people live in, that resulted in there anger.

What is this gobblygook?
You make no sense at all, really sad.
Your beautiful "country" of Canada?- it's just a bunch of territories and wilderness, ready to be exploited, needing to be exploited. Heck, tar sands HELP your "country" develop, doesn't hinder it.

And those 10 million muslims- guess what. They've tasted the fruits of this society, have adapted to our lifestyle and have decided- hey's its not that bad. Many are quite secular, understanding the need for a material society. Many muslims are doctors and are exposed to womens bodies without shame. Muslims here are free to mingle with woman and people of other religions without fear of castigation by the more radical members of their faith. They see the need for a society that cannot use the weapon of riot simply because of "personal offense". Many are well-assimilated. Even if they're in the minority, it's better than being a majority citizen of a violent lawless society where unbridled faith rules and the ruling elite does nothing.

hmm..so in response you attack my country and prove my points, thanks.

You have no points to be "proved".
And what did I say about your "country"? Didn't you read?

Yes, my points to prove was that the riots in the ME are not caused by religion, but by the conditions, which you backed up. As well, most of our early sucess that helped our country and still does was on forestry, not oil, though I am not sure how you are trying to relate our oil and the poverty in the ME? Specially when the US produces more oil than we do. Honestly, from your post, I doubt you even understood what you were replying to, but needed to reply anyway with halfass comparrisions that made no sense.

[b[ They haven't rioted here because they're adapted to a SECULAR lifestyle- poor or not.[/b]

So conditions are the cause..I was right again...


The "conditions" here are caused by people realizing that a way to a richer life is not through using religion, but by keeping it out of their lives as much as possible.

So conditions are the cause of the riots..again what my post stated

Those in the ME believe that through by their FAITHS, and faith alone, they'll improve. Guess what, they've failed and disgraced themselves in the process. You seem to be trying to excuse their behavior while at the same time disparaging the success of wealthier nations.

Where did I excuse there behavior? I blamed the leaders for raping the countries and causing the conditions even you agree are the cause. And not once did I disparage the success of the wealthier nations, only stated that because of that wealth, we do not have as many extremist..again going back to conditions not Islam caused the riots..which was the basis of my post


Also, you forget that while we do produce more oil, you do have more potential capacity in the sands that you are more than willing to exploit. Yet you will cry and whine unless the revenue produced will go to your "social" programs. Kinda like people here who bash the cigarette industry yet have no qualms accepting the money for "health" programs.

What would you consider the oil shale in Colorado? that supposedly has far more potential energy capacity than our oil sands.? As well, the revenue from the oil goes mostly to Alberta, I live in Ontario, therefore I see little of it, Alberta meanwhile pays 10% less tax, personally I do not care, as it does not affect me. Again, Canada produces 2billion barrels a year, the states produces almost 6 (with the stats I have, that are a few years old) I still fail to see how this related to anything regarding the ME. You seem to have run out of things to attack and used my sig. As well, regarding the little theory with smoking, posted earlier in another smoking thread, totaly revenue including jobs, taxes paid, and manafacturing income was 42 billion dollars a year, into the economy of the states. When the states paid out 72 billion a year in health related expenses to the tobacco industry. You honestly need to wtfu and actually read a post before responding to it. You are agreeying with everything I say, than going off on a tirade about my sig. Learn your facts before you sprout out your dismall opinions.

 

[AnitaPeterson]

As a Canadian, I am asking you not to mix our country into the discussions about this disgraceful scandal... particularly when there's no real point to be made.