Legally, how can one differentation between public and private wifi?

[Brackis]

When a list of Wifi networks appears on my screen, is it possible to see what networks are public?
If not, how can the law punish people for accessing private networks?

 

[n0cmonkey]

If there's a sign in the establishment you are at that offers wifi and you are unsure which is theirs, ask an employee.

I personally haven't decided if a wifi network is available in MY home if I feel morally ok connecting to it.

 

[dphantom]

Originally posted by: Brackis
When a list of Wifi networks appears on my screen, is it possible to see what networks are public?
If not, how can the law punish people for accessing private networks?

If a house has an open door, is it ok for you to enter and rummage around the contents of the people who live there?

 

[JackMDS]

Unless the SSID is using words like Free XYZ, or Hotspot xyz, or similar wording, you would not know.

 

[RebateMonger]

Originally posted by: dphantom
If a house has an open door, is it ok for you to enter and rummage around the contents of the people who live there?

But you aren't entering their property. You are receiving unencrypted transmissions and you are sending unencrypted transmissions that THEY are voluntarily receiving and responding to.

There's no law against receiving unencrypted WiFi transmissions. And there's no ban on sending unencrypted transmissions on WiFi frequencies.

The whole thing is a legal nightmare.....

 

[dphantom]

Originally posted by: RebateMonger

Originally posted by: dphantom
If a house has an open door, is it ok for you to enter and rummage around the contents of the people who live there?

But you aren't entering their property. You are receiving unencrypted transmissions and you are sending unencrypted transmissions that THEY are voluntarily receiving and responding to.

There's no law against receiving unencrypted WiFi transmissions. And there's no ban on sending unencrypted transmissions on WiFi frequencies.

The whole thing is a legal nightmare.....

No argument on the legal issues. I was taking the tack of accessing information on the internal network, not necessarily using the open wireless network to access the Internet let's say.

But otherwise as Jack says above, if a company has a private wireless netowrk and has it configured as a wide open hot spot, then I really don't know how anyone can tell the difference and seriously doubt you or I or anyone would face legal issues if we chose to use their network to browse the Internet.

The difference comes in if you use the wireless network to access private internal resources such as data, at least IMO for what its worth.

 

[RebateMonger]

Originally posted by: dphantom
The difference comes in if you use the wireless network to access private internal resources such as data, at least IMO for what its worth.

I agree that actually trying to access data on a private computer without permission is most surely a no-no. On the Internet, private data is normally protected by passwords, and trying to break in is a legal no-no. Don't know what happens if you get into an open WiFi network and there's a Windows 98 or other computer sitting there with wide-open shares....

 

[spidey07]

Originally posted by: RebateMonger

Originally posted by: dphantom
If a house has an open door, is it ok for you to enter and rummage around the contents of the people who live there?

But you aren't entering their property. You are receiving unencrypted transmissions and you are sending unencrypted transmissions that THEY are voluntarily receiving and responding to.

There's no law against receiving unencrypted WiFi transmissions. And there's no ban on sending unencrypted transmissions on WiFi frequencies.

The whole thing is a legal nightmare.....

The laws are quickly changing in favor of protecting the person who is operating an access point. If you attach to it without permission then technically you are violating current cyber laws - communicating or using a network that you don't own or operate.

But it gets real muddy. Most public ones have a means of notifying you that it is OK to connect to their network.

 

[Inspector Jihad]

password protect it if you dont want anyone to access it

 

[Nothinman]

If a house has an open door, is it ok for you to enter and rummage around the contents of the people who live there?

It's more like watching the TV in their house from yours, if their volume is up loud enough to hear and you can see the picture are you still stealing their cable? =)

 

[JackMDS]

No matter what "funny" excuses every one tries to invent, if by his own volition one is using some elese connection he is doing something wrong.

The problem is in places that their are many unprotected connections, and therefore many unprotect Wireless client, people can end up surfing through some one else connection without even noticing it.

Therefore, from a legal point of view it is an issue of proving volition. It might be hard to prove volition if one is using a single connection, and just surf the Internet. It easy to prove wrong doing when someone does not have is own wireless source and he is using Wireless to surf the Internet, or if one starts using/probing other resources on the system that he is ?leeching? upon, or if one is caught with a load balancing system that based on few connections while he has only one connection.

 

[chusteczka]

Originally posted by: RebateMonger

Originally posted by: dphantom
The difference comes in if you use the wireless network to access private internal resources such as data, at least IMO for what its worth.

I agree that actually trying to access data on a private computer without permission is most surely a no-no. On the Internet, private data is normally protected by passwords, and trying to break in is a legal no-no. Don't know what happens if you get into an open WiFi network and there's a Windows 98 or other computer sitting there with wide-open shares....

If the permissions are set to allow access by any random person then, by definition, permission is granted to access the files. The law should not be written for any specific implementation, such as an MS Windows filesystem for a single desktop user vs. a Unix/Linux filesystem for multiple users. The law should be general in nature to provide the portability and scalability to cover any operating system or filesystem.

 

[chusteczka]

sorry about the double-post. It wasn't that important anyway.

 

[spidey07]

Originally posted by: chusteczka
If the permissions are set to allow a access by any random person then, by definition, permission is granted to access the files. The law should not be written for any specific implementation, such as an MS Windows filesystem for a single desktop user vs. a Unix/Linux filesystem for multiple users. The law should be general in nature to provide the portability and scalability to cover any operating system or filesystem.

This is not how the federal laws are written.

It is very clear that accessing a computer system or network you do not own or operate or have explicit permission to do so is a federal crime.

 

[chusteczka]

Originally posted by: spidey07

Originally posted by: chusteczka
If the permissions are set to allow a access by any random person then, by definition, permission is granted to access the files. The law should not be written for any specific implementation, such as an MS Windows filesystem for a single desktop user vs. a Unix/Linux filesystem for multiple users. The law should be general in nature to provide the portability and scalability to cover any operating system or filesystem.

This is not how the federal laws are written.

It is very clear that accessing a computer system or network you do not own or operate or have explicit permission to do so is a federal crime.

I see fun times can be had as a lawyer with technical knowledge. 😛

 

[cmetz]

Brackis, in my state, the issue is simply whether you had prior authorization to use the network. There's no technical question, it's purely a human question. If you are not authorized to access a system and you access it, you are behaving unlawfully.

(My state's law happens to be the model for most modern computer trespass statues)

Even if I leave my front door unlocked and wide open, you are not authorized to walk in and take things, that's still stealing.