Lawrence Solomon: False hope for global unity

[ProfJohn]

Bad news for those who think Obama will cause the world to love America.

The first time Obama is forced to act in American self interest the world will go back to hating us.
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My American friends believe that, after Barack Obama becomes president, America will once again be loved around the world. They are wishful thinkers.

Anti-Americanism didn?t begin with George Bush and it won?t end with an Obama presidency. With rare exceptions, America has always inspired hatred and contempt, and for reasons that aren?t about to go away. Those who expect America?s haters to convert on November 4 need to get out more.

I first noticed anti-Americanism abroad as a teen from Canada living in Paris in 1967 ? Americans were commonly held in contempt in the 5th Republic of Charles De Gaulle (1958-69), who glorified France by slurring the U.S., and who explicitly sought to undermine U.S. stature in the world. As was popular among French intellectuals, De Gaulle decried America?s ?arrogance of power? and its soulless materialism.

Then I noticed anti-Americanism in a trip around the world in 1973, and so did the many Americans I crossed paths with in youth hostels and cafes. Their backpacks could be counted on to display the Canadian flag, the better to avoid unpleasantries (German youths, reviled for their country?s Nazi past, sported backpacks with Swiss flags). All told, I have visited some 60 countries over the last 40 years. With the general exception of the then-Communist countries, the sentiment ? at least among the reform-minded people I tended to associate with ? was overwhelmingly anti-American.

The bitter criticisms of the U.S. often confused me. Anil Agarwal, a prominent environmentalist (now-deceased) from India for whom I had the greatest respect, decried the ?Coca Cola-ization? of the Third World (this was circa 1980 ? today we would call this ?globalization?). You can visit the poorest, most remote village, he lamented, and you will see Coca Cola signs, and people drinking Coca Cola, despite the expense.

But why blame Coca Cola or America?, I asked, particularly perplexed because Anil was inspired by the villager?s knowledge and resourcefulness, and was an outspoken proponent of individual and community control. If villagers voluntarily purchase Coca Cola, why would Anil object?

Anil never did answer in a way I found satisfying, other than expressing a discomfort that the U.S. had become too powerful, that its corporations? reach had become too extensive, that the U.S. presence had gone too far. It was then common to decry ?U.S. imperialism,? although the U.S. never sought or got much of a colonial empire, unlike Great Britain, France, Germany, Spain, Belgium, Portugal, the Netherlands, and Italy, which between them militarily conquered and colonized much of Africa, Asia and the Americas. ?U.S. imperialism? was short for ?U.S. economic imperialism,? meaning that the U.S. was attempting to control the world marketplace through often nefarious non-military means, including covert support for dictators.

America?s military, of course, inspires resentment and hatred when it engages in war ? witness the reaction today to the war in Iraq, or a generation ago to the Vietnam War. But America?s military also inspires contempt for its passivity. During the First World War, the German Kaiser repeatedly claimed that America would not fight, whatever the provocation; President Woodrow Wilson, with his policy of ?watchful waiting,? bore him out for years, entering the war only at the end and after being attacked. Roosevelt, likewise, entered the Second World War late, and after America was attacked.

The view around the world that America doesn?t have the stomach for a fight remains ? Muslim extremists took this lesson from Reagan?s flight from Beirut in 1984 and Clinton?s from Somalia in 1993. American restraint following the first World Trade Center attack, the embassy bombings and the attack on the USS Cole confirmed this analysis prior to 9/11, as did the anti-war movement during the Vietnam war, as does the anti-war movement now. Whether the loathing for America is greater when it fights or when it does not is arguable; not arguable is that the U.S. has been loathed regardless of its military stance.

The most enduring of the stereotypes that denigrate the U.S. is that of the Ugly American, a best-selling book that came out in 1958, and then became a Marlon Brando movie. This American is loud and tasteless, insensitive to other cultures. A boor, and not one in uniform, the ugly American came to represent the American tourist above all, but also corporate big-wigs and stay-at-home slobs. This characterization was nothing new, however. An earlier America hater, Charles Dickens, in 1844 painted Americans in an equally boorish light and America as ?so maimed and lame, so full of sores and ulcers, foul to the eye and almost hopeless to the sense, that her best friends turn from the loathsome creature with disgust.? Almost a century earlier still, the French had decided that the natural environment in the Americas was not conducive to producing hardy flora or fauna, and that humans who settled there would become degenerate. Voltaire was one exponent of this view, the French encyclopedist Abbe Raynal another: ?America has not yet produced a good poet, an able mathematician, one man of genius in a single art or a single science,? he concluded in 1770, setting off a debate among such men as Benjamin Franklin, Alexander Hamilton, and Thomas Jefferson, who now had to defend themselves from attack by their more cultured critics across the sea.

Many, many scholars have examined the phenomenon of anti-Americanism, some likening it to a kind of secular religion that explains all the world?s evils, from poverty and injustice to wars and environmental destruction. My explanation is less complicated: America is an unparalleled success, and with success comes envy and resentment, especially of those who don?t have it.

The world has seen other great military powers ? the ancient Romans, the Ottomans, the British. None has extended its military reach throughout the planet, as has the U.S. Neither has any one nation before so dominated the world economy ? the U.S. represents 25% of world GDP. Neither has any one nation so dominated technological advancement ? the U.S. soars in scientific achievements, whether measured by the number of Nobel Prizes won or the number of patents acquired. Neither, and most gallingly, has any one nation ever dominated culture so thoroughly. From Hollywood to Broadway to TV, from music to clothing to food, America is everywhere supreme. This Coca-Cola-McDonalds-Starbucks culture may be reviled but it cannot be disputed.

Finally, America is loathed because its brand of free-market capitalism remains ascendant, having outperformed European-style socialism and utterly defeated Communism, ideologies that attract many if not most of the world?s intellectuals. More than two centuries since its founding, the U.S. shows no sign of losing either its economic or military supremacy.

Will the world pay obeisance to U.S. superiority should President Obama take office? French president Sarkozy reportedly characterized Obama?s stance on Iran as ?utterly immature? and comprised of ?formulations empty of all content.? Worse, he believes, Obama is ?arrogantly? displaying a willingness to act unilaterally in talking to Iran without preconditions, ignoring the consensus forged by France, Germany and other members on the UN Security Council. The EU?s trade commissioner called Obama?s advocacy of trade protectionism ?irresponsible? and a ?mirage,? the UK?s foreign secretary echoed trade concerns.

America will be America after Nov 4. Anti-Americanism is safe.

 

[sandorski]

Anti-Americanism lulled after 9/11, then exploded after Iraq was invaded. There has always been and always will be some Anti-Americanism, some deserved and some not, there will never be a time where everyone is going to be Pro-American. Same is true of any Nation though and to expect everyone to Love you is the height of conceit.

 

[Farang]

I haven't traveled to 60 countries, but I've been to 22 and I have to disagree. While most people certainly did not like Bush I more often than not saw eyes light up when I said I was an American and rarely (if ever) was treated with contempt. This in places like Vietnam, the Philippines, India, France, and elsewhere. People are able to separate politics from people an it is our politics that is most offensive, if that were to change then the majority of folks in the world would have nothing to dislike us for.

Also those American backpackers he mentions with the Canadian flags anger me to no end. I'm not much of a nationalist but there is something to be said of a person who doesn't even have the testicular fortitude to tell people where he or she is from.

edit: in the case of a "she," I suppose ovarian fortitude is lacking

 

[UberNeuman]

Ah, PJ.... dining on ashes yet again.....

 

[techs]

Did I miss the memo? Since when did people say an Obama Presidency would cause the world to love us?
The article starts with a straw dog. And then proceeds to debunk the straw dog.
Basically the article is worthless.

An Obama Presidency would change the US policy which seemed under Bush to go out its way to antagonize the world, probably as a political ploy to show "strength" to the American public.
An Obama policy that doesn't intentionally antagonize the world, will, imo, cool some of the tensions that exist. Doesn't mean they'll love us, but at least we won't create unnecessary bad will.

 

[TheSlamma]

Don't you have to have some input on the article to post?

How many countries have you been to PJ? or are you a classic republican who has no need for a Passport (or culture)

 

[Farang]

I should add that even Iraqis I've met abroad don't hate America. And they are the types that are not in Iraq because of the war and have a right to be upset. I think this article is a bunch of nonsense, perpetuating the untrue stereotype that everyone hates Americans.

 

[fskimospy]

What a crock of shit. I've been to more than 20 countries on every continent and people don't hate Americans, they hate our foreign policy.

Compare and contrast the global view of America in the 70's, 80's, and 90's compared to after the invasion of Iraq. Sure there were times countries got mad at us, where there were demonstrations against us, etc. A worldwide consensus of contempt and revulsion lasting more than half a decade (and counting)? I don't think so.

America won't be beloved among nations with Obama as our president, (not that anyone ever tried to argue that, another dishonest characterization by Pro-Jo) but there's a good chance we won't be as universally hated.

 

[GodlessAstronomer]

Originally posted by: eskimospy
What a crock of shit. I've been to more than 20 countries on every continent and people don't hate Americans, they hate our foreign policy.

Bingo. I have met many Americans and they have almost all been awesome people. What I hate is your government, your policy and your self-imposed World Police status.

 

[ProfJohn]

Originally posted by: GodlessAstronomer

Originally posted by: eskimospy
What a crock of shit. I've been to more than 20 countries on every continent and people don't hate Americans, they hate our foreign policy.

Bingo. I have met many Americans and they have almost all been awesome people. What I hate is your government, your policy and your self-imposed World Police status.

And none of that is going to change under Obama.

That was the point of the article.

 

[UberNeuman]

Originally posted by: ProfJohn

Originally posted by: GodlessAstronomer

Originally posted by: eskimospy
What a crock of shit. I've been to more than 20 countries on every continent and people don't hate Americans, they hate our foreign policy.

Bingo. I have met many Americans and they have almost all been awesome people. What I hate is your government, your policy and your self-imposed World Police status.

And none of that is going to change under Obama.

That was the point of the article.

well. thank you very little....

 

[microbial]

A good starting point to engage in foreign policy more in line with the historical democratic principles on which the US was founded, would be if we did not make the same mistake of preemptively and unilaterally attacking another country without any provocation. Worse, if we make a case for it, after the fact, with bogus and trumped-up intelligence that only served to demonstrate our administrations willful intent to deceive.

 

[Infohawk]

ProJo and other conservatives don't have to worry about it because they rarely leave the country anyway (unless it's on some military or evangelical excursion.)

But it will improve. It's not black and white, right-wingers.

 

[Farang]

Originally posted by: ProfJohn

Originally posted by: GodlessAstronomer

Originally posted by: eskimospy
What a crock of shit. I've been to more than 20 countries on every continent and people don't hate Americans, they hate our foreign policy.

Bingo. I have met many Americans and they have almost all been awesome people. What I hate is your government, your policy and your self-imposed World Police status.

And none of that is going to change under Obama.

That was the point of the article.

It may help if he enlists our allies instead of going it alone. NATO-led operations garner much more international support.

 

[midway]

Originally posted by: ProfJohn

Originally posted by: GodlessAstronomer

Originally posted by: eskimospy
What a crock of shit. I've been to more than 20 countries on every continent and people don't hate Americans, they hate our foreign policy.

Bingo. I have met many Americans and they have almost all been awesome people. What I hate is your government, your policy and your self-imposed World Police status.

And none of that is going to change under Obama.

That was the point of the article.

Yep, I bet Obama already has a long list of countries he wants to invade and is getting ready to use the first disaster that happens to us as a way to invade them.

 

[sammyunltd]

Originally posted by: eskimospy
What a crock of shit. I've been to more than 20 countries on every continent and people don't hate Americans, they hate our foreign policy.

No. They hate Americans. Come to Quebec and you'll see. Or to France. They say they like because it is proven that American tourists are the ones that spend the most on trips.

 

[GodlessAstronomer]

Originally posted by: sammyunltd

Originally posted by: eskimospy
What a crock of shit. I've been to more than 20 countries on every continent and people don't hate Americans, they hate our foreign policy.

No. They hate Americans. Come to Quebec and you'll see. Or to France. They say they like because it is proven that American tourists are the ones that spend the most on trips.

I haven't traveled a lot, but I live in New Zealand and I can tell you that this is categorically untrue of anyone I know. I don't hate Americans and no one I have met has ever told me that they do. I don't care about tourist revenue, but I have the mental capacity to differentiate between the people of a country and that country's foreign policy.

 

[LumbergTech]

Originally posted by: sammyunltd

Originally posted by: eskimospy
What a crock of shit. I've been to more than 20 countries on every continent and people don't hate Americans, they hate our foreign policy.

No. They hate Americans. Come to Quebec and you'll see. Or to France. They say they like because it is proven that American tourists are the ones that spend the most on trips.

I know plenty of canadians, its basically the same as america, some people are too stupid too tell the difference between a government and its people, and some arent

and give me a break, the people in the united states talk so much trash about the french its no wonder there might be a negative attitude there, im not going to try to say who started it first, but it goes both ways

 

[Butterbean]

Its mostly foreign media that hates America the most - just like the home grown Marxists - erm journalists. I spend most of my time in UK forums and the anti-American stuff went over the top in 04-05 and now a lot of UK/Europe is a bit nervous about its own runaway political correctness and immigration issues. They have been becoming more sober while we want to elect a black liberation Marxist pretending to be post racial Joe Cool. The world is heading for anarachy like the 30's/40's but there will be no US to pull fannies out of the fire this time.

 

[OrByte]

If things will be bad under an Obama presidency imagine how much worse things would be under a McCain presidency.

yikes!

 

[First]

The dislike of Americans has definitely increased during 2000-2007, far more than was the case when we actually had competant people in office in the 90's according to every metric known to man. Obama will certainly improve some of that by having the foresight not to engage in foolhardy attempts at nation building such as Iraq.

Btw, Obama is favored over McCain by over 3:1 around the world, a supermajority around the world still disagrees with Iraq, and of course most importantly Americans still are opposed to the war in Iraq by 66%. That's the same percentage as in 2006 and 2007. I guess no one bought the surge?

 

[First]

Originally posted by: GodlessAstronomer

Originally posted by: sammyunltd

Originally posted by: eskimospy
What a crock of shit. I've been to more than 20 countries on every continent and people don't hate Americans, they hate our foreign policy.

No. They hate Americans. Come to Quebec and you'll see. Or to France. They say they like because it is proven that American tourists are the ones that spend the most on trips.

I haven't traveled a lot, but I live in New Zealand and I can tell you that this is categorically untrue of anyone I know. I don't hate Americans and no one I have met has ever told me that they do. I don't care about tourist revenue, but I have the mental capacity to differentiate between the people of a country and that country's foreign policy.

Your anecdotal evidence basically means nothing, whether you had met people that told you they hated America or not. Your sample can't be more than a few dozen people.

 

[dennilfloss]

Canadian 'antiAmericanism' began when you guys started acting like collective douchebags (just after the Quebec Act).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quebec_Act

 

[fskimospy]

Originally posted by: sammyunltd

Originally posted by: eskimospy
What a crock of shit. I've been to more than 20 countries on every continent and people don't hate Americans, they hate our foreign policy.

No. They hate Americans. Come to Quebec and you'll see. Or to France. They say they like because it is proven that American tourists are the ones that spend the most on trips.

Oh whatever. Talk about ignorant.

I'm not talking just about the people that live in the countries that you meet, I'm talking about other travelers, families I've lived with, etc. I've had people in Vietnam come and invite me to their house for dinner after knowing them for less than 20 minutes.

Anyone who thinks people in other countries just hate Americans has either never been anywhere, or has never actually seen the outside of a tour bus in any place they've actually visited.

 

[Farang]

Originally posted by: Evan

Originally posted by: GodlessAstronomer

Originally posted by: sammyunltd

Originally posted by: eskimospy
What a crock of shit. I've been to more than 20 countries on every continent and people don't hate Americans, they hate our foreign policy.

No. They hate Americans. Come to Quebec and you'll see. Or to France. They say they like because it is proven that American tourists are the ones that spend the most on trips.

I haven't traveled a lot, but I live in New Zealand and I can tell you that this is categorically untrue of anyone I know. I don't hate Americans and no one I have met has ever told me that they do. I don't care about tourist revenue, but I have the mental capacity to differentiate between the people of a country and that country's foreign policy.

Your anecdotal evidence basically means nothing, whether you had met people that told you they hated America or not. Your sample can't be more than a few dozen people.

The entire OP article is based on anecdotal evidence with handpicked quotes covering 200 years of history.