Kinder, Gentler, Saner

Perknose

Forum Director & Omnipotent Overlord
Forum Director
Oct 9, 1999
46,894
10,720
147
Barbara Bush comes out in favor of licking the problem of marriage rights for all. I approve. :thumbsup:

The Bush dynasty is no stranger to generational conflict: father and son differed over deposing Saddam Hussein, raising taxes and the role of the United Nations.



BUSH-articleInline.jpg

Barbara Bush in her video statement.



Now it is father and daughter who find themselves at odds over a weighty issue.

Barbara Bush, one of the twin daughters of George W. Bush, will endorse same-sex marriage on Tuesday, publicly breaking ranks with a father who, as president, pushed for a constitutional amendment banning such unions.
Ms. Bush, 29, has taped a video calling on New York to legalize gay marriage. A bill to do that was defeated in the state in 2009. She describes the issue as a matter of conscience and equality.

“I am Barbara Bush, and I am a New Yorker for marriage equality,” she says in the brief message, sponsored by an advocacy group. “New York is about fairness and equality. And everyone should have the right to marry the person that they love.”

The video ends with Ms. Bush, who lives in Manhattan, imploring the state’s residents to “join us.”

Ms. Bush is the latest child of a prominent Republican leader to embrace same-sex marriage, long considered anathema to the conservative movement. Gay rights advocates have been quick to seize on the generational split as evidence that the acceptance of same-sex marriage is blind to party affiliation and family values.

Meghan McCain, the daughter of John McCain, the 2008 Republican presidential nominee, has become an outspoken supporter of same-sex marriage, despite her father’s opposition to it. And Mary Cheney, the lesbian daughter of Vice President Dick Cheney, has forcefully backed it as well — and is widely credited with helping to persuade her father to do the same.

In the case of Mr. McCain, Mr. Cheney and Mr. Bush, it is not just their children who have supported it. So, to varying degrees, have their wives. Laura Bush, in a television interview in May, said, “When couples are committed to each other and love each other” they should have “the same sort of rights that everyone has.”

Ms. McCain, a blogger and author, has said it is unhealthy for members of political families to paper over disagreements on issues of social justice merely to project an image of harmony. “Wives and children should be able to speak their piece,” she said in a television interview last year. “I think it shows healthy dynamics within a family. We shouldn’t all think one way, and think one thing.”

Barbara Bush, who started a nonprofit group focused on global health, rarely speaks out on American political issues, making her foray into the same-sex marriage debate so striking. But for years, those close to her say, she has surrounded herself with gay friends — at Yale, where she was an undergraduate, and in New York City, where she worked in the design world.

C. Brian Smith, a friend from college who is gay, recalled that the Yale Ms. Bush inhabited was filled with openly gay students and unbothered by questions about sexuality. “She had that mind-set,” he said. “She was loved by the gay community at Yale.”

Members of the Bush family seemed uneager to discuss her entry into the marriage debate. Ms. Bush declined an interview request. A spokesman for Mr. Bush said he had no comment. Her sister, Jenna Bush Hager, a correspondent for “Today,” has not publicly discussed the topic.
The Human Rights Campaign, a national gay rights group that made the video, plans to show it Saturday at an annual gala in New York City. Advocates said it would show elected officials and voters that, in many cases, young people are not following in their parents’ ideological footsteps.

“No matter what party they belong to, young Americans believe in basic fairness and equality,” said Brian Ellner, who is overseeing the Human Rights Campaign’s bid to legalize same-sex marriage in New York.
 

HAL9000

Lifer
Oct 17, 2010
22,021
3
76
Good! Same sex marriage should be legal the world over, We have civil partnership which is a step in the right direction but it should be marriage.
 

Skitzer

Diamond Member
Mar 20, 2000
4,414
3
81
Good! Same sex marriage should be legal the world over, Your opinion
We have civil partnership which is a step in the right direction but it should be marriage. Your opinion

Your opinions are not shared by everyone.
My opinion? Civil partnerships are sufficient and make the union legal in the eyes of the law.
 

HAL9000

Lifer
Oct 17, 2010
22,021
3
76
Your opinions are not shared by everyone.
My opinion? Civil partnerships are sufficient and make the union legal in the eyes of the law.

i'm sorry did you confuse what I was saying as fact then need to translate it for everyone, of course it is my opinion, everything I say is my opinion, everything you say is your opinion unless either of us have access to some higher truth that I'm not aware of,

Everything is an opinion or theory except pure logic like maths, I know it's an opinion, it's obvious.

Sigh...
 

werepossum

Elite Member
Jul 10, 2006
29,873
463
126
Your opinions are not shared by everyone.
My opinion? Civil partnerships are sufficient and make the union legal in the eyes of the law.
If gays are offered only civil unions then government should offer only civil unions to all, with marriage being a matter between couple and church. Otherwise there are two bodies of law which inevitably diverge, will be subject to continuous lobbying and political maneuvering, and as with segregation will never truly be equal. Government should never be given the power to determine what legal arrangements two (or more, what the hell) consenting adults of sound mind choose to make to order their own private lives for the pursuit of happiness.

In other words, if you're as sick of gays whining about discrimination as am I, the obvious solution is to end government discrimination, not modify it. Join Dick Cheney, support gay marriage and smaller, less intrusive government.
 

HAL9000

Lifer
Oct 17, 2010
22,021
3
76
If gays are offered only civil unions then government should offer only civil unions to all, with marriage being a matter between couple and church. Otherwise there are two bodies of law which inevitably diverge, will be subject to continuous lobbying and political maneuvering, and as with segregation will never truly be equal. Government should never be given the power to determine what legal arrangements two (or more, what the hell) consenting adults of sound mind choose to make to order their own private lives for the pursuit of happiness.

In other words, if you're as sick of gays whining about discrimination as am I, the obvious solution is to end government discrimination, not modify it. Join Dick Cheney, support gay marriage and smaller, less intrusive government.

I like this thinking, the Church shouldn't have it's values in law, that's the way I'm sure that America was set up.
 

ShawnD1

Lifer
May 24, 2003
15,987
2
81
Good! Same sex marriage should be legal the world over, We have civil partnership which is a step in the right direction but it should be marriage.

Marriage doesn't even need to exist now that "common law" marriage applies. Common law is when you live with your girlfriend for a year, she dumps you, and somehow she's entitled to half your stuff even though you were never really married.

So yeah. Since marriage is a redundant form of common law, all marriage should no longer be recognized by the government. People can still have large celebrations and hang out at church, but there shouldn't be any legal documents to sign.
 

CADsortaGUY

Lifer
Oct 19, 2001
25,162
1
76
www.ShawCAD.com
If gays are offered only civil unions then government should offer only civil unions to all, with marriage being a matter between couple and church. Otherwise there are two bodies of law which inevitably diverge, will be subject to continuous lobbying and political maneuvering, and as with segregation will never truly be equal. Government should never be given the power to determine what legal arrangements two (or more, what the hell) consenting adults of sound mind choose to make to order their own private lives for the pursuit of happiness.

In other words, if you're as sick of gays whining about discrimination as am I, the obvious solution is to end government discrimination, not modify it. Join Dick Cheney, support gay marriage and smaller, less intrusive government.

A smaller less intrusive gov't wouldn't be adding more special "protections" to small groups like this. If it really is an issue(which it really isn't) the gov't should stop being involved in "marriage" all together and only recognize legal contracts. "marriage" can be left to the church and other institutions and the small whining groups can STFU and quit asking for special protections/status.
 

DesiPower

Lifer
Nov 22, 2008
15,299
740
126
Good! Same sex marriage should be legal the world over, We have civil partnership which is a step in the right direction but it should be marriage.

Agreed, as long as the priests are not forced to do it. Find the ones that are willing to do so... they too should have the freedom to practice according to their own beliefs. Take that clause out and I don't have any problem with it...
 

Phokus

Lifer
Nov 20, 1999
22,994
779
126
A smaller less intrusive gov't wouldn't be adding more special "protections" to small groups like this. If it really is an issue(which it really isn't) the gov't should stop being involved in "marriage" all together and only recognize legal contracts. "marriage" can be left to the church and other institutions and the small whining groups can STFU and quit asking for special protections/status.

Funny how you phrase it like that rather than recognizing the majority has a special government sanctioned privilege.
 

xj0hnx

Diamond Member
Dec 18, 2007
9,262
3
76
The government should have nothing to do with marriage, especially telling adults who they can, or can not marry.
 

Moonbeam

Elite Member
Nov 24, 1999
74,823
6,780
126
i'm sorry did you confuse what I was saying as fact then need to translate it for everyone, of course it is my opinion, everything I say is my opinion, everything you say is your opinion unless either of us have access to some higher truth that I'm not aware of,

Everything is an opinion or theory except pure logic like maths, I know it's an opinion, it's obvious.

Sigh...

Not really. Your opinion was an intelligent and open minded one full of sound logic and human compassion. The opinions of folk like Skitzer and CAD are full of moronic unexamined bigotry. They are not so much opinions as inculcated hatred beaten into them by bigots of the various fundamentalist Christian faiths derived from the opinions of other simpleton bigots and are regurgitated on command by environmental triggers. The holders of these kinds of bigoted garbage are quite brain dead and unable to effect meaningful and corrective introspection. They are just walking sewers out of which bigotry pours. You may take this to the bank as truth from a higher source.
 

Perknose

Forum Director & Omnipotent Overlord
Forum Director
Oct 9, 1999
46,894
10,720
147
A smaller less intrusive gov't wouldn't be adding more special "protections" to small groups like this. If it really is an issue(which it really isn't) the gov't should stop being involved in "marriage" all together and only recognize legal contracts. "marriage" can be left to the church and other institutions and the small whining groups can STFU and quit asking for special protections/status.

Bigotry reeks out of your pores and stains this page, not that you'd ever admit it. You are as dishonest as you are persistent. Barbara Bush has something to say to you:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=-iKqr230U9M
 

Scotteq

Diamond Member
Apr 10, 2008
5,276
5
0
The government should have nothing to do with marriage, especially telling adults who they can, or can not marry.


This


If you aren't the one getting married, then it's none of your business.
 

techs

Lifer
Sep 26, 2000
28,559
4
0
Is it just me, or does anyone else want to have sex with her and her girlfriend?
 

Lemon law

Lifer
Nov 6, 2005
20,984
3
0
To some extent the problem with civil Unions is the court is too reminded of Jim Crow separate but equal crapola.

But to correct the understanding a few totally confused people, even the opposite sex marriages held so dear to the vast number of us in the USA is still a state sanctioned
document. A Divorced catholic may not be able to get another church sanctioned marriage celebrated in his own church, but can marry within or outside of his religion in any civil court in the land just to pick an example. A church cannot dissolve a marriage, only the State Court system can. And a marriage gives the other partner powerful civil rights and obligations that promote social stability. A church can bestow or withhold its blessing on a "legal" marriage, and nothing more. But in the USA, what is a "legal marriage" is something for States and the Federal government to define.
 

Scotteq

Diamond Member
Apr 10, 2008
5,276
5
0
Same with Religion


The difference is (in the USA, anyhow), a Religion can't do anything about it. One may simply walk down the street to a different Church/Synagogue/Temple and make arrangements there.

Try that with "The State", and see how far it gets you.
 

Moonbeam

Elite Member
Nov 24, 1999
74,823
6,780
126
Can you imagine what these imbeciles who say the gov should stay out of marriage would be saying if there were no gay issue and the gov did announce it was getting out of the marriage business? HAHAHAHAHAHAHA, you lying fucks, the gov shouldn't be involved with marriage when your bigotry is under attack and at no other time.
 

BoberFett

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
37,562
9
81
Can you imagine what these imbeciles who say the gov should stay out of marriage would be saying if there were no gay issue and the gov did announce it was getting out of the marriage business? HAHAHAHAHAHAHA, you lying fucks, the gov shouldn't be involved with marriage when your bigotry is under attack and at no other time.

Project much?

It's OK Loonbeam, we know you're a bigot and still love you anyway.