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K8N Diamond - 4GB RAM only running at 333MHz?!

A

AthlonAlien

Senior member
I was building a PC at work for a customer and ran into a snag. It's a MSI K8N Platinum Plus, Athlon 64 X2 4800+, 4GB PC3200 RAM, and a MSI GeForce 7900GTX. The system is running 4 x 1GB chips. I did successfully enable to MemoryHole option in BIOS to enable the entire 4GB of RAM... However, my problem is, I can only get the RAM to run at 333MHz. The chip is a Rev E6, so I think it is capable of running 4 x DIMMS at 400MHz (2T of course). I understand it won't do 1T with 4 DIMMS and that's fine... but even at 2T it will NOT go above 333MHz. I even pulled out 2 DIMMS (which left 2 x 1GB = 2GB in the PC) and it would still only goto 333MHz. When I pulled 1 more DIMM out (now total of 1 x 1GB in PC) it finally went to 400MHz?! This is killing me... I know this isn't a DFI board, but I was hoping someone may have some idea? MSI's site doesn't have a BIOS manual download for it... I am gonna install Windows today and do the LiveUpdate thing to check for possible BIOS updates (however the board is brand new).

NOTE - I just looked in the book, and it says when using Double-Sided memory sticks the board will only do 400MHz with 1 stick installed. When 2-4 sticks if Double-Sided memory is installed, only 333MHz is possible?!?! AAHH!! Can this be true? I have 2 x 1GB of OCZ (double sided) in my DFI board and 400MHz is no problem at all Is this just a limitation of the MSI board? Any ideas would be greatly appreciated...

-Thanks
 
Okay, I just got back to work and re-read the book... It is possible to get 400MHz with 2 DS DIMMs (I previously stated 1)... The slots are just a little different on this motherboard (on the DFI, you match Orange and Yellow... or this one you match first 2 (Blue and Purple) and last 2 (Blue and Purle)... So now I successfully have 2 x 1GB = 2GB in the PC running at 400MHz... I still can't get 4 double sided DIMMs to run at 400MHz... is this even possible on any board? I know DFI's can run 4 x DIMMs at 400MHz 2T, but maybe that is only for 4 single sided DIMMs (and not 4 double sided DIMMs)?!
 
As load on common bus signals increases, signal quality decreases, and thus feasible signal frequency decreases too. Laws of physics ...

DDR RAM (on unbuffered DIMMs) is calculated for one DIMM at 200 MHz, two at 166, three at 133 - per channel of course. (Note: True MHz, not marketing doubled DDR figures.)

So what you observe is perfectly normal. The specification being made for the full range of temperatures and voltages, your individual setup might leave you some headroom to go beyond - but that'll be YMMV territory.
 
have you tried leaving it at 333 but raising the FSB to 240 ( drop the HT multi to 4 and cpu mulit to 10 )

that should force the ram to 200 ( even if the POST screen says 333 ) so you can see if it will actually run stable with 4 sticks at that speed
 
IT is sad case, But there is another post that someone said he can run them @DDR400 at 1T I think.....trying to ask him for his setting but no reply yet.
 
Originally posted by: Ivan05
This is a limitation of the A64 memory controller.
Click to expand...

*sigh*

No it is not. It is a limitation of the physical properties of high speed signalling vs. parasitic capacitance.

Like I've said already, the DDR DIMM standards are defined and calculated for one (!) DIMM at 200 MHz, two at 166, three at 133 - per channel. Using single-sided DIMMs gives a bit of headroom.

AMD64 processor rev. E adds some more headroom above this common specification. Still, running two double-sided DIMMs per channel at 200 MHz is DEEPLY in YMMV territory.
 
It might LET you do it. That doesn't mean it actually WORKS in the entire range of allowed voltages and temperatures.

Narrower environmental parameters might add headroom as well - but if you want TRULY reliable, you better stay with what the JEDEC has calculated to be safe and sound.

Real life performance loss isn't that big anyway - AMD64 is pretty good at caching and buffering.
 
RESOLVED!!

I updated to the 3.0A Beta BIOS (just released on 3/21/06) and the problem has been fixed. I am now running 4GB (4 x 1GB double-sided) at 400MHz (2T of course 🙂 )
 
Originally posted by: AthlonAlien
RESOLVED!!

I updated to the 3.0A Beta BIOS (just released on 3/21/06) and the problem has been fixed. I am now running 4GB (4 x 1GB double-sided) at 400MHz (2T of course 🙂 )
Click to expand...

Time for a visit to www.memtest.org , a download, and an overnight test - best done at elevated RAM temperature.
 
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