K.T. McFarland told transition team that Russia "has just thrown the U.S. election" to Trump

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Jaskalas

Jaskalas

Lifer
Jun 23, 2004
33,440
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The report notes that its unclear what McFarland truly meant by the comment, but White House lawyer dismissed the remark as being a nod to how Democrats were portraying the election result.
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It's not clear why she said that. Should Mueller's team interview her on this? Seems legit to at least put her on record.
 
I

interchange

Diamond Member
Oct 10, 1999
8,017
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It seems to me plenty likely that neither Trump nor his team directly colluded with Russia, however it also seems quite a lot more evident that Trump's team was working on Russia relations secretly and contrarily to the sitting administration, knew about Russia's interference in the election at the time, publicly denied it and failed to investigate it after it was publicly known, tried to halt any investigations separate from the administration, failed to implement sanctions passed by congress, and continue to lie lie lie about all of it.

This is hideous and only partisan politicking will have a chance to keep things afloat. Personally, I'm disgusted by Congressional Republicans who are putting party ahead of country.
 
HomerJS

HomerJS

Lifer
Feb 6, 2002
36,052
27,783
136
interchange said:
It seems to me plenty likely that neither Trump nor his team directly colluded with Russia, however it also seems quite a lot more evident that Trump's team was working on Russia relations secretly and contrarily to the sitting administration, knew about Russia's interference in the election at the time, publicly denied it and failed to investigate it after it was publicly known, tried to halt any investigations separate from the administration, failed to implement sanctions passed by congress, and continue to lie lie lie about all of it.

This is hideous and only partisan politicking will have a chance to keep things afloat. Personally, I'm disgusted by Congressional Republicans who are putting party ahead of country.
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Trump asked the Russians in public to hack the Democrats and that is what happened. Sounds like collusion to me.
 
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ivwshane

ivwshane

Lifer
May 15, 2000
32,219
14,906
136
interchange said:
It seems to me plenty likely that neither Trump nor his team directly colluded with Russia, however it also seems quite a lot more evident that Trump's team was working on Russia relations secretly and contrarily to the sitting administration, knew about Russia's interference in the election at the time, publicly denied it and failed to investigate it after it was publicly known, tried to halt any investigations separate from the administration, failed to implement sanctions passed by congress, and continue to lie lie lie about all of it.

This is hideous and only partisan politicking will have a chance to keep things afloat. Personally, I'm disgusted by Congressional Republicans who are putting party ahead of country.
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That's an odd claim to make when one of the actual pieces of evidence that is public and verified, is an email exchange between trump campaign officials and Russian contacts about providing their team with dirt on his opponent.

There is indeed evidence that the trump campaign colluded with Russia. This shouldn't even be disputed.
 
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I

interchange

Diamond Member
Oct 10, 1999
8,017
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ivwshane said:
That's an odd claim to make when one of the actual pieces of evidence that is public and verified, is an email exchange between trump campaign officials and Russian contacts about providing their team with dirt on his opponent.

There is indeed evidence that the trump campaign colluded with Russia. This shouldn't even be disputed.
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Which email indicates that dirt was provided?

I don't think it really matters, though. Either they were working directly together or the administration simply took advantage of activities Russia was doing independently within their awareness for which they have tried to conceal. Either is conspiracy against US interest and should (rationally and ethically) have already killed the Trump administration.
 
J

Jhhnn

IN MEMORIAM
Nov 11, 1999
62,365
14,681
136
interchange said:
Which email indicates that dirt was provided?
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All of the DNC & Podesta emails hacked by Russians & released through Wikileaks. There's also the minor matter of them leading an army of trolls & bots to lynch the evil Hillary. The Trump campaign rebroadcast their stuff willingly.

http://www.philly.com/philly/news/p...nts-trump-election-jenna-abrams-20171103.html

Putin loves what Trump does for America, bet on that. It's amazing that all too many Americans seem to like it, too...
 
MomentsofSanity

MomentsofSanity

Lifer
Jan 25, 2011
16,589
8,671
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Puffnstuff said:
Did you even read what you said? You claim that Russia is not an enemy state which is purely false.
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I'm sorry but you're purely wrong. Treason requires a declaration of war or open war against an adversary. That does not exist with Russia. Remember the Rosenbergs? There's a reason they were tried for espionage, not treason, while giving secrets to Russia. It isn't treason. Russia is a strategic adversary.

Again treason is very narrowly defined in the constitution. You're mistaken.
 
Puffnstuff

Puffnstuff

Lifer
Mar 9, 2005
16,029
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T

tweaker2

Lifer
Aug 5, 2000
14,531
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The real criminals here are the Repubs in Congress who are doing everything they can to stall all things Russia related until they can complete their job of sticking it to the working class good and proper.

Trump would already be impeached if he were a Democrat.

edit - If not for Mueller and his team we'd be nowhere as far as seeking some kind of justice against those assholes in the Trump cabal.
 
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MomentsofSanity

MomentsofSanity

Lifer
Jan 25, 2011
16,589
8,671
146
Puffnstuff said:
Try again. This is straight from Merriam-Webster: https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/treason

Definition of treason
1 : the offense of attempting by overt acts to overthrow the government of the state to which the offender owes allegiance or to kill or personally injure the sovereign or the sovereign's family
2 : the betrayal of a trust : treachery
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You realize how a word is defined in language has no bearing on how the crime is defined in law right? Here read this.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opin....html?tid=ss_tw-bottom&utm_term=.cef50cae36e3
 
J

Jhhnn

IN MEMORIAM
Nov 11, 1999
62,365
14,681
136
tweaker2 said:
The real criminals here are the Repubs in Congress who are doing everything they can to stall all things Russia related until they can complete their job of sticking it to the working class good and proper.

Trump would already be impeached if he were a Democrat.
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It needs to be understood that Trumpism is really a revolt against traditional Repub leadership. They think Trump is somehow different, that he's somehow not a member of the Repub lootocracy. How they came to that conclusion is the result of astounding con artistry. It really is. Even now, as they're starting to catch on, they think that Dems are worse. That's a product of bamboozling right wing agitprop applied relentlessly for decades.

It's fine for Trump to be prez from their perspective. He commands the base & keeps their heads nicely irrational. He'll sign anything they send him. It distracts the media from really drilling down into what they're trying to accomplish which is to put the country in the hands of an insurgent plutocracy. They'll render govt & the will of the people impotent if they can.
 
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MomentsofSanity

MomentsofSanity

Lifer
Jan 25, 2011
16,589
8,671
146
Puffnstuff said:
No it doesn't require a war to be valid.

https://legal-dictionary.thefreedictionary.com/treason
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From your own link. They even give the exact example I did. It's almost word for word what I've been saying.

The Treason Clause applies only to disloyal acts committed during times of war. Acts of dis-loyalty during peacetime are not considered treasonous under the Constitution. Nor do acts of Espionage committed on behalf of an ally constitute treason. For example, julius and ethel rosenberg were convicted of espionage, in 1951, for helping the Soviet Union steal atomic secrets from the United States during World War II. The Rosenbergs were not tried for treason because the United States and the Soviet Union were allies during World War II.
 
T

tweaker2

Lifer
Aug 5, 2000
14,531
6,964
136
Jhhnn said:
It needs to be understood that Trumpism is really a revolt against traditional Repub leadership. They think Trump is somehow different, that he's somehow not a member of the Repub lootocracy. How they came to that conclusion is the result of astounding con artistry. It really is. Even now, as they're starting to catch on, they think that Dems are worse. That's a product of bamboozling right wing agitprop applied relentlessly for decades.

It's fine for Trump to be prez from their perspective. He commands the base & keeps their heads nicely irrational. He'll sign anything they send him. It distracts the media from really drilling down into what they're trying to accomplish which is to put the country in the hands of an insurgent plutocracy. They'll render govt & the will of the people impotent if they can.
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Totally agree with you on this. And here's some news for what the Repubs have in store for the middle class and the poor in the near future. This tax cut scam is just for starters. They may not accomplish this, but their intent is all too clear.

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/12/02/us/politics/tax-cuts-republicans-entitlements-medicare-social-security.html?rref=collection/byline/kate-zernike&action=click&contentCollection=undefined&region=stream&module=stream_unit&version=latest&contentPlacement=1&pgtype=collection
 
Younigue

Younigue

Diamond Member
Feb 5, 2017
5,888
1,446
106
Jhhnn said:
It needs to be understood that Trumpism is really a revolt against traditional Repub leadership. They think Trump is somehow different, that he's somehow not a member of the Repub lootocracy. How they came to that conclusion is the result of astounding con artistry. It really is. Even now, as they're starting to catch on, they think that Dems are worse. That's a product of bamboozling right wing agitprop applied relentlessly for decades.

It's fine for Trump to be prez from their perspective. He commands the base & keeps their heads nicely irrational. He'll sign anything they send him. It distracts the media from really drilling down into what they're trying to accomplish which is to put the country in the hands of an insurgent plutocracy. They'll render govt & the will of the people impotent if they can.
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Trump is different alright. He's more evil than Republicans realized. More evil than House Republicans ever thought possible they could get away with. Yet Trump is and they have gleefully joined him because he's also shown them consequences (if there are any) be damned, they needn't bother with taking responsibility or accountability. No Party should lower themselves to that standard but the House Republicans have done it unapologetically with knowing smiles on their faces, winks, nudges and nods and finally feeling something after lordy knows how long, tingling in their junk. They'd doom us all just for that bit of sensation, Trump's gifting them even more than that. Greed, sociopathy and perversion of governance rule the House and it's scary as hell.
 
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