Just Curious... how much has the illegal problem in California has contributed to their economic fall out?

OutHouse

Lifer
Jun 5, 2000
36,410
616
126
im just curious. i dont live in cali but i hear about and have read about the big money problem they are having out there. and i got to thinking. cali is pretty liberal with paying and enabling illegals to live in the state. how much money does the state of cali pay out in social serives that directly benifits illegals? you know things like public schools. thousands of government forms printed in spanish, healthcare....


what would happen if Conan raised is sword of power and said with a mighty voice. NO MORE!
 

BoomerD

No Lifer
Feb 26, 2006
65,984
14,380
146
It's not politically correct to ask such questions...:roll:

Pete Wilson found out pretty quickly how bad the fallout from trying to stop providing government services to the illegals can be...

Prop 187, which was actually popular with the citizens of the state, was quickly overturned by the courts as unconstitutional...


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/C...Proposition_187_(1994)
 

ProfJohn

Lifer
Jul 28, 2006
18,161
7
0
It depends on whether illegals have a net positive or negative effect on the Cali economy.

Yes the collect lots of social services, but they also pay taxes and provide jobs and services to the economy.

And since they are illegal I would guess that a lot of them don't file tax returns and thus over pay on income taxes.

Maybe one of our Cali posters has seen some reports or studies on this and knows for a fact how much they help or hurt the Cali economy and government.
 

Vette73

Lifer
Jul 5, 2000
21,503
9
0
Originally posted by: ProfJohn
It depends on whether illegals have a net positive or negative effect on the Cali economy.

Yes the collect lots of social services, but they also pay taxes and provide jobs and services to the economy.

And since they are illegal I would guess that a lot of them don't file tax returns and thus over pay on income taxes.

Maybe one of our Cali posters has seen some reports or studies on this and knows for a fact how much they help or hurt the Cali economy and government.

No a lot of them get paid under the table and others use fake SS numbers and under pay and in some cases check the "exempt" box on the tax form.
Thats how a lot of people find out about their SS number being used as the IRS comes after the real SS number owner.
 

AAjax

Diamond Member
Feb 17, 2001
3,798
0
0
Originally posted by: ProfJohn
It depends on whether illegals have a net positive or negative effect on the Cali economy.

Yes the collect lots of social services, but they also pay taxes and provide jobs and services to the economy.

And since they are illegal I would guess that a lot of them don't file tax returns and thus over pay on income taxes.

Maybe one of our Cali posters has seen some reports or studies on this and knows for a fact how much they help or hurt the Cali economy and government.

I always wondered where this overpayment or payment of taxes came from. Most Illegals take their pay in cash with no withholding, completely off the books. Sure they pay sales tax and such but it would seem that isnt very much (even in CA)
 

MovingTarget

Diamond Member
Jun 22, 2003
9,002
115
106
Originally posted by: piasabird
People in California like slaves.

Yeah, them Okies aren't as cheap as the used to be! :p

So, lets see....

Drain on law enforcement: check
Depress wages in job markets: check
Fewer opportunities for citizens and legal immigrants: check
Drain on public services and infrastructure: check
Increase in fraud over taxes (from SS fraud): check

I'd say they are a drain. California is being overrun at this point. Too bad it has become too much of a feel-good political hot potato for the government to actually DO anything about it.
 

MovingTarget

Diamond Member
Jun 22, 2003
9,002
115
106
Originally posted by: Jaskalas
Originally posted by: piasabird
People in California like slaves.

Do we get to have a civil war to free these slaves?

Well, it would be a perfectly legitimate function of our government to "free" them back to Mexico. Does that count?
 

compuwiz1

Admin Emeritus Elite Member
Oct 9, 1999
27,112
930
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Pssst, the illegals are not just in California. This is an everywhere problem.
 

dahunan

Lifer
Jan 10, 2002
18,191
3
0
NO car insurance
No health insurance
They might pay rent... but it is 5x the amount of people reccomended for the homes
They don't spend much money here.. many of them send it home to family there

Report: Fed program helps illegal immigrants send money home
http://blogs.usatoday.com/onde...2/even_as_the_fed.html
Buzz up!Like this story? Share it with Yahoo! Buzz
"Even as the federal government is starting to crack down on companies that hire illegal immigrants, it's been helping those same workers send money home, cheap," The Los Angeles Times writes today.

The Times reports that Directo a México, a service sponsored by the Federal Reserve, "allows customers without Social Security numbers to wire money through the Fed system to Mexico's central bank at little cost."

And in September, according to the Times, "the Fed expanded the remittance program by allowing immigrants, legal or not, to open accounts at participating banks and credit unions in the U.S. or Mexico. About 27,000 transfers are made through the program each month."

This follows the news from earlier this month that Bank of America, as well as some other financial institutions, had begun offering credit cards to customers who do not have Social Security numbers. Many are illegal immigrants.

 

BoomerD

No Lifer
Feb 26, 2006
65,984
14,380
146
Remittances from the USA are (or were until the meltdown) the NUMBER 2 source of income for Mexico...right after their oil industry.
 

Jiggz

Diamond Member
Mar 10, 2001
4,329
0
76
Originally posted by: Citrix
im just curious. i dont live in cali but i hear about and have read about the big money problem they are having out there. and i got to thinking. cali is pretty liberal with paying and enabling illegals to live in the state. how much money does the state of cali pay out in social serives that directly benifits illegals? you know things like public schools. thousands of government forms printed in spanish, healthcare....


what would happen if Conan raised is sword of power and said with a mighty voice. NO MORE!

You think this is bad? Kaliforneeya is the model society of US liberalism. Unlimited number of social programs with very limited funding, who would rather increase taxes instead of cutting social programs - Socialism at its core!
 

Pneumothorax

Golden Member
Nov 4, 2002
1,181
23
81
yup our F@#$STICK legislature and Ahhnold the Democrat in Repub clothing, is planning on increasing taxes by $14+BILLION in a recession!!! Gotta love our goddamm liberal state. This is what I call a stimulus. Ha, and we even get some dough from the federal stimulus pkg it will go to reduce the CUTS instead of reducing the taxes. I love the stupid puppet in sacramento claiming "These taxes are just temporary and will be removed in 2 years" I'll bet my left nut that these taxes will be with us in the next decade. Can we recall the whole legislature in california?
 

Schadenfroh

Elite Member
Mar 8, 2003
38,416
4
0
Originally posted by: Jaskalas
Originally posted by: piasabird
People in California like slaves.

Do we get to have a civil war to free these slaves?

If I could save California without deporting any illegal, I would do it; and if I could save it by deporting all illegals, I would do it; and if I could do it by deporting some and leaving others alone, I would also do that
 

boomerang

Lifer
Jun 19, 2000
18,883
641
126
Originally posted by: MovingTarget
Originally posted by: piasabird
People in California like slaves.

Yeah, them Okies aren't as cheap as the used to be! :p

So, lets see....

Drain on law enforcement: check
Depress wages in job markets: check
Fewer opportunities for citizens and legal immigrants: check
Drain on public services and infrastructure: check
Increase in fraud over taxes (from SS fraud): check

I'd say they are a drain. California is being overrun at this point. Too bad it has become too much of a feel-good political hot potato for the government to actually DO anything about it.
You forgot the most important one.

Pelosi sees no problem with any of it and would like to see the entire U.S. sharing the burden: check
 

BoomerD

No Lifer
Feb 26, 2006
65,984
14,380
146
I find this little story in the news this a.m.:

http://www.news10.net/news/loc...ory.aspx?storyid=54697

SACRAMENTO, CA - With a $55 million budget deficit staring them in the face, the Sacramento County Board of Supervisors began slicing away health care programs Wednesday.

The largest item on the chopping block was the estimated $2.4 million annual cost of providing non-urgent health care to illegal immigrants.

"There are no good choices at this point. Everything (that is cut) is going to hurt someone," said Sacramento County 4th District Supervisor Roberta MacGlashan.

She is one of three supervisors who voted in favor of cutting health care for undocumented immigrants with two voted against.

"No one wants to make these cuts," MacGlashan said. "They're very painful."

She said the cut on health services for illegal immigrants will go into effect shortly. It will need to be supplemented by a program to identify who, among those entering public health care clinics, is a legal citizen eligible for services. That program is expected to cost $500,000 a year.

The ACLU opposes the measure, saying it is unconstitutional and a "bad policy."

"It's much more cost-effective to treat people when they're not in urgent situations," said ACLU spokesman Allen Asch. "It costs a lot more money if they get sicker and go to the emergency rooms."

Asch said the ACLU is pondering legal action against Sacramento County following Wednesday's budget cuts.

On March 3, the Board of Supervisors will reconvene to discuss possible cuts to public safety.



I usually support the ACLU, even when I disagree with the cause they're fighting for, but in this case, not only do I NOT agree with the cause, I don't see where there's a constitutional issue.
Illegals should NOT be eligible for one thin dime's worth of government services. Let THEIR government fund their health care.
 

Socio

Golden Member
May 19, 2002
1,732
2
81
Originally posted by: Schadenfroh
Originally posted by: Jaskalas
Originally posted by: piasabird
People in California like slaves.

Do we get to have a civil war to free these slaves?

If I could save California without deporting any illegal, I would do it; and if I could save it by deporting all illegals, I would do it; and if I could do it by deporting some and leaving others alone, I would also do that

Them leaving might not be a choice;

If the job loss rate continues to drop I expect that the US is going to get real ugly for illegal's. When they become desperate enough unemployed Americans will want the jobs the illegal are currently are occupying so they can put food on the table for their families.

It will be no more looking the other way, it will be full scale persecution.
 

wwswimming

Banned
Jan 21, 2006
3,695
1
0
Originally posted by: Citrixwhat would happen if Conan raised is sword of power and said with a mighty voice. NO MORE!

the food would rot in the fields and the trucks would have much less food to deliver
to the stores.

watch the "illegals" work for 5 minutes on a hot day and it might change your
perspective. they bust their asses doing work that most Americans are too
spoiled to do.

i've lived around the "illegals" for about 30 years and i have no problem with
them. 2 of my 4 neighbors are "illegals" and they are good neighbors - quiet,
help pitch in taking care of the building, etc.
 

compuwiz1

Admin Emeritus Elite Member
Oct 9, 1999
27,112
930
126
Originally posted by: BoomerD
I find this little story in the news this a.m.:

http://www.news10.net/news/loc...ory.aspx?storyid=54697

SACRAMENTO, CA - With a $55 million budget deficit staring them in the face, the Sacramento County Board of Supervisors began slicing away health care programs Wednesday.

The largest item on the chopping block was the estimated $2.4 million annual cost of providing non-urgent health care to illegal immigrants.

"There are no good choices at this point. Everything (that is cut) is going to hurt someone," said Sacramento County 4th District Supervisor Roberta MacGlashan.

She is one of three supervisors who voted in favor of cutting health care for undocumented immigrants with two voted against.

"No one wants to make these cuts," MacGlashan said. "They're very painful."

She said the cut on health services for illegal immigrants will go into effect shortly. It will need to be supplemented by a program to identify who, among those entering public health care clinics, is a legal citizen eligible for services. That program is expected to cost $500,000 a year.

The ACLU opposes the measure, saying it is unconstitutional and a "bad policy."

"It's much more cost-effective to treat people when they're not in urgent situations," said ACLU spokesman Allen Asch. "It costs a lot more money if they get sicker and go to the emergency rooms."

Asch said the ACLU is pondering legal action against Sacramento County following Wednesday's budget cuts.

On March 3, the Board of Supervisors will reconvene to discuss possible cuts to public safety.



I usually support the ACLU, even when I disagree with the cause they're fighting for, but in this case, not only do I NOT agree with the cause, I don't see where there's a constitutional issue.
Illegals should NOT be eligible for one thin dime's worth of government services. Let THEIR government fund their health care.

Why can't we get this country to a point where if someone who is an illegal comes in for a government service someone simply picks up that phone and has that person arrested and deported? Why do we have to provide services to people who are not supposed to be here? I hope this administration will put their foot down. Back when we called it the INS, you'd see these green cars and trucks raid the taco stands around here almost everyday. Now it seems everyone just turns a blind eye. The reason people continue to sneak into this country is because they can do so with relative impunity. If there were dire consequences, if caught, I think it would at least make people think more and not be so fast to cross the border.

 

Jaskalas

Lifer
Jun 23, 2004
35,455
9,677
136
Originally posted by: wwswimming
Originally posted by: Citrixwhat would happen if Conan raised is sword of power and said with a mighty voice. NO MORE!

the food would rot in the fields and the trucks would have much less food to deliver
to the stores.

Sounds like ten million new American jobs.