Julius Caesar quote we should all read (oh well it's fake)

[thomsbrain]

edit: it's fake, oh well. it had me all excited and everything.

"Beware the leader who bangs the drums of war in order to whip the citizenry into a patriotic fervor, for patriotism is indeed a double-edged sword. It both emboldens the blood, just as it narrows the mind. And when the drums of war have reached a fever pitch and the blood boils with hate and the mind has closed, the leader will have no need in seizing the rights of the citizenry. Rather, the citizenry, infused with fear and blinded by patriotism, will offer up all of their rights unto the leader and gladly so. How do I know? For this is what I have done. And I am Caesar."

This should be required reading for everyone who still supports Bush's war on terror.

 

[her209]

Originally posted by: thomsbrain
"Beware the leader who bangs the drums of war in order to whip the citizenry into a patriotic fervor, for patriotism is indeed a double-edged sword. It both emboldens the blood, just as it narrows the mind. And when the drums of war have reached a fever pitch and the blood boils with hate and the mind has closed, the leader will have no need in seizing the rights of the citizenry. Rather, the citizenry, infused with fear and blinded by patriotism, will offer up all of their rights unto the leader and gladly so. How do I know? For this is what I have done. And I am Caesar."

This should be required reading for everyone who still supports Bush's war on terror.

I thought that was a fake quote.

 

[Legendary]

GWB != Caesar

 

[Queasy]

I thought that was a fake quote.

It is

 

[StageLeft]

Cool quote but it doesn't mean that it should apply to this.

 

[hdeck]

i never was much of a caesar fan...

 

[thomsbrain]

Originally posted by: her209

Originally posted by: thomsbrain
"Beware the leader who bangs the drums of war in order to whip the citizenry into a patriotic fervor, for patriotism is indeed a double-edged sword. It both emboldens the blood, just as it narrows the mind. And when the drums of war have reached a fever pitch and the blood boils with hate and the mind has closed, the leader will have no need in seizing the rights of the citizenry. Rather, the citizenry, infused with fear and blinded by patriotism, will offer up all of their rights unto the leader and gladly so. How do I know? For this is what I have done. And I am Caesar."

This should be required reading for everyone who still supports Bush's war on terror.

I thought that was a fake quote.

a little research turns up just that. my bad!

 

[etech]

It really hurts whatever case you are trying to make when your quote is made up. I know that has never stopped certain people from posting these falsehoods but it isn't that hard to verify them first.

Caesar Didn't Say It; Shakespeare Didn't Write It


edit/ you all are fast, but then I had to take a phone call from when I started to reply to when I could finish my post.

 

[notfred]

Does it really matter who said it?

 

[308nato]

Pick up a biography on Caesar because you will enjoy it imensely. You will find that he was intelligent, did not know fear, was respected by his men and led from the front.

You will also not find ANYTHING about him that remotely resembles this stupid fake quote. But yeah, we should all read it anyway.

 

[0roo0roo]

yes, because a statement by a famous person becomes more valid

 

[BoberFett]

Originally posted by: notfred
Does it really matter who said it?

I could post this quote:

"How could there be any doubt that God exists?"
- Albert Einstein

I made that up and attributed it to Einstein. So I guess that makes it worthy of deep consideration.

 

[thomsbrain]

Originally posted by: 0roo0roo
yes, because a statement by a famous person becomes more valid

it's unfortunatly true

 

[thraxes]

Actually I just today read a very interesting article by some british and american historians, comparing the US to the roman empire. The more you look at it the more paralells one recognises. One main difference though is that that the romans really saw themselves as an empire whereas almost all americans strictly deny this, although the US has a worldwide cultural / economic influence not seen since the time of the Caesers. US citizens tend to shy away from the notion of bein part of an empire, one of the theories in the article said it could be because the US was founded to escape the clutches of the british empire and to become aware that one has become such an entity would undermine the coutries confidence, another theory cites the fear of being in such a lofty position: all that goes up, comes crashing back down eventually. Examples in history are all too common: Roman Empire, British Empire, to a lesser extent the Soviet Union...

This seems to be a trend, trying to identify americas position in the world by looking back in history to find a comparable parallel.

EDIT: The article wasn't a fake, it was in a current affairs magazine in the university library.

 

[notfred]

Originally posted by: BoberFett

Originally posted by: notfred
Does it really matter who said it?

I could post this quote:

"How could there be any doubt that God exists?"
- Albert Einstein

I made that up and attributed it to Einstein. So I guess that makes it worthy of deep consideration.

The "Ceasar" quote isn't noteworthy because of who said it, it's noteworthy because it makes an interesting staement. There's really nothing interesting about your "Einstein" quote.

 

[Ynog]

That may have been true, however keep this line in mind.

It both emboldens the blood, just as it narrows the mind.

We aren't under a dictatorship.

Thats why Bush went to Congress to get support.
Thats why he goes to the UN for support.
Thats why he goes to NATO for support.

No two people in this country ever agree on everything. So as much as patriotism emboldens the blood,
It no longer can completely narrow the mind. Cause for every person that supports the war on terror.
There is a tree hugging hippy that protests it. And I would say the number of idiots the blindly follow the
group supporting the war, there are about the same as the number of idiots that blindly follow the
group protesting it.

If you don't believe the war on terror is justified, I won't force you, as no one in this country will.
As you won't force me to think its not justified.

See thats the nice thing about this country. We are free to feel the way you want.
What do you think happened to the guy that said Caesar we shouldn't attack.
The same thing that happened to the Russian who questioned Stalin.

Everyone in this country is able to make an educated decision on what they want.
Thats why your Congressman does. He makes a decision he thinks is best for you.
If its not, he might not be there next election.

Also keep in mind that that they get to see evidence that you and I won't see and don't need
to see. The Iraq spy doesn't need his ID reveiled so we can know that multiple people say that
that Iraq is making weapons of mass destruction.

Plus World War I and II show us Isolationism doesn't work either.

 

[thomsbrain]

Originally posted by: thraxes
Actually I just today read a very interesting article by some british and american historians, comparing the US to the roman empire. The more you look at it the more paralells one recognises. One main difference though is that that the romans really saw themselves as an empire whereas almost all americans strictly deny this, although the US has a worldwide cultural / economic influence not seen since the time of the Caesers. US citizens tend to shy away from the notion of bein part of an empire, one of the theories in the article said it could be because the US was founded to escape the clutches of the british empire and to become aware that one has become such an entity would undermine the coutries confidence, another theory cites the fear of being in such a lofty position: all that goes up, comes crashing back down eventually. Examples in history are all too common: Roman Empire, British Empire, to a lesser extent the Soviet Union...

This seems to be a trend, trying to identify americas position in the world by looking back in history to find a comparable parallel.

Jung would have some interesting stuff to say about this too. It's a pretty clear case of a collective shadow. We project our own traits onto those of our enemies, and deny who we are as a nation.

 

[Czar]

this one is real though

"Naturally the common people don't want war: Neither in Russia, nor in England, nor for that matter in Germany. That is understood. But, after all,it is the leaders of the country who determine the policy and it is always a simple matter to drag the people along, whether it is a democracy, or a fascist dictatorship, or a parliament, or a communist dictatorship. Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked, and denounce the peacemakers for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same in any country."
--Goering at the Nuremberg Trials

 

[308nato]

Originally posted by: Czar
this one is real though

"Naturally the common people don't want war: Neither in Russia, nor in England, nor for that matter in Germany. That is understood. But, after all,it is the leaders of the country who determine the policy and it is always a simple matter to drag the people along, whether it is a democracy, or a fascist dictatorship, or a parliament, or a communist dictatorship. Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked, and denounce the peacemakers for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same in any country."
--Goering at the Nuremberg Trials

Ahhh. That intellectual pillar of philosophical might Herman (dress me in pink liederhosen please) Goering.

:disgust:

 

[thomsbrain]

Originally posted by: Ynog


We aren't under a dictatorship.

How are we not? Bush has blind support from Congress and he's free to stack the judges. No one in NATO would dare go against us, and if they did, it really wouldn't slow us down anyway. And we all know the UN is a joke. Bush is the single most powerful person in the world. He can basically do whatever he wants. If we don't agree with him, he just makes us afraid for a little while and then we're behind him again. Cazr's quote is right on the money about this.

 

[bGIveNs33]

Originally posted by: notfred

Originally posted by: BoberFett

Originally posted by: notfred
Does it really matter who said it?

I could post this quote:

"How could there be any doubt that God exists?"
- Albert Einstein

I made that up and attributed it to Einstein. So I guess that makes it worthy of deep consideration.

The "Ceasar" quote isn't noteworthy because of who said it, it's noteworthy because it makes an interesting staement. There's really nothing interesting about your "Einstein" quote.

I find it interesting.

 

[thomsbrain]

Originally posted by: bGIveNs33

Originally posted by: notfred

Originally posted by: BoberFett

Originally posted by: notfred
Does it really matter who said it?

I could post this quote:

"How could there be any doubt that God exists?"
- Albert Einstein

I made that up and attributed it to Einstein. So I guess that makes it worthy of deep consideration.

The "Ceasar" quote isn't noteworthy because of who said it, it's noteworthy because it makes an interesting staement. There's really nothing interesting about your "Einstein" quote.

I find it interesting.

but it doesn't say anything.

 

[Dragnov]

Democracy, communism, socialism, dictatorship, etc... whatever.
Just a form of government to justify our actions.

There is limited resources in the world, and each country wants to be THE super-power. (America does not want to lose that role). We are imperialists/colonists, we go out there obtaining resources we need, and we attack our enemies (sovereign nations). We think they are wrong, they think we are wrong. Conflict will always exist because as human beings we do not want to be equal, we want to be the BEST.

 

[BDawg]

The above quote doesn't have to be Julius Ceaser (who btw makes a great salad and orange smoothie) to be valid.

 

[BoberFett]

Originally posted by: notfred

Originally posted by: BoberFett

Originally posted by: notfred
Does it really matter who said it?

I could post this quote:

"How could there be any doubt that God exists?"
- Albert Einstein

I made that up and attributed it to Einstein. So I guess that makes it worthy of deep consideration.

The "Ceasar" quote isn't noteworthy because of who said it, it's noteworthy because it makes an interesting staement. There's really nothing interesting about your "Einstein" quote.

The "Caesar" quote is only interesting to you because you already agree with it, and feel other people should to. The "Einstein" quote isn't interesting to you because you've already decided you don't agree with it.

This is the horoscope principle at work. You find that things which agree with you to be amazing coincidences and ignore the rest.