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John Stewart's Zinger Last Night

Carmen813

Diamond Member
May 18, 2007
3,189
0
76
I nearly choked on my glass of water, my wife and I were cracking up.

You can view what I'm talking about at Dailyshow.com, watch the clip titled "Michele Obama's Patriotism"

Anyway I thought it was an interesting point, why are dems constantly forced to 'prove' their patriotism while its automatically assumed for republicans?

*EDIT* The line I'm referring to is around the 4:10 mark.
 

nageov3t

Lifer
Feb 18, 2004
42,816
83
91
why are dems constantly forced to 'prove' their patriotism while its automatically assumed for republicans?
because as long as the baby boomers are in power, we're going to be perpetually stuck in the 1960's.
 

jonks

Lifer
Feb 7, 2005
13,918
18
81
Because of lefty posters like [deleted] and [deleted] who cackle with glee every time the US does something remotely questionable or gets caught in a bad situation. The hard righties like [deleted] and [deleted] stick by the US no matter how crappy we are and they defend every action no matter how cruel or illegal. Both extremes are equally pathetic, but one of the extremes sides with the US no matter what and the other side criticizes the US no matter what.

The fervor decreases as you head towards the middle, but clearly if you stand by your country even when it is obviously wrong you will get the reputation for "loving" it more than those who constantly criticize it. Nevermind that loving your country for good or ill even when its leaders are violating the very principles the country stands for is NOT patriotism. It's the reputation/perception that is at play here.
 

Xavier434

Lifer
Oct 14, 2002
10,377
1
0
Patriotism is a word which technically has a solid definition which is the following as per the wiki:

Patriotism is commonly defined as the love for or devotion to one's country.
However, it is considerably obvious that it is one of many words which holds a different definition depending on who you ask. Therefore, it is has become nothing more than a subjective opinion. Hence, the controversy.

For me, I just stick with the simple definition and ignore the rest of the debatable nonsense since most of the debate is often used as nothing more than a weapon to slander to someone else. I don't believe that Patriotism should be most commonly used in such a fashion. I think that is insulting towards its true definition.
 

Robor

Elite Member
Oct 9, 1999
16,979
0
0
Originally posted by: jonks
Because of lefty posters like [deleted] and [deleted] who cackle with glee every time the US does something remotely questionable or gets caught in a bad situation. The hard righties like [deleted] and [deleted] stick by the US no matter how crappy we are and they defend every action no matter how cruel or illegal. Both extremes are equally pathetic, but one of the extremes sides with the US no matter what and the other side criticizes the US no matter what.

The fervor decreases as you head towards the middle, but clearly if you stand by your country even when it is obviously wrong you will get the reputation for "loving" it more than those who constantly criticize it. Nevermind that loving your country for good or ill even when its leaders are violating the very principles the country stands for is NOT patriotism. It's the reputation/perception that is at play here.
Another in a long list of excellent posts. :thumbsup:
 

TechBoyJK

Lifer
Oct 17, 2002
16,701
60
91
Originally posted by: Robor
Originally posted by: jonks
Because of lefty posters like [deleted] and [deleted] who cackle with glee every time the US does something remotely questionable or gets caught in a bad situation. The hard righties like [deleted] and [deleted] stick by the US no matter how crappy we are and they defend every action no matter how cruel or illegal. Both extremes are equally pathetic, but one of the extremes sides with the US no matter what and the other side criticizes the US no matter what.

The fervor decreases as you head towards the middle, but clearly if you stand by your country even when it is obviously wrong you will get the reputation for "loving" it more than those who constantly criticize it. Nevermind that loving your country for good or ill even when its leaders are violating the very principles the country stands for is NOT patriotism. It's the reputation/perception that is at play here.
Another in a long list of excellent posts. :thumbsup:

very true, and this is why i generally think most extreme leftist liberals are usually hateful, small minded people. The USA is the biggest and easiest target they can find and lately it's been easy to hate on.
 

GenHoth

Platinum Member
Jul 5, 2007
2,106
0
0
Originally posted by: jonks
Because of lefty posters like [deleted] and [deleted] who cackle with glee every time the US does something remotely questionable or gets caught in a bad situation. The hard righties like [deleted] and [deleted] stick by the US no matter how crappy we are and they defend every action no matter how cruel or illegal. Both extremes are equally pathetic, but one of the extremes sides with the US no matter what and the other side criticizes the US no matter what.

The fervor decreases as you head towards the middle, but clearly if you stand by your country even when it is obviously wrong you will get the reputation for "loving" it more than those who constantly criticize it. Nevermind that loving your country for good or ill even when its leaders are violating the very principles the country stands for is NOT patriotism. It's the reputation/perception that is at play here.
I think this was a pretty good post
:thumbsup:
 

Deeko

Lifer
Jun 16, 2000
30,215
11
81
It was really funny though

Actually last nights daily show/colbert report were both better than usual. I was consistently amused.
 

Robor

Elite Member
Oct 9, 1999
16,979
0
0
Originally posted by: TechBoyJK
Originally posted by: Robor
Originally posted by: jonks
Because of lefty posters like [deleted] and [deleted] who cackle with glee every time the US does something remotely questionable or gets caught in a bad situation. The hard righties like [deleted] and [deleted] stick by the US no matter how crappy we are and they defend every action no matter how cruel or illegal. Both extremes are equally pathetic, but one of the extremes sides with the US no matter what and the other side criticizes the US no matter what.

The fervor decreases as you head towards the middle, but clearly if you stand by your country even when it is obviously wrong you will get the reputation for "loving" it more than those who constantly criticize it. Nevermind that loving your country for good or ill even when its leaders are violating the very principles the country stands for is NOT patriotism. It's the reputation/perception that is at play here.
Another in a long list of excellent posts. :thumbsup:

very true, and this is why i generally think most extreme leftist liberals are usually hateful, small minded people. The USA is the biggest and easiest target they can find and lately it's been easy to hate on.
That is not what I got out of jonks post at all.
 

m1ldslide1

Platinum Member
Feb 20, 2006
2,321
0
0
Originally posted by: Robor
Originally posted by: TechBoyJK
Originally posted by: Robor
Originally posted by: jonks
Because of lefty posters like [deleted] and [deleted] who cackle with glee every time the US does something remotely questionable or gets caught in a bad situation. The hard righties like [deleted] and [deleted] stick by the US no matter how crappy we are and they defend every action no matter how cruel or illegal. Both extremes are equally pathetic, but one of the extremes sides with the US no matter what and the other side criticizes the US no matter what.

The fervor decreases as you head towards the middle, but clearly if you stand by your country even when it is obviously wrong you will get the reputation for "loving" it more than those who constantly criticize it. Nevermind that loving your country for good or ill even when its leaders are violating the very principles the country stands for is NOT patriotism. It's the reputation/perception that is at play here.
Another in a long list of excellent posts. :thumbsup:

very true, and this is why i generally think most extreme leftist liberals are usually hateful, small minded people. The USA is the biggest and easiest target they can find and lately it's been easy to hate on.
That is not what I got out of jonks post at all.

That's because you have a brain.
 

winnar111

Banned
Mar 10, 2008
2,847
0
0
Originally posted by: Carmen813
I nearly choked on my glass of water, my wife and I were cracking up.

You can view what I'm talking about at Dailyshow.com, watch the clip titled "Michele Obama's Patriotism"

Anyway I thought it was an interesting point, why are dems constantly forced to 'prove' their patriotism while its automatically assumed for republicans?

*EDIT* The line I'm referring to is around the 4:10 mark.
Because candidate A was a PoW for 5 years, and candidate B hangs around with the race baiting Goddamn America crowd?

And its not just them.

http://www.ndtv.com/convergenc...px?id=NEWEN20080044838

"I think it would be a great thing if we had an election year where you had two people who loved this country and were devoted to the interests of this country," he told a group of veterans on Friday in Charlotte, North Carolina.

He added, "people could actually ask themselves who is right on these issues, instead of all this other stuff that always seems to intrude itself on our politics."

Clinton was apparently referring to his wife and McCain, leaving Obama out in the cold.


 

shira

Diamond Member
Jan 12, 2005
9,567
6
81
Originally posted by: Xavier434
Patriotism is a word which technically has a solid definition which is the following as per the wiki:

Patriotism is commonly defined as the love for or devotion to one's country.
However, it is considerably obvious that it is one of many words which holds a different definition depending on who you ask. Therefore, it is has become nothing more than a subjective opinion. Hence, the controversy.

For me, I just stick with the simple definition and ignore the rest of the debatable nonsense since most of the debate is often used as nothing more than a weapon to slander to someone else. I don't believe that Patriotism should be most commonly used in such a fashion. I think that is insulting towards its true definition.
I define "patriotism" as wanting your country to be the best it can be, which includes advocating that your country be true to its principles. I believe that a true patriot MUST speak out when his country betrays those principles.
 

Rainsford

Lifer
Apr 25, 2001
17,515
0
0
Originally posted by: jonks
Because of lefty posters like [deleted] and [deleted] who cackle with glee every time the US does something remotely questionable or gets caught in a bad situation. The hard righties like [deleted] and [deleted] stick by the US no matter how crappy we are and they defend every action no matter how cruel or illegal. Both extremes are equally pathetic, but one of the extremes sides with the US no matter what and the other side criticizes the US no matter what.

The fervor decreases as you head towards the middle, but clearly if you stand by your country even when it is obviously wrong you will get the reputation for "loving" it more than those who constantly criticize it. Nevermind that loving your country for good or ill even when its leaders are violating the very principles the country stands for is NOT patriotism. It's the reputation/perception that is at play here.
Since you brought up patriotism as "loving" your country, it seems an appropriate time to mention another quote I like on the topic...sorry, I can't remember who said it or the exact phrasing. But the general idea was that Republicans love their country like a small child loves his parents, totally in awe, never questioning or thinking for himself. Liberals love their country like adults love their parents, not blind to their flaws and shortcomings, but they love them all the same and try to help them become better.

Not exactly right for everyone, I admit, but I think it translates nicely into the whole "patriotism" debate. Anybody who thinks real patriotism looks like the slavish devotion some conservatives display is an idiot.
 

Rainsford

Lifer
Apr 25, 2001
17,515
0
0
Originally posted by: winnar111
Originally posted by: Carmen813
I nearly choked on my glass of water, my wife and I were cracking up.

You can view what I'm talking about at Dailyshow.com, watch the clip titled "Michele Obama's Patriotism"

Anyway I thought it was an interesting point, why are dems constantly forced to 'prove' their patriotism while its automatically assumed for republicans?

*EDIT* The line I'm referring to is around the 4:10 mark.
Because candidate A was a PoW for 5 years, and candidate B hangs around with the race baiting Goddamn America crowd?

And its not just them.

http://www.ndtv.com/convergenc...px?id=NEWEN20080044838

"I think it would be a great thing if we had an election year where you had two people who loved this country and were devoted to the interests of this country," he told a group of veterans on Friday in Charlotte, North Carolina.

He added, "people could actually ask themselves who is right on these issues, instead of all this other stuff that always seems to intrude itself on our politics."

Clinton was apparently referring to his wife and McCain, leaving Obama out in the cold.
Well gee, now you've covered 1 person on each side...care to explain the ridiculous position you people take on the other 99.99999% of liberals and conservatives?

And not to diminish the sacrifice McCain made, but how does being a PoW make you a patriot? Or rather, what's special about it that serving in the armed forces in a war doesn't convey on you? Kerry served in Vietnam, and was wounded for his trouble, and that didn't stop Republicans from attacking his patriotism.
 

winnar111

Banned
Mar 10, 2008
2,847
0
0
Originally posted by: Rainsford
Originally posted by: winnar111
Originally posted by: Carmen813
I nearly choked on my glass of water, my wife and I were cracking up.

You can view what I'm talking about at Dailyshow.com, watch the clip titled "Michele Obama's Patriotism"

Anyway I thought it was an interesting point, why are dems constantly forced to 'prove' their patriotism while its automatically assumed for republicans?

*EDIT* The line I'm referring to is around the 4:10 mark.
Because candidate A was a PoW for 5 years, and candidate B hangs around with the race baiting Goddamn America crowd?

And its not just them.

http://www.ndtv.com/convergenc...px?id=NEWEN20080044838

"I think it would be a great thing if we had an election year where you had two people who loved this country and were devoted to the interests of this country," he told a group of veterans on Friday in Charlotte, North Carolina.

He added, "people could actually ask themselves who is right on these issues, instead of all this other stuff that always seems to intrude itself on our politics."

Clinton was apparently referring to his wife and McCain, leaving Obama out in the cold.
Well gee, now you've covered 1 person on each side...care to explain the ridiculous position you people take on the other 99.99999% of liberals and conservatives?

And not to diminish the sacrifice McCain made, but how does being a PoW make you a patriot? Or rather, what's special about it that serving in the armed forces in a war doesn't convey on you? Kerry served in Vietnam, and was wounded for his trouble, and that didn't stop Republicans from attacking his patriotism.
True, but then he came back and started organizing Vietnam protests.

I don't recall George Bush attacking Gore's patriotism in 2000. The Democrats made the choice of nominating people of questionable character the last 2 times around, in 2008 and 2004.
 

dbk

Lifer
Apr 23, 2004
17,682
7
81
?She?s got to [prove her patriotism]! She?s a Democrat. She must prove she loves America, as opposed to Republicans who everyone knooows love America. They just hate half the people living in it.?
 

fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
73,370
25,126
136
Originally posted by: winnar111

True, but then he came back and started organizing Vietnam protests.

I don't recall George Bush attacking Gore's patriotism in 2000. The Democrats made the choice of nominating people of questionable character the last 2 times around, in 2008 and 2004.
Yeah, how dare he protest against a war! Sure he was awarded the second highest award for bravery possible and was repeatedly wounded fighting for America, but I mean really... it was hard to tell if he was patriotic or not. He did protest some afterall.

Also, how DARE the Democrats nominate people of questionable character! I mean Obama was a serial adulterer with his first disabled wife and was part of the Keating 5 scandal. I mean, how much scummier can you get?

.... That was Obama and not McCain right? Right? It couldn't be McCain, because he was a POW.
 

Born2bwire

Diamond Member
Oct 28, 2005
9,840
5
71
Originally posted by: winnar111
Originally posted by: Rainsford
Originally posted by: winnar111
Originally posted by: Carmen813
I nearly choked on my glass of water, my wife and I were cracking up.

You can view what I'm talking about at Dailyshow.com, watch the clip titled "Michele Obama's Patriotism"

Anyway I thought it was an interesting point, why are dems constantly forced to 'prove' their patriotism while its automatically assumed for republicans?

*EDIT* The line I'm referring to is around the 4:10 mark.
Because candidate A was a PoW for 5 years, and candidate B hangs around with the race baiting Goddamn America crowd?

And its not just them.

http://www.ndtv.com/convergenc...px?id=NEWEN20080044838

"I think it would be a great thing if we had an election year where you had two people who loved this country and were devoted to the interests of this country," he told a group of veterans on Friday in Charlotte, North Carolina.

He added, "people could actually ask themselves who is right on these issues, instead of all this other stuff that always seems to intrude itself on our politics."

Clinton was apparently referring to his wife and McCain, leaving Obama out in the cold.
Well gee, now you've covered 1 person on each side...care to explain the ridiculous position you people take on the other 99.99999% of liberals and conservatives?

And not to diminish the sacrifice McCain made, but how does being a PoW make you a patriot? Or rather, what's special about it that serving in the armed forces in a war doesn't convey on you? Kerry served in Vietnam, and was wounded for his trouble, and that didn't stop Republicans from attacking his patriotism.
True, but then he came back and started organizing Vietnam protests.
Ha, that's the most ridiculous excuse I've ever heard.
 

winnar111

Banned
Mar 10, 2008
2,847
0
0
Originally posted by: eskimospy
Originally posted by: winnar111

True, but then he came back and started organizing Vietnam protests.

I don't recall George Bush attacking Gore's patriotism in 2000. The Democrats made the choice of nominating people of questionable character the last 2 times around, in 2008 and 2004.
Yeah, how dare he protest against a war! Sure he was awarded the second highest award for bravery possible and was repeatedly wounded fighting for America, but I mean really... it was hard to tell if he was patriotic or not. He did protest some afterall.

Also, how DARE the Democrats nominate people of questionable character! I mean Obama was a serial adulterer with his first disabled wife and was part of the Keating 5 scandal. I mean, how much scummier can you get?

.... That was Obama and not McCain right? Right? It couldn't be McCain, because he was a POW.
Well, given that some of those protestors were spitting on soldiers, yeah, people weren't too happy about that.
 

winnar111

Banned
Mar 10, 2008
2,847
0
0
Originally posted by: Born2bwire
Originally posted by: winnar111
Originally posted by: Rainsford
Well gee, now you've covered 1 person on each side...care to explain the ridiculous position you people take on the other 99.99999% of liberals and conservatives?

And not to diminish the sacrifice McCain made, but how does being a PoW make you a patriot? Or rather, what's special about it that serving in the armed forces in a war doesn't convey on you? Kerry served in Vietnam, and was wounded for his trouble, and that didn't stop Republicans from attacking his patriotism.
True, but then he came back and started organizing Vietnam protests.
Ha, that's the most ridiculous excuse I've ever heard.
Kerry lost, didn't he? That 'excuse' is reality.
 

fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
73,370
25,126
136
Originally posted by: winnar111
Originally posted by: eskimospy
Originally posted by: winnar111

True, but then he came back and started organizing Vietnam protests.

I don't recall George Bush attacking Gore's patriotism in 2000. The Democrats made the choice of nominating people of questionable character the last 2 times around, in 2008 and 2004.
Yeah, how dare he protest against a war! Sure he was awarded the second highest award for bravery possible and was repeatedly wounded fighting for America, but I mean really... it was hard to tell if he was patriotic or not. He did protest some afterall.

Also, how DARE the Democrats nominate people of questionable character! I mean Obama was a serial adulterer with his first disabled wife and was part of the Keating 5 scandal. I mean, how much scummier can you get?

.... That was Obama and not McCain right? Right? It couldn't be McCain, because he was a POW.
Well, given that some of those protestors were spitting on soldiers, yeah, people weren't too happy about that.
What a completely reasonable argument. Someone that shared Kerry's opposition to the war was disrespectful to a soldier. When this is balanced against his numerous awards for heroism and being wounded in battle for America, it's about even. I would question his patriotism too... I mean what's a silver star really worth when someone you don't even know in the same crowd spits at a guy?
 

CallMeJoe

Diamond Member
Jul 30, 2004
6,938
5
81
Originally posted by: winnar111
Well, given that some of those protestors were spitting on soldiers, yeah, people weren't too happy about that.
Some protesters were spitting on soldiers, ergo all protesters are scum.

Brilliantly fallacious argument. Try again, only this time with rational thought.
 

winnar111

Banned
Mar 10, 2008
2,847
0
0
Originally posted by: eskimospy
Originally posted by: winnar111
Originally posted by: eskimospy
Originally posted by: winnar111

True, but then he came back and started organizing Vietnam protests.

I don't recall George Bush attacking Gore's patriotism in 2000. The Democrats made the choice of nominating people of questionable character the last 2 times around, in 2008 and 2004.
Yeah, how dare he protest against a war! Sure he was awarded the second highest award for bravery possible and was repeatedly wounded fighting for America, but I mean really... it was hard to tell if he was patriotic or not. He did protest some afterall.

Also, how DARE the Democrats nominate people of questionable character! I mean Obama was a serial adulterer with his first disabled wife and was part of the Keating 5 scandal. I mean, how much scummier can you get?

.... That was Obama and not McCain right? Right? It couldn't be McCain, because he was a POW.
Well, given that some of those protestors were spitting on soldiers, yeah, people weren't too happy about that.
What a completely reasonable argument. Someone that shared Kerry's opposition to the war was disrespectful to a soldier. When this is balanced against his numerous awards for heroism and being wounded in battle for America, it's about even. I would question his patriotism too... I mean what's a silver star really worth when someone you don't even know in the same crowd spits at a guy?
Thank you for summing up how the American people felt in 2004.
 

fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
73,370
25,126
136
Originally posted by: winnar111
Originally posted by: eskimospy

What a completely reasonable argument. Someone that shared Kerry's opposition to the war was disrespectful to a soldier. When this is balanced against his numerous awards for heroism and being wounded in battle for America, it's about even. I would question his patriotism too... I mean what's a silver star really worth when someone you don't even know in the same crowd spits at a guy?
Thank you for summing up how the American people felt in 2004.
Oh really? You speak for the American people now eh? I love how morons across the political spectrum like to try and tell me what "the American people" think about things. A hint to everyone out there: when you hear the phrase "the American people think..." you're about to hear a load of horseshit.
 

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