John Paulson, billionaire hedge fund manager, is planing to move to save on taxes

[Atomic Playboy]

This is the difference in mindsets. Those on the 'right' feel that they earned the money and the government is taking it. Those on the 'left' feel it was the goverments money in the first place and they're letting you KEEP some of it. . .

No one on the left thinks it was the government's money in the first place. The left thinks that we are all beholden to the society which allowed us to achieve success and we should all pay our fair share to ensure the strength of that society. The left also believes that no one needs billions of dollars to be happy or live well. The left further believes that many of the economic bets made by hedge fund managers over the past decade that made them billionaires should be punishable by criminal action as they made out like bandits at the expense of everyone else in society when the economy collapsed as a direct result of their personal greed and negligent actions.

 

[diesbudt]

Who didn't see this coming? ? ?

 

[techie81]

Wait, wut? how will poor people no longer be poor once the rich leave?

I would like an answer to this as well.

 

[lotus503]

This is the difference in mindsets. Those on the 'right' feel that they earned the money and the government is taking it. Those on the 'left' feel it was the goverments money in the first place and they're letting you KEEP some of it. . .

Not really, I don't consider it stealing because society benefits from paying taxes.

We all have things our tax dollars are spent on we don't like or agree with.
We get to vote for elected officials to spend that money in a manner we agree with.


The rich in this country have many more means of legal redress

 

[cybrsage]

Not really, I don't consider it stealing because society benefits from paying taxes.

We all have things our tax dollars are spent on we don't like or agree with.
We get to vote for elected officials to spend that money in a manner we agree with.


The rich in this country have many more means of legal redress

:thumbsup:

 

[Fern]

Two thoughts:

1. I don't really care who moves where. It's a free country, you wanna move, then move.

2. PR is screwing us over. They passed this new law to purposefully encourage wealthy Americans to move there. (I'm not quite sure how these people avoid US income taxes. Generally, no matter where you live, if you're a US citizen even your foreign source income is taxable to the US. I do see a law, section 936, that might be (ab)used to get around paying US income taxes, but I don't do PR/US taxes so cannot be sure. However, if that law section is being used to get around paying US taxes, Congress can fix it.)

Fern

 

[chalmers]

I don't care.

 

[LegendKiller]

Your statement is simply proof that you want everyone to be beholden to government. How many millions in taxes has he paid? Are we all indentured servants to the state?

The problem is that people like you see the government as something that is separate from our society. For good or bad we elect and allow this bullshit to happen. We allow Carried Interest and for people like Paulson to buy politicians. We allow the government to grow bigger but we also allow it to grow bigger where we want and think, as a society, it is important to do so.

It also means we must compromise and take the good with the bad, to accept that sometimes it might just be better for the government to manage something if the "free market" cannot. Healthcare is one of those. Others are the military, fire/police, infrastructure...etc.

Paulson and his kind want to twist the government so that he has all of the breaks to accumulate his wealth and none of the responsibility of that accumulated wealth. He was allowed to get his 2/20 and use carried interest because somebody lobbied for it. Us commoners don't get that. Now that he has his he wants to take his toys and go away, with our pilfered money.

You think he got his gains from the "free market"? If so you are a huge fucking fool. As I said before, the game is rigged.

 

[CycloWizard]

The problem is that people like you see the government as something that is separate from our society. For good or bad we elect and allow this bullshit to happen. We allow Carried Interest and for people like Paulson to buy politicians. We allow the government to grow bigger but we also allow it to grow bigger where we want and think, as a society, it is important to do so.

It also means we must compromise and take the good with the bad, to accept that sometimes it might just be better for the government to manage something if the "free market" cannot. Healthcare is one of those. Others are the military, fire/police, infrastructure...etc.

Paulson and his kind want to twist the government so that he has all of the breaks to accumulate his wealth and none of the responsibility of that accumulated wealth. He was allowed to get his 2/20 and use carried interest because somebody lobbied for it. Us commoners don't get that. Now that he has his he wants to take his toys and go away, with our pilfered money.

You think he got his gains from the "free market"? If so you are a huge fucking fool. As I said before, the game is rigged.

Government has totally broken healthcare in this country. That you do not recognize such an obvious fact is simply proof that you have your head up your ass. Those of us who work in medical research and would like new products, devices, materials, and treatments to actually be used on patients are swamped with bureaucracy created by government in the form of reimbursement codes, regulatory burden, and the like which will add tens of millions of dollars to the process of getting a simple device to market. Virtually none of this mess has to do with healthcare, benefits of the device, safety, or efficacy; it is simply a wall of crap thrown up to micromanage every aspect of a complex marketplace. We do not have a free market, nor did I say we have one. The market is rigged by the very government you champion as the solution to the market you considered to be free in the first place, yet you think it can be the solution to itself. In other words, you think the problem is its own solution. Your position is just like suggesting that we could put out a fire by pumping gasoline onto it. Your beloved government's corruption is the force which prevents the market from ever approaching its natural equilibrium. Your solution is to give that government more power. If you really believe that will fix anything, in your own words, "If so you are a huge fucking fool."

 

[Incorruptible]

Hopefully more of these guys leave to send a big screw you to the leftists and take away their jobs to teach them a lesson.

 

[FaaR]

And what happens when many of the jobs leave

Why would the jobs leave?

Some rich guy moves out-of-state, takes his income with him. Only the market, from which his income is derived, stays right where it is. Jobs servicing that market will remain, of course.

His own personal consumption isn't enough to make an impression on a national level - heck, even state, or local level, so any net job loss is going to be ~0.

Now, if you want to reason if EVERY rich person were to do the same, maybe their combined purchasing power would have a jobs impact...well, maybe you'd be right. Only most sane rich people don't love their money more than their home town, family, friends, social network and so on, and WON'T ACTUALLY MOVE.

Only grade-A aceholes with near-infinite greed levels go and do things like this.

 

[sandorski]

Douchebags gonna douche.

 

[K1052]

A 3rd world country that we happen to hold the title on being populated by fantastically wealthy hedge-fund managers and other sundry scum who will inevitably try to run it like their own little fiefdom because their egos tell them they're entitled to it. Sounds heavenly.

 

[piasabird]

The federal govt could easily cut off all federal fundning. It is a territory of the USA only. At any time the feds could force the issue. They could also cut off the internet and bar everyone from that territory from access to the US Stock Exchanges.

 

[LegendKiller]

Government has totally broken healthcare in this country. That you do not recognize such an obvious fact is simply proof that you have your head up your ass. Those of us who work in medical research and would like new products, devices, materials, and treatments to actually be used on patients are swamped with bureaucracy created by government in the form of reimbursement codes, regulatory burden, and the like which will add tens of millions of dollars to the process of getting a simple device to market. Virtually none of this mess has to do with healthcare, benefits of the device, safety, or efficacy; it is simply a wall of crap thrown up to micromanage every aspect of a complex marketplace. We do not have a free market, nor did I say we have one. The market is rigged by the very government you champion as the solution to the market you considered to be free in the first place, yet you think it can be the solution to itself. In other words, you think the problem is its own solution. Your position is just like suggesting that we could put out a fire by pumping gasoline onto it. Your beloved government's corruption is the force which prevents the market from ever approaching its natural equilibrium. Your solution is to give that government more power. If you really believe that will fix anything, in your own words, "If so you are a huge fucking fool."

The current situation is f'd up because of half-assed measures. A single payer system is optimal at this point merely because the private companies have captured the regulators and, at the same time, have squeezed the market for as much profit as possible while not allocating funds appropriately. Furthermore, Americans are already paying for those without insurance coverage anyway. If something catastrophic happens to a non-insured the bankruptcy or forgiven bills are merely shuffled through higher costs to everybody else.

This is also why healthcare is so asymmetrical - preventative care is too costly for non-insured so they go to the doctor less and are, overall, less healthy.

The problem is that Americans don't want to give up an ounce of "freedom" for any sort of logical reasons. The "freedom" is already gone through the mis-allocation and, overall, Americans would likely benefit from a single payer system. However, we prefer to keep the least efficient system. The nordic countries should be a prime example.

 

[LegendKiller]

As far as Paulson goes - the guy only creates hedge fund jobs. Sure, those jobs create other jobs as usual. However, the hedge fund jobs aren't leaving, he isn't moving his whole operation. Do you really think any hedge fund kiddie wants to move to that place?

This is purely a personal tax avoidance scheme. He is trying to dodge his responsibilities as an American citizen. Fuck him.

 

[Incorruptible]

As far as Paulson goes - the guy only creates hedge fund jobs. Sure, those jobs create other jobs as usual. However, the hedge fund jobs aren't leaving, he isn't moving his whole operation. Do you really think any hedge fund kiddie wants to move to that place?

This is purely a personal tax avoidance scheme. He is trying to dodge his responsibilities as an American citizen. Fuck him.

The responsibilities of an American citizen include paying these taxes?
The income tax and capital gains tax shouldn't even exist. The income tax presumes that the government has a higher claim to your property than you do.

The reason we have these high taxes is for big government and these social programs. If the government wasn't so involved we wouldn't need as much taxes and we could switch to a national sales tax.The responsibilities of an American citizen are to obey the Constitution

 

[Vic Vega]

Odds are most of this clown's income is taxed as long term capital gains, or a maximum of 17.x%-for that absurdly low rate he gets all the benefits of being a citizen of the USA, including stability of society and protection from foreign powers.

Canada gets this from the US too but no one complains about that. Perhaps because they are taxed more? :whiste:

 

[Jhhnn]

The responsibilities of an American citizen include paying these taxes?
The income tax and capital gains tax shouldn't even exist. The income tax presumes that the government has a higher claim to your property than you do.

The reason we have these high taxes is for big government and these social programs. If the government wasn't so involved we wouldn't need as much taxes and we could switch to a national sales tax.The responsibilities of an American citizen are to obey the Constitution

We could relieve the Rich of their tax burden almost entirely, shift it down the scale to everybody else, right?

Yeh, that'll create jobs & promote commerce.

Paulson could be paying 70% in federal income tax & it wouldn't affect his lifestyle in the slightest. His ongoing accumulation of wealth serves only as a means to power, the power to run the lives of more & more people. Righties apparently like having cheapskate tight fisted financial manipulators running the world & their lives- it gives them somebody to worship.

 

[LegendKiller]

The responsibilities of an American citizen include paying these taxes?
The income tax and capital gains tax shouldn't even exist. The income tax presumes that the government has a higher claim to your property than you do.

The reason we have these high taxes is for big government and these social programs. If the government wasn't so involved we wouldn't need as much taxes and we could switch to a national sales tax.The responsibilities of an American citizen are to obey the Constitution

Yeah, this country was so great pre-tax.

I have no problem with most social programs. The greatest part of this country, and the Constitution, is that most Americans, even those not on the social programs, agree.

 

[dmcowen674]

me and my ilk? i'm in the middle class, aren't you supposed to support me! well, my wife and i have a combined income of 80k. . i suppose we're living large? we're hiding in tax loopholes? lol@dave . . do delusional he doesn't even know who his "enemy" his anymore, hes just lashing out!

If you post like a wannabee rich you get treated like the rich.

 

[Incorruptible]

We could relieve the Rich of their tax burden almost entirely, shift it down the scale to everybody else, right?

Yeh, that'll create jobs & promote commerce.

Paulson could be paying 70% in federal income tax & it wouldn't affect his lifestyle in the slightest. His ongoing accumulation of wealth serves only as a means to power, the power to run the lives of more & more people. Righties apparently like having cheapskate tight fisted financial manipulators running the world & their lives- it gives them somebody to worship.

Paulson could pay more than 70% and there would be very little effect but taxing the rich isn't the answer. Its always easy to blame the rich since they are a minority they can always be a scapegoat. Just because he is rich doesn't mean he gets to run the lives of others. As long as the government obeys the Constitution they dont have power to sell the same power which leftists want the government to have more of.

The role of government is to protect liberty and it must stay within the boundaries of the Constitution. That's why the income tax should be ended and replaced with a national sales tax. If we didnt spend all this money on so many social programs then we wouldnt need all these high taxes.

And what right do you have to the money that belongs to the rich? Considering its the lower and middle class that use many of the social services why should the rich have to pay for them? The government doesnt own our money and has no right to steal it from us.

Its funny how leftists like to talk about the rich not paying their "fair share" but never suggest what the rate should be or only point out rich republicans but not democrats. They also never point out the people who dont pay any income taxes and dont pay their "fair share".

Its also interesting how leftists like to use broad-brush strokes to target the rich but are outraged if someone does the same to radical Muslims or minorities.

 

[cybrsage]

Rich US Citizen moves from one location in the US to another. News at 11.

 

[Incorruptible]

Yeah, this country was so great pre-tax.

I have no problem with most social programs. The greatest part of this country, and the Constitution, is that most Americans, even those not on the social programs, agree.

Yeah, This country is so great now that eventually our economy will collapse

 

[soulcougher73]

The responsibilities of an American citizen include paying these taxes?
The income tax and capital gains tax shouldn't even exist. The income tax presumes that the government has a higher claim to your property than you do.

The reason we have these high taxes is for big government and these social programs. If the government wasn't so involved we wouldn't need as much taxes and we could switch to a national sales tax.The responsibilities of an American citizen are to obey the Constitution

Yes. Just because you may not like to pay them you still have to. I pay mine even though id rather not.

You saying you never pay your taxes?