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Jeffrey Epstein's death was 'likely homicide, not suicide', says famed NYC pathologist

JEDIYoda

Lifer
Jul 13, 2005
33,337
3,007
126
Who would have guessed??

A famed pathologist says he believes Jeffrey Epstein’s death was actually a homicide, in spite of the official ruling that it was death by suicide.

Epstein was found dead in August in New York City, after being arrested for sex trafficking. Since his death, the deceased financier’s ties to prominent figures in American media and politics — including presidents Bill Clinton and Donald Trump — have fuelled rampant conspiracies that he was silenced.

Dr Michael Baden, the former chief medical examiner for New York City, has added fuel to that fire with a recent interview with Fox News in which he said he thinks the evidence presented suggests Epstein did not take his own life.

“I think that the evidence points toward homicide rather than suicide,” he said during an interview on Wednesday.

Mr Baden was hired by Epstein’s brother, Mark Epstein, to observe the autopsy that was conducted after the paedophile was found dead.

“The brother is concerned that if [Epstein] was murdered, then other people who have information might be at risk,” Mr Baden continued. “If they think he has information, his life could be in jeopardy.”

Mr Baden said that there were signs of “unusual” activity surrounding Epstein’s death, and that his wounds were “more consistent with ligature homicidal strangulation” than suicide.

He also said that, during his 50 years of examining bodies, he had never seen the fractured bones seen in Epstein’s thyroid from other hanging deaths.

“Hanging does not cause these broken bones and homicide does. A huge amount of pressure was applied,” he said.

He also said that Epstein’s brother is seeking DNA evidence taken from the dead man’s fingernails, and from the torn sheets used in the hanging. Adding to his argument are questions about the breakdown in security at the New York City jail where Epstein was housed, with Mr Baden saying it was “extremely unlikely” that two guards happened to fall asleep while the video camera in Epstein’s cell and hallway stopped working.
 

IronWing

No Lifer
Jul 20, 2001
60,771
13,564
136
I suppose somebody should look into this. There must be someone out there who wants to write a book.
 

compuwiz1

Admin Emeritus Elite Member
Oct 9, 1999
26,989
776
126
I'm sure there's nobody out there who would've had a problem with him telling all their dirty little secrets. No, sireeee!! Dead men tell no tales!
 

woolfe9998

Lifer
Apr 8, 2013
11,994
6,512
136
Wasn't Epstein alone inside a locked cell when he died? That would mean a homicide would have had to involve prison staff.

I'm not going to put any stock into this unless or until I hear more details than is contained in that article.
 
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interchange

Diamond Member
Oct 10, 1999
7,295
2,005
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As a doctor, this makes me laugh. Your thyroid gland has no bones. Perhaps they are referring to the hyoid bone or damage to thyroid/cricoid cartilages?

Anyway, I don't really have enough knowledge to weigh in anything of a medical opinion here, but if there was evidence of murder passed over, it wouldn't surprise me.
 

[DHT]Osiris

Diamond Member
Dec 15, 2015
8,106
3,973
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As a doctor, this makes me laugh. Your thyroid gland has no bones. Perhaps they are referring to the hyoid bone or damage to thyroid/cricoid cartilages?
Pretty sure the original claim was that the hyoid bone was broken. Given that autocorrect probably doesn't know what that bone is, and nor would the intern writing this piece, it's very probable it was autocorrected to thyroid.
 

IronWing

No Lifer
Jul 20, 2001
60,771
13,564
136
Wasn't Epstein alone inside a locked cell when he died? That would mean a homicide would have had to involve prison staff.

I'm not going to put any stock into this unless or until I hear more details than is contained in that article.
Already covered in the main Epstein thread:

Butler: She murdered herself in her sleep, sir.
Dick Charleston: You mean suicide?
Butler: Oh, no. It was murder, all right. Mrs. Twain hated herself.
 

allisolm

Elite Member
Administrator
Jan 2, 2001
23,565
1,548
136
Hmm...

Here's what was said back in August after the autopsy.

"Representatives for Epstein are not disputing preliminary findings of FBI investigators and the New York City medical examiner that Epstein died by suicide, according to a source briefed on the matter.
The medical examiner is awaiting toxicology reports before officially ruling on Epstein's death.
Epstein's family hired its own pathologist, Michael Baden, who was present during the autopsy, according to the source, and he is also not disputing preliminary findings from the medical examiner that Epstein killed himself."


 

dank69

Lifer
Oct 6, 2009
26,145
6,184
136
Everyone knows Clinton had Epstein replaced with a dead look-alike. Nevermind the fact that of all the people in the world who might have wanted Epstein dead or fake dead, Barr would be the one who could most effectively uncover any anomalies that arose from such an operation.
 

Jhhnn

No Lifer
Nov 11, 1999
61,486
13,493
136
Hmm...

Here's what was said back in August after the autopsy.

"Representatives for Epstein are not disputing preliminary findings of FBI investigators and the New York City medical examiner that Epstein died by suicide, according to a source briefed on the matter.
The medical examiner is awaiting toxicology reports before officially ruling on Epstein's death.
Epstein's family hired its own pathologist, Michael Baden, who was present during the autopsy, according to the source, and he is also not disputing preliminary findings from the medical examiner that Epstein killed himself."

Yeh, I'm getting a whiff of bullshit, given that this is 10 weeks after the autopsy at which Baden was present. Smells like... stealing news cycles from the impeachment proceedings...
 
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cytg111

Lifer
Mar 17, 2008
14,840
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I wont feel confident putting an opinion down on this before we have John McAfee weigh in on the matter.
We need to hear from John god damnit. Where is he?
TO THE BAT SIGNAL.
 

TheVrolok

Lifer
Dec 11, 2000
23,367
2,640
136
Wait, the guy who was hired by the family who did not initially dispute suicide, is now disputing suicide? Mmmkay.

His comment on the hyoid fracture is also a little suspect.
 

woolfe9998

Lifer
Apr 8, 2013
11,994
6,512
136
Wait, the guy who was hired by the family who did not initially dispute suicide, is now disputing suicide? Mmmkay.

His comment on the hyoid fracture is also a little suspect.
Yes, it's especially odd since this expert knew about the bone fractures right from the beginning when he said he wasn't disputing the ME's findings. Now he does a 180 and says the bone fractures mean homicide? I'm not buying it.
 

TheVrolok

Lifer
Dec 11, 2000
23,367
2,640
136
Yes, it's especially odd since this expert knew about the bone fractures right from the beginning when he said he wasn't disputing the ME's findings. Now he does a 180 and says the bone fractures mean homicide? I'm not buying it.
It's also gutsy to use a "well in all my years I've never seen it" argument without any supporting data. Hyoid bones certainly do fracture in both suicide and homicide cases. Epstein also had other fractures which are not often seen in homicide cases and more commonly seen in suicide cases. Not to mention, personal experience only means so much.
 

z1ggy

Diamond Member
May 17, 2008
9,937
54
91
RE: the bone fracture thing - I thought the original info IIRC was saying how the bone is usually only broken a small % of the time during suicide but is more likely to be broken as you get older. I.e. it can break regardless of manner of death (suicide or homicide) but is simply less likely to be broken during suicide, especially if one's age is less.

So the fact that he's older, yet it's broken.... pretty much proves nothing. If he was young and it wasn't broken, then it would give more evidence pointing toward suicide, but it can't confirm in this case that it was also not suicide.

I'm all for believing he was taken out to be silenced because that kind of fits the narrative a lot better and the odds of all the stars aligning to help him kill himself seem off.... but if we aren't going to hotly pursue the cold blood murder of an American journalist being chopped up into little pieces while he's alive in another country, we sure as heck aren't going to persue the potential murder of a silver spoon kiddie rapist.

As soon as the memes on reddit go away, this will be old news and forgotten.
 
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zzyzxroad

Platinum Member
Jan 29, 2017
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Shall we place bets on a Michael Baden book covering the matter launching in the near future?
 
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