Ivy Bridge IGP up to 122% faster than HD3000

[BallaTheFeared]

I don't really care to prove anything anymore, google is available to everyone. Use it or don't, I couldn't care less.

 

[Arzachel]

I don't really care to prove anything anymore, google is available to everyone. Use it or don't, I couldn't care less.

So you want me to prove your point for you?

"AMD has INFINITELY better IQ, just google it. And if you can't find it, you're just not looking hard enough!"

Can't really accuse you of trolling, because you seem sincere. Is willful ignorance an offense on these forums?

 

[BallaTheFeared]

I don't want you to do anything, but you can continue to bash me as if this was 4chan and we are all laughing about it.

 

[T_Yamamoto]

So you want me to prove your point for you?

"AMD has INFINITELY better IQ, just google it. And if you can't find it, you're just not looking hard enough!"

Can't really accuse you of trolling, because you seem sincere. Is willful ignorance an offense on these forums?

click this

 

[LoneNinja]

The problem is AMD cannot improve upon their APU's too much without cannibalizing their x6xx and series low end discrete cards.

No matter how hard they push their APU the low end discrete will still at least be equal as the GPU in the APU is based on those designs unless they change things. Even if the APU matches their low end discrete parts, there is still hybrid crossfire and the FX processors need video as well. I just don't see an advancement in APUs really cannibalizing sales of their low end discrete.

 

[Blitzvogel]

No matter how hard they push their APU the low end discrete will still at least be equal as the GPU in the APU is based on those designs unless they change things. Even if the APU matches their low end discrete parts, there is still hybrid crossfire and the FX processors need video as well. I just don't see an advancement in APUs really cannibalizing sales of their low end discrete.

I think AMD really just needs to consolidate their lines of chips, and GDDR5 needs to be the only supported memory type, so relatively decent graphics processors can't be gimped by DDR3. The low end has a reason to exist as long as it meets the potential of the currently best APUs which are marred by low available memory bandwidth and low max clock speeds. 320 SP and 400 SP Llano APUs barely hold a candle vs the 160 SP 6450 mostly due to the clock differences. It's nice to know you're not generally held back by TDW with a dedicated graphics processor.

 

[BallaTheFeared]

click this

Or this...

http://bit.ly/AgOr9l

And this...

http://bit.ly/wFNSYO


Google, it's not that hard.

ENOUGH!
-ViRGE

 

[Homeles]

And why is that ??

We haven't seen yet the low end 28nm GPUs from AMD or NVIDIA.

You won't see any from AMD, at least until next generation. All parts lower than 77xx are rebranded 40nm VLIW5 chips.

 

[AtenRa]

You won't see any from AMD, at least until next generation. All parts lower than 77xx are rebranded 40nm VLIW5 chips.

I believe we will see VLIW4 HD7600 series and below when Desktop Triniti Launch. I dont believe you can CF Triniti(VLIW4) with VLIW5 cards.

 

[IntelUser2000]

I believe we will see VLIW4 HD7600 series and below when Desktop Triniti Launch. I dont believe you can CF Triniti(VLIW4) with VLIW5 cards.

That makes sense, except they seem to be using rebranded VLIW5 chip: http://www.cpu-world.com/news_2012/2012010703_Entry_Level_and_Mainstream_HD_7000_Graphics.html

 

[Haserath]

I see 122% increase in igpu performance, 10% or more increase in cpu performance, with lower TDP as a decent tock... It's a tock, it's not a next gen or redesign.

Just clearing this up.

Tick= Process shrink
Tock= Architectural change

Ivy=Tick+, Process shrink+some changes

 

[AtenRa]

That makes sense, except they seem to be using rebranded VLIW5 chip: http://www.cpu-world.com/news_2012/2012010703_Entry_Level_and_Mainstream_HD_7000_Graphics.html

I can only see HD7900 and 7700 series in AMDs official site. There are 7600 OEM series but there are not available in retail or in the official AMD site.

As far as i know, AMD haven't released 7600 and lower series as of yet.

 

[Homeles]

I believe we will see VLIW4 HD7600 series and below when Desktop Triniti Launch. I dont believe you can CF Triniti(VLIW4) with VLIW5 cards.

Trinity is GCN. Also, HD 7600 and below is VLIW5, and are already available to OEMs. They'll probably launch in the retail channel eventually, but they're already available for the most part as 6xxx parts. The only VLIW4 parts have been 69xx.

 

[AtenRa]

Triniti is definitely not GCN, most probably VLIW4

 

[WMD]

HD 4000 compared to mobile gpus @ notebookcheck:

http://www.notebookcheck.net/Intel-HD-Graphics-4000.69168.0.html

The Intel HD Graphics 4000 (GT2) is a processor graphics card that is included in the Ivy Bridge processors of 2012 (3rd generation of core, e.g. Core i7-3770). The base clock can be automatically overclocked using Turbo Boost technology. Depending on the processor model, the base and turbo clock rate may differ greatly resulting in different graphics performance of ULV parts compared to high end quad-core parts.

Compared to the Intel HD Graphics 3000 in Sandy Bridge CPUs, the HD 4000 card was completely redesigned and offers improved DirectX 11 capable shaders, Hardware Tessellation, a dedicated level 3 cache (before the Last Level Cache LLC of the CPU) and DirectCompute support. The IPC (instructions per clock) can therefore be even 2x as fast as with Sandy Bridge and overall up to 60% more performance (3DMark Vantage) should be possible.

First leaked benchmarks therefore position the HD Graphics 4000 (in a fast quad core desktop CPU) on a level with a dedicated Nvidia GeForce GT 330M and therefore above the AMD processor graphics Radeon HD 6620G.

The integrated video decoder called Multi Format Codec Engine (MFX) was also improved and should allow even simultaneus 4K video decoding. QuickSync for fast transcoding of videos was also optimized for higher performance and better image quality.

Another new feature is the support for up to 3 independent displays (maybe only with a DisplayPort) as AMD offers with theirs Eyefinity support (up to 6 displays).

Due to the 22nm 3D Tri-Gate production process, the power consumption should be relatively low (the development was focused on performance per Watt). The TDP of the whole package (including processor and memory controller) varies between 18 Watt (ULV) up to 45 Watt (mobile quad core) for the consumer laptop CPUs.

Pretty darn impressive. On par with the excellent Mobility HD5650 and a hair behind the GT525M (96 unified shaders 128bit DDR5). I am going to use the same old argument by AMD loyalists here. The HD4000 is still new. Drivers will improve and by that time it will overtake the 5670/6670 class of discrete GPUs. :thumbsup:

 

[DominionSeraph]

When's the last time you saw Intel IGP gain so much? For low end users, this is a big win.

The HD 4000 is only on the high-end chips.

If this was going to be available on the i3 and Pentium then it'd be a win for all those with an el cheapo prebuilt. But it's not. Who the heck is going to spend money on an i7 or the i5 3570k, plan to use it at some point for gaming, and not stick in any sort of discrete gaming card? You can get 3-4x the performance for $40, so who's going to be using the HD4000?

How many of you with an i5 2500k or i7 2600k are gaming on your integrated graphics?

 

[Homeles]

Triniti is definitely not GCN, most probably VLIW4

It absolutely is GCN. There's die shots of both GCN and Trinity floating out there, and the IGP on Trinity is incontrovertibly GCN based.

 

[WMD]

The HD 4000 is only on the high-end chips.

If this was going to be available on the i3 and Pentium then it'd be a win for all those with an el cheapo prebuilt. But it's not. Who the heck is going to spend money on an i7 or the i5 3570k, plan to use it at some point for gaming, and not stick in any sort of discrete gaming card? You can get 3-4x the performance for $40, so who's going to be using the HD4000?

How many of you with an i5 2500k or i7 2600k are gaming on your integrated graphics?

Ivy bridge is mainstream. Not everyone has the same usage scenario as you. A i5 3570k + HD 4000 is perfect for someone doing alot of cpu intensive task and occasional light gaming like Diablo 3 or SC2.

The HD 6450 is about $44 and does not outperform the HD 4000.

 

[BallaTheFeared]

The HD 4000 is only on the high-end chips.

If this was going to be available on the i3 and Pentium then it'd be a win for all those with an el cheapo prebuilt. But it's not. Who the heck is going to spend money on an i7 or the i5 3570k, plan to use it at some point for gaming, and not stick in any sort of discrete gaming card? You can get 3-4x the performance for $40, so who's going to be using the HD4000?

How many of you with an i5 2500k or i7 2600k are gaming on your integrated graphics?

You'd have a point, if you weren't getting $40-50 gpu performance with considerably less power draw, then asking for it on a $40-60 cpu. I mean I'd love to see that, it's just not practical.

Best bet is an i3, the HD3000 comes on two i3's, I wouldn't rule that out totally.

HD4000 does more than gaming, it does GPGPU and does it better than AMD/Nvidia in areas like transcoding. It also offers special services for people who'd want something simple, such as HD streaming video.

I'm all for more for less, but I just don't think in this case it's practical to ask Intel to eat their cpu profits for the sake of more for less. A $100 Celeron is what you're asking for, and that's already the price area for the i3.

It absolutely is GCN. There's die shots of both GCN and Trinity floating out there, and the IGP on Trinity is incontrovertibly GCN based.

Pretty sure it isn't, but no sense arguing over it.

 

[MrK6]

Impressive work by Intel. Glad to see they're pushing graphics now as well.

 

[Bateluer]

Because you can play games at console quality >30fps without even needing a graphics card? Plus its a huge performance leap over previous generation HD3000 which already competes well with AMD 5400 series. With intel's insanely good 22nm 3D transistor you can probably overclock it 80%-100%

Uh, no. Going my experience with an HD3000 and a Radeon 4350, I'd take the Radeon 5450 any day of the week over the HD3000. The HD3000 can't handle Rome Total War, a decade old game that only needed 1Ghz P3 CPU, and thats when the HD3k is paired with a 1.Ghz i5.

Played through Fallout 3 with that Radeon 4350.

 

[Homeles]

Pretty sure it isn't, but no sense arguing over it.

7970 die

Llano (VLIW5) on the left, Trinity (GCN) on the right.

The graphics core on Trinity is arranged differently, like the shader groups in a CU are adjacent to each other on Trinity while on the 7970 they're segregated. However, the shaders look absolutely nothing like VLIW5. Also, the uncore (ROPs, etc.) is significantly larger in Trinity compared to Llano.

Why would you disagree and then run away from a rebuttal?

 

[Dark Shroud]

I just spent a few minutes follow link through link.

http://hothardware.com/News/AMD-Fus...00M-Mobile-GPUs-and-Lightning-Bolt-In-Action/

Trinity use 7000M Mobile GPUs. The high end of 7000M are confirmed GCN, we don't know about the mid to lower that I'm aware of yet. I really hope for AMD's sake they use GCN all the way through the models for performance. Some of the Trinity APUs will be Piledriver based CPU modules, I haven't read all the model details yet as there are a lot of links to get through.

 

[DominionSeraph]

Ivy bridge is mainstream. Not everyone has the same usage scenario as you. A i5 3570k + HD 4000 is perfect for someone doing alot of cpu intensive task and occasional light gaming like Diablo 3 or SC2.

Again, who is this mystery person who's getting a k version CPU to overclock, is planning on gaming, and who isn't putting in some sort of discrete card? Prebuilts aren't going to have the k version, so we're talking boutique builds or self-builds with the processors with the HD4000. And Starcraft II only gets 29fps at 720p -- who's going to be running a 720p monitor on a i5 3750k rig? Do you expect them to run at a non-native resolution rather than spend another ~7% to get +200% performance?

The HD 6450 is about $44 and does not outperform the HD 4000.

http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=1367481&CatId=3670

 

[BallaTheFeared]

7000M is such a general spectrum there is very little that can be taken from it. Though things change, last I read it had slightly less SP than what is currently out, but the increased performance is adkin to 5870 to 6970 or VLIW4 vs VLIW5 (I believe actual numbers were 400SP vs 384SP).

SP source: http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2217599