It's official -- Note2 infringes says Apple

[openwheel]

You have literally no clue what you are talking about. Get a little more realistic with your thoughts on Steve Jobs and maybe people will actually believe what you say.

sorry cheezy, but you are on the losing end of the argument.

 

[openwheel]

I love when Apple basically calls their own customers retarded by the fact they think people will be confused when they see other products and think it was Apple LOL

Companies will always copy each other. Whoever innovates the next company will do it better and faster. That is for software features. Hardware companies just try to get a leg up on the next.

It is like how car manufacturers each have to have the same interior features as compared to the next brand or else its a reason to go for the other option.

unfortunately a lot of iBuyers can't tell the different between iOS and TouchWiz, especially back in Froyo and Gingerbread. They rely on the "authenticity" of the Apple logo to purchase what they intended to buy.

The mobile industry is littered with common sense patents which makes innovation incredibly difficult. Apple is the leader of the pack in this business practice.

 

[cheezy321]

sorry cheezy, but you are on the losing end of the argument.

Of course I am in the losing end in the fantasy world that you created in your head. Why wouldn't I be?


Warning for mild personal attack
There's a big bold-faced warning a few pages requesting people not attack the person, but only the points that they make, and I specifically mentioned you.

Moderator PM

 

[cheezy321]

unfortunately a lot of iBuyers can't tell the different between iOS and TouchWiz, especially back in Froyo and Gingerbread. They rely on the "authenticity" of the Apple logo to purchase what they intended to buy.

The mobile industry is littered with common sense patents which makes innovation incredibly difficult. Apple is the leader of the pack in this business practice.

Unfortunately a lot of android device makers can't think for themselves. Samsung made a 130+ page document figuring out all the ways they can copy the look and feel of the iPhone. They made innovation incredibly difficult for themselves because why even try if you can just copy a competitor?! Samsung is the leader of the pack in the 'copy copy copy' practice. Maybe one day they will create something innovative, we already know they are pretty innovative when it comes to bribery and corruption!

 

[Mopetar]

Of course I am in the losing end in the fantasy world that you created in your head. Why wouldn't I be?

No, you're (well so am I since I had to actually spend time reading what you said) on the losing end because none of your recent posts add anything. All you've done is just try to imply that everyone else is wrong (generally in an insulting manner) without actually making a real point.

If you think someone is wrong, it's generally useful to point out why you think so rather than resulting to personal attacks. You may as well have just told him that he's a stinky-pants and called his momma fat as it wouldn't have changed the quality of your post.

Your post adds absolutely nothing of value to the conversation and really only serves to drag it off topic. If you're just going to start flamewars and derail the conversation, please just keep it to yourself.

 

[MrX8503]

Apple isn't going to stop suing Samsung until they settle. HTC settled probably due to not being able to weather the courts. I think if HTC refused, Apple would have gone after them just as they are now with Samsung.

Frankly I don't understand the Apple hate. I could understand Walmart or credit companies hate. Even in those cases it hasn't stopped their growth. I don't expect the litigation having any affect on the public.

 

[zsdersw]

Apple isn't going to stop suing

Should've stopped right there.

Apple won't stop suing until Android is gone.

 

[ControlD]

Apple isn't going to stop suing Samsung until they settle. HTC settled probably due to not being able to weather the courts. I think if HTC refused, Apple would have gone after them just as they are now with Samsung.

Frankly I don't understand the Apple hate. I could understand Walmart or credit companies hate. Even in those cases it hasn't stopped their growth. I don't expect the litigation having any affect on the public.

I don't hate Apple, hell I own a bunch of their products. At the same time I, and I think others, find their recent tactics to be fairly hard to stomach. It feels like they are gaming a flawed system for all it is worth. The shotgun approach to patents and the "refile until someone approves it" method probably makes sense from a pure business approach, but what is good for one company isn't necessarily good for the consumer in general. What it really does is show a badly flawed system. Still, since Apple's name is more times than not attached to these cases they are going to be seen in a bad light by a lot of people. I guess they don't have a problem with that, at least yet.

 

[MrX8503]

Should've stopped right there.

Apple won't stop suing until Android is gone.

They stopped suing HTC.

 

[zsdersw]

They stopped suing HTC.

HTC isn't the major Android player.

 

[Chiropteran]

Did you miss the part where he said, "I just want people to invent their own stuff." or something? Apple believes that their competitors are using their patented technology, therefore they are suing. How is this difficult to understand?

And they settled with HTC. Or does that action not count because it doesn't fit with your point of view either?

You are letting them pull the wool over your eyes. Apple care about one thing: MONEY.

They *say* it's about encouraging competitors to innovate because they want to mislead you and the rest of the public into thinking they are some amazing awesome benevolent corporation with no goals other than making the world a better place. You are the one who doesn't understand, you don't understand that you are being lied to.

 

[MrX8503]

HTC isn't the major Android player.

There's no proof of that being the reason. All we know is that there's a 10yr agreement.

 

[zsdersw]

There's no proof of that being the reason. All we know is that there's a 10yr agreement.

There's no way to obtain such proof... unless Apple's legal team releases not-for-public-consumption details of how Apple's corporate goals drive their legal strategy.

 

[Mopetar]

You are letting them pull the wool over your eyes. Apple care about one thing: MONEY.

Hint: All corporations do.

They *say* it's about encouraging competitors to innovate because they want to mislead you and the rest of the public into thinking they are some amazing awesome benevolent corporation with no goals other than making the world a better place. You are the one who doesn't understand, you don't understand that you are being lied to.

That's nice. By the way, are you concerned about the lizard people who are in control of the government?

Seriously, when you start ignoring a long line of facts to reach a conclusion, it makes you look ridiculous. I'm under no impression that they're trying to make the world a better place. They're merely another corporate entity existing in the current legal framework. Is that framework perfect? Not by a long shot; but it's what exists and debating about some utopian ideal in a manner that has no chance of actually effecting change doesn't do anything.

No corporation wants to make the world a better place. They merely want to make the world a better place for them. Even if they start with some kind of lofty goal, they ultimately end up looking out for their own best interests, like everything else on the planet.

If you think I'm being mislead or lied to, I have a rather nice* bridge to sell you.

* It's actually quite crap, but I'll still sell it to you.

 

[Chiropteran]

Hint: All corporations do.

So you admit it is true, yet you still believe the guy when he says it isn't about profit? Yeah, right.

Seriously, when you start ignoring a long line of facts to reach a conclusion, it makes you look ridiculous.

Marketing statements are not exactly strictly factual. Typically they contain the maximum level of fiction allowed by law, sometimes more.

 

[Mopetar]

So you admit it is true, yet you still believe the guy when he says it isn't about profit? Yeah, right.

The two are mutually exclusive. My guess is that they wouldn't bother suing if they didn't believe that there was an infringement. If what you believed to be true actually were, Apple (and every other company on the planet) would be suing everyone else that's in competition with them in any form as that would clearly yield the most profit. That they're not (Is Apple suing Dell, Nokia, HP, B&N, or a long list of other companies?) suggests that your line of thinking is flawed.

Marketing statements are not exactly strictly factual. Typically they contain the maximum level of fiction allowed by law, sometimes more.

And yet they settled with HTC and are likely willing to settle with anyone else they can come to agreeable terms with. That Cook said he'd rather settle and has in fact done so, would seem to suggest that what he's said is more genuine that you'd like to suggest. But once again, please don't let facts get in your way.

 

[Chiropteran]

And yet they settled with HTC and are likely willing to settle with anyone else they can come to agreeable terms with. That Cook said he'd rather settle and has in fact done so, would seem to suggest that what he's said is more genuine that you'd like to suggest. But once again, please don't let facts get in your way.

Actually it suggests the opposite. Patent troll method of operation is to sue a ton of companies and settle for cash, they don't want to actually go to trial because trial is expensive and if lost may set a precedent that messes with their method of income. The fact that Apple wants to settle just makes them look more like a patent troll and less like a legitimate business protecting it's own interests.

That they're not (Is Apple suing Dell, Nokia, HP, B&N, or a long list of other companies?) suggests that your line of thinking is flawed.

I burst out laughing reading that, are you serious? It's like saying Hitler wasn't actually a genocidal maniac, because he only exterminated one race, and left blacks hispanics & whites alone. Yeah, godwins law kicks in, the argument is over I win

/joking

But in all seriousness, no. Just because you can list a few companies that Apple isn't sueing does not prove that Apple's existing lawsuits are legitimate. Really, the two things are completely unrelated and it's rather meaningless to bring it up.

 

[Mopetar]

Actually it suggests the opposite. Patent troll method of operation is to sue a ton of companies and settle for cash, they don't want to actually go to trial because trial is expensive and if lost may set a precedent that messes with their method of income. The fact that Apple wants to settle just makes them look more like a patent troll and less like a legitimate business protecting it's own interests.

Then why haven't they settled with Samsung and why did they let that case go to trial? According to you that would have been expensive and might have set a bad precedent that would mess with their method of income.

You keep trying to twist around and jump off on other tangents, but the facts are against you. At least try to think about what you're suggesting before you bother to post it. It completely falls apart in the face of logic.

 

[Chiropteran]

Settling requires agreement from both parties. Apple wanted to settle, Samsung didn't agree to the terms. I'm not sure why you think this makes Apple look any better, or why you think it is even important enough to bring up.

 

[MrX8503]

There's no way to obtain such proof... unless Apple's legal team releases not-for-public-consumption details of how Apple's corporate goals drive their legal strategy.

Then it's speculation not fact.

 

[Zaap]

Just settle. LOL. In other words: Apple has determined its going to shake everyone else down and everyone else should just accept it and pay up. Samsung should 'settle' with Apple for the sin of producing more innovative phones than them like the Note 2 and SGS3.

No dice.

The biggest irony in all of this, is that I see the end game as actually being more damaging to Apple than to everyone else. Apple has done little so far but boost Samsung even higher, anger the courts in at least a few countries for its silly antics (UK with the whole web-apology bit, and Mexico with the attempted hijacking of one of their companies) and incite many to think of them in the same bad light as Microsoft and IBM in their heyday when they were viewed as corporate bullies.

It hasn't helped their stock price, and worst of all, it's all to gloss over and distract from the fact that Apple is failing to keep up innovation. In the long run, there is no glossing over that. Their efforts would be far better spent actually innovating than wasting so much on all this frivolous nonsense that even if they were successful at, won't help them or anyone else long-term.

Rather than try to extort Samsung for the Note 2, make a 5-inch pen-enabled iPhone that actually competes with the Note 2, and release it as a huge surprise to everyone. Ohh boo hoo, that'd be too hard. Plus it'd anger all the fanbois that just bought last year's model and wanted to feel 'special' for another year. Tough shit. Apple's reliance on hype and illusion isn't going to cut it forever. The rest of the tech world is simply moving too fast, and their "sue to stop it!" strategy isn't really going to work long term.

 

[Zink]

Apple has done little so far but boost Samsung even higher

Samsung is doing well but how does being found guilty of patent infringement boost a company's profits?

It's all to gloss over and distract from the fact that Apple is failing to keep up innovation.

Even if Apple's new iPhones somehow had awesome new "innovations" built in they would still sue others for the current infringement. Once they have the patents, why wouldn't they sue? Every new innovation is also going to get patented and any patent infringement is going to be handled legally. No sense in ignoring copying of your design if you can stop it.

Their efforts would be far better spent actually innovating than wasting so much on all this frivolous nonsense that even if they were successful at, won't help them or anyone else long-term.

If they do win in court they will we awarded hundreds of millions which is the whole point of Apple in the first place, to collect cash. There is also a significant amount of long term benefit if they are able to stop other manufacturers from copying for the 10 years the patents are still valid for.

Rather than try to extort Samsung for the Note 2, make a 5-inch pen-enabled iPhone that actually competes with the Note 2, and release it as a huge surprise to everyone.

That wouldn't be a viable strategy and it is much easier to just stop the infringement instead of having to copy every other competing product. Apple says some aspect of the Jelly Bean OS Samsung is shipping infringes on a patent they hold and they want Samsung to stop using their design. Instead of asking Samsung not to use it and then getting a court to tell them to stop you want them to make a copy of every infringing Samsung phone?

The rest of the tech world is simply moving too fast, and their "sue to stop it!" strategy isn't really going to work long term.

The patent system will break down long term? If they have the patents and someone else is using them then I don't see how a court case is going to "break down". Trying to prevent competitors from copying Apple patents isn't a "strategy" that will decide the success of Apple's products. Whether or not Apple continues with the lawsuits, their new product next year will be the exact same and will decide if Apple can continue the upward trend. Unless you are suggesting that they start copying others' designs and waiting for the countersuits because the tech industry is "simply moving too fast" to make following the law necessary.

I think this whole issue is way too political even though it has very little to do with customers. This isn't about which phone is better, public opinion or making fanboys happy. According to the courts patent infringement occurred, public opinion on the validity of those patents or claims doesn't mean the legal departments of these companies should do anything different than they are now.

 

[Phokus]

Samsung is doing well but how does being found guilty of patent infringement boost a company's profits?

Because it ironically raises consumer awareness about Samsung:

http://www.localytics.com/blog/2012/samsung-benefiting-from-iphone-comparisons/

 

[Zink]

Wow that's maybe 80,000 more sales than expected. If that spike is really caused by the patent case I wonder if it is just increased awareness about Samsung phones or a conscious choice to wait until after the court's decision. Maybe people thought they would be pulled from the shelves or wanted to support Samsung? It would be interesting to see sales of other Android phones and iPhones for that same period to see what really happened that week.

 

[zsdersw]

Then it's speculation not fact.

No more so than your speculation that there's nothing like what I'm suggesting.