It's Official - I am now a State Worker

[Slammy1]

Coming at it from a non-union position, I can say in our area the unions are corrupt, nepotist, criminal organizations but I've only dealt with the highway department (went to the hall for a while, but only family members got sent out) and the chemical workers union. Now I'm very happy the unions protect some employees, people who do try and do good work that I'd fear the company would take advantage of them without the union's protection, but the majority would use union rules to their benefit. Good example, I was sitting in the smoke break room one day and one union operator says to the other, "I told her if she kept coming into work drunk everyday and sleeping through her shift in the back they were going to fire her, but she didn't believe me". I have a lot of anecdotal evidence like that. Now, I only have experience with the unions around here so maybe things are different in other parts of the country, but I have a lot of personal experience locally with union corruption and strong-arming that makes me very much against what they stand for. I don't resent friends that work in the unions, sure all of them had parents/relatives that got them in, we just don't discuss it. But, please, I've actually seen some very strong cases of sloth and corruption so at the very least you cannot make a blanket statement that all unions are good. My experience is I have a much more stressful position, work harder, worked hard to put myself through school, yet make less than the union workers.

 

[BlancoNino]

Originally posted by: BoomerD
Blanco, you always bash unions...every post you make on the subject is pure union bashing. One thing you fail to consider, is that if the unions all closed up tomorrow, wages would plummet. The higher union wages are what keeps scab employers from paying everyone $5/ hr (or less) THEY have to compete against the unions to keep their better hands. As for keeping the "entry-level" companies out of the jobs...I don't necessarily see that as a bad thing. Why would you want a roadway, building or bridge built by a company with no experience, that hires in-experienced employees? It's been proven numerous times, that union labor (at least in the building trades) is far more efficient, and better trained than the RATS ( non-union counterparts), and get the job done faster and cheaper than the RATS...
Let's see...I make between $35-$40/hr PLUS great benefits, and pay about 50 cents/hr in union dues.
The NON-union contractors (RATCO) around here (on non-prevailing wage jobs) pay about $15-$20/hr, with few or NO benefits...I consider the difference to be what is called Non-Union dues...(what it costs you to be non-union) All too often, the RATCO contractors pay their employees (on prevailing wage jobs) the appropriate wage scale, but then demand a rebate. Happens quite frequently, and we have people who watch for that all the time. Another "trick" is to send someone to the jobsite...say a mechanic, who would be entitled to $35/hr plus the benefits, but instead, lists them as a laborer, so they can pay them about $10/hour less. We do our best to catch those kinds of crooks, and prosecute them...


Damn, I almost forgot...OP...what's orange and sleeps 6? A Cal-Trans truck!

They don't get the job done cheaper because they pay their workers much more. I have no problem with union contractors, just the Davis-Bacon act that means all the government work goes right to them. Just an example of government benefitting the rich (as all government does).

 

[judasmachine]

remember next months chocolate ration will be raised to 2 oz.

 

[BoomerD]

Originally posted by: BlancoNino

Originally posted by: BoomerD
Blanco, you always bash unions...every post you make on the subject is pure union bashing. One thing you fail to consider, is that if the unions all closed up tomorrow, wages would plummet. The higher union wages are what keeps scab employers from paying everyone $5/ hr (or less) THEY have to compete against the unions to keep their better hands. As for keeping the "entry-level" companies out of the jobs...I don't necessarily see that as a bad thing. Why would you want a roadway, building or bridge built by a company with no experience, that hires in-experienced employees? It's been proven numerous times, that union labor (at least in the building trades) is far more efficient, and better trained than the RATS ( non-union counterparts), and get the job done faster and cheaper than the RATS...
Let's see...I make between $35-$40/hr PLUS great benefits, and pay about 50 cents/hr in union dues.
The NON-union contractors (RATCO) around here (on non-prevailing wage jobs) pay about $15-$20/hr, with few or NO benefits...I consider the difference to be what is called Non-Union dues...(what it costs you to be non-union) All too often, the RATCO contractors pay their employees (on prevailing wage jobs) the appropriate wage scale, but then demand a rebate. Happens quite frequently, and we have people who watch for that all the time. Another "trick" is to send someone to the jobsite...say a mechanic, who would be entitled to $35/hr plus the benefits, but instead, lists them as a laborer, so they can pay them about $10/hour less. We do our best to catch those kinds of crooks, and prosecute them...


Damn, I almost forgot...OP...what's orange and sleeps 6? A Cal-Trans truck!

They don't get the job done cheaper because they pay their workers much more. I have no problem with union contractors, just the Davis-Bacon act that means all the government work goes right to them. Just an example of government benefitting the rich (as all government does).

The city I live in did away with the "little Davis-Bacon Act", and contractore do NOT have to pay prevailing wages on city funded projects, as long as there is no state or federal funds involved. 95% of those jobs go to....yep, UNION contractors who can UNDERBID their non-union competition, even their competition can pay their workers half (or less) what the union companies do. THAT proves that the union workers can do the work cheaper, by being better trained and more efficient.
You can blah-blah all you want with your union hating BS, but it just don't hold up to the truth...


Slammy, sure, there's nepotism in many unions...just like in any industry, and sure, some people abuse the system to a point, that makes a mockery of it...doesn't happen here in No Cal too often. No one will put up with it...If you can't do your job, and do it right, you go down the road...if you're sent back to the hall 3 times as "unqualified" you have to go to the training center and prove you ARE qualified before you can get dispatched again in that job...Seems like it's places like factories and "government jobs" where most of the union complaints tend to originate. Construction is too competitive, and the bidding gets too close to tolerate much slacking...

 

[Chaotic42]

Originally posted by: BlancoNino
It's different everywhere. I'm out of school now, everyone quit making me think so hard. I'm tired of being on 1 side of a debate against 2,3,4, sometimes 8 other people

That's often a sign that you're wrong.

Dartworth has made me reconsider my stance on unions recently.

 

[BlancoNino]

Originally posted by: Chaotic42

Originally posted by: BlancoNino
It's different everywhere. I'm out of school now, everyone quit making me think so hard. I'm tired of being on 1 side of a debate against 2,3,4, sometimes 8 other people

That's often a sign that you're wrong.

Dartworth has made me reconsider my stance on unions recently.

Unions can really go either way...short term they are probably great for the workers...but it often times results in long-term failures for businesses. I point to Boeing, GM, Ford, UPS (which is starting to get really crappy) to start with. Sure you could argue that there are other reasons for those companies going down the tubes...but they all share that one thing....STRONG UNIONS.

 

[manlymatt83]

Congrats!!

 

[Sentrosi2121]

Congrats! Been a State worker for New York for almost 5 years. And I'll give you exactly 4 months to say to your wife/gf/significant after that person asks how your day went, "Same as yesterday."

Working right now. 7pm til 8am Friday thru Monday morning. Gotta love 4 days off!

 

[Slammy1]

Originally posted by: BoomerD
[Slammy, sure, there's nepotism in many unions...just like in any industry, and sure, some people abuse the system to a point, that makes a mockery of it...doesn't happen here in No Cal too often. No one will put up with it...If you can't do your job, and do it right, you go down the road...if you're sent back to the hall 3 times as "unqualified" you have to go to the training center and prove you ARE qualified before you can get dispatched again in that job...Seems like it's places like factories and "government jobs" where most of the union complaints tend to originate. Construction is too competitive, and the bidding gets too close to tolerate much slacking...

I have to admit I really hated how they treated the blue collar workers when I lived in Florida, my friends working in typically union positions were paid bad and treated bad. Yt opened my eyes that that the unions do have a place (esp in places like CA where there's a large immigrant population). It's nice to hear that they are better outside this area, even aside from unions this is a big area for organized crime (I remember growing up my grandmother would pay off the county sheriff to operate her tavern, which was pretty shady with poker in the front and underage drinking). We even got a spot on 60 minutes for having a corrupt police force, things they did worse than in LA (we're higher crime rate than LA).

btw, I apologize for contributing to the hijacking of the thread. Congrats on your new position.