It's Official - I am now a State Worker

[BlancoNino]

Originally posted by: piasabird
As an IT worker for a community college in Illinois, I work for the State.

I dont see any high wages coming my way.

I am barely making enough money to be considered middle-class. Maybe not even enough for that. Maybe the lowest of the low end of middle-class.

My friend was a worker for a community college in a computer lab here. He made 9 dollars an hour to sit at a computer and do homework...sometimes 10 an hour. Rarely did anybody need his help...maybe once or twice a week.

 

[dartworth]

Originally posted by: BlancoNino

Originally posted by: dartworth
This government set wage for construction workers is the prevailing wage. It doesn't matter if the contractor is union or nonunion. When working on a government project, union and nonunion workers are paid the same.

Please stop with the stereotype of union workers being thugs. Besides, constuction workers don't get to sit on their ass all day and neff it up on AT.

Why don't you take a look at those lobbying to keep the Davis-Bacon Act? All union construction workers/owners. They are paid the same, but the union companies and high end workers almost always get the government bid for the jobs and all the money. Unfair to entry-level. It's keeping them near the bottom.

I drove by some construction "workers" the other day on a street they've been doing construction on for quite awhile. I saw 3 guys talking, 1 guy sitting in a truck, 2 people holding signs, and no work getting done. Came back down a half hour later and saw the same thing. Our tax dollars hard at work.

I don't have to look at those trying to keep the DBA, I pay for those efforts every paycheck, and I fully support it.

Union contractors will get the contracts because they submitted a competitive bid. The bidding process is set by the customer and has nothing to do with fairness.

The big advantages that a union contractor has is that they provide superior work by highly trained workers. The contractor also has a large man pool to draw from when they need workers. When they hire more men from the union hall, they know they are getting workers which will perform. Also, when the job is over, most of the workers will be laid off if there is not another job to go to.

People believe that being in a union you can?t get fired or laid off. It doesn?t work that way in the building trades. If you don?t perform at work, you are gone. Contractors can?t afford to carry any dead weight. They just don?t have the margins for it anymore. That is how competitive things are now in construction.

As far as what you think you saw when you drove past those workers. Go ahead and make all the assumptions you want. They may have been waiting for parts or an inspector. More than likely they were waiting some engineer to make up his mind after he missed a few items in the original bid. Now they need to figure out who is going to pay for it.

Don?t bitch about ?our tax dollars at work?. That job can get done in 8 weeks or 8 months. More than likely it is a contract job and it is going to cost the same no matter when it get done. As long as it?s done by the completion date stipulated in the contract.

 

[BlancoNino]

Originally posted by: dartworth
I don't have to look at those trying to keep the DBA, I pay for those efforts every paycheck, and I fully support it.

Union contractors will get the contracts because they submitted a competitive bid. The bidding process is set by the customer and has nothing to do with fairness.

The big advantages that a union contractor has is that they provide superior work by highly trained workers. The contractor also has a large man pool to draw from when they need workers. When they hire more men from the union hall, they know they are getting workers which will perform. Also, when the job is over, most of the workers will be laid off if there is not another job to go to.

People believe that being in a union you can?t get fired or laid off. It doesn?t work that way in the building trades. If you don?t perform at work, you are gone. Contractors can?t afford to carry any dead weight. They just don?t have the margins for it anymore. That is how competitive things are now in construction.

As far as what you think you saw when you drove past those workers. Go ahead and make all the assumptions you want. They may have been waiting for parts or an inspector. More than likely they were waiting some engineer to make up his mind after he missed a few items in the original bid. Now they need to figure out who is going to pay for it.

Don?t bitch about ?our tax dollars at work?. That job can get done in 8 weeks or 8 months. More than likely it is a contract job and it is going to cost the same no matter when it get done. As long as it?s done by the completion date stipulated in the contract.

Everything you said has supported my argument that the Davis-Bacon Act is in place to give the higher payed upper-end union workers more jobs AND keep the work in the hands of big union contractors. I know it takes a little bit of intelligence to really think this out, so I'll give you a couple days to think about it. Thank you.

 

[dartworth]

Originally posted by: BlancoNino

Originally posted by: dartworth
I don't have to look at those trying to keep the DBA, I pay for those efforts every paycheck, and I fully support it.

Union contractors will get the contracts because they submitted a competitive bid. The bidding process is set by the customer and has nothing to do with fairness.

The big advantages that a union contractor has is that they provide superior work by highly trained workers. The contractor also has a large man pool to draw from when they need workers. When they hire more men from the union hall, they know they are getting workers which will perform. Also, when the job is over, most of the workers will be laid off if there is not another job to go to.

People believe that being in a union you can?t get fired or laid off. It doesn?t work that way in the building trades. If you don?t perform at work, you are gone. Contractors can?t afford to carry any dead weight. They just don?t have the margins for it anymore. That is how competitive things are now in construction.

As far as what you think you saw when you drove past those workers. Go ahead and make all the assumptions you want. They may have been waiting for parts or an inspector. More than likely they were waiting some engineer to make up his mind after he missed a few items in the original bid. Now they need to figure out who is going to pay for it.

Don?t bitch about ?our tax dollars at work?. That job can get done in 8 weeks or 8 months. More than likely it is a contract job and it is going to cost the same no matter when it get done. As long as it?s done by the completion date stipulated in the contract.

Everything you said has supported my argument that the Davis-Bacon Act is in place to give the higher payed upper-end union workers more jobs AND keep the work in the hands of big union contractors. I know it takes a little bit of intelligence to really think this out, so I'll give you a couple days to think about it. Thank you.

A very well thought out and infomative response.

The Davis-Bacon Act requires paying prevailing wage on pubilc work projects. It has nothing to do with private industry.

When it comes down to it, nonunion shops for the most part can not compete with a union shops. They do not provide qaulity work which is done on time and in a safe manner. Plan and simple...

 

[Corporate Thug]

welcome to the bureaucracy

 

[BlancoNino]

Originally posted by: dartworth

A very well thought out and infomative response.

1. The Davis-Bacon Act requires paying prevailing wage on pubilc work projects. It has nothing to do with private industry.

2. When it comes down to it, nonunion shops for the most part can not compete with a union shops. They do not provide qaulity work which is done on time and in a safe manner. Plan and simple...

1. Yes I know...your point?

2. Completely untrue and a blatant lie. You're out.

 

[dartworth]

Originally posted by: BlancoNino

Originally posted by: dartworth

A very well thought out and infomative response.

1. The Davis-Bacon Act requires paying prevailing wage on pubilc work projects. It has nothing to do with private industry.

2. When it comes down to it, nonunion shops for the most part can not compete with a union shops. They do not provide qaulity work which is done on time and in a safe manner. Plan and simple...

1. Yes I know...your point?

2. Completely untrue and a blatant lie. You're out.

A lie? I've been in the industry for over 15 years, and have worked on some fairly large projects around the country. I like to think I know a little bit of what I am talking about.

Everyone is entitled to their own opinion. However try to be a little more informed when forming one.

 

[BlancoNino]

Originally posted by: dartworth
A lie? I've been in the industry for over 15 years, and have worked on some fairly large projects around the country. I like to think I know a little bit of what I am talking about.

Everyone is entitled to their own opinion. However try to be a little more informed when forming one.

My grandpa was in construction for YEARS and did some major non-union projects. He retired doing some easy work for a union company and a lot of the upper-management and other workers told him that there was no way they could have ever done some of the projects he's done.

 

[dartworth]

Originally posted by: BlancoNino

Originally posted by: dartworth
A lie? I've been in the industry for over 15 years, and have worked on some fairly large projects around the country. I like to think I know a little bit of what I am talking about.

Everyone is entitled to their own opinion. However try to be a little more informed when forming one.

My grandpa was in construction for YEARS and did some major non-union projects. He retired doing some easy work for a union company and a lot of the upper-management and other workers told him that there was no way they could have ever done some of the projects he's done.

I know you are trying to make a point, but I just can't find it...

 

[BlancoNino]

Originally posted by: dartworth

Originally posted by: BlancoNino

Originally posted by: dartworth
A lie? I've been in the industry for over 15 years, and have worked on some fairly large projects around the country. I like to think I know a little bit of what I am talking about.

Everyone is entitled to their own opinion. However try to be a little more informed when forming one.

My grandpa was in construction for YEARS and did some major non-union projects. He retired doing some easy work for a union company and a lot of the upper-management and other workers told him that there was no way they could have ever done some of the projects he's done.

I know you are trying to make a point, but I just can't find it...

You said non-union shops can't compete. I said BS and gave you a good example.

 

[lytalbayre]

:beer: for job security.

I give you 1 year before you're bored to tears. 5 before you absolutely are dying to get back in the private sector.

 

[dartworth]

Originally posted by: BlancoNino


You said non-union shops can't compete. I said BS and gave you a good example.

No, I said for the most part a nonunion shop can't compete. I know for a fact that there are nonunion companies that provide quality work. I also know that most of them pay their workers substantially less and provide little to no benefits.

Nobody forced me to join a union. But being in a union, I know I will have excellent training, good working conditions, fair compensation, and a safe work environment. You won?t get those benefits working for most nonunion shops.

Call BS all you want. I see what is going on in the industry everyday.

 

[BlancoNino]

Originally posted by: dartworth

Originally posted by: BlancoNino


You said non-union shops can't compete. I said BS and gave you a good example.

No, I said for the most part a nonunion shop can't compete. I know for a fact that there are nonunion companies that provide quality work. I also know that most of them pay their workers substantially less and provide little to no benefits.

Nobody forced me to join a union. But being in a union, I know I will have excellent training, good working conditions, fair compensation, and a safe work environment. You won?t get those benefits working for most nonunion shops.

Call BS all you want. I see what is going on in the industry everyday.

If I owned a construction company I'd be pissed if it became unionized...wouldn't really own it anymore.

 

[dartworth]

Originally posted by: BlancoNino

If I owned a construction company I'd be pissed if it became unionized...wouldn't really own it anymore.

Well that is your choice. I can see this conversation is regressing fairly quickly now.

Take it easy and good luck.

 

[jadinolf]

Originally posted by: bigfil
I was just given the news that I was hired on as a permanent employee with the Legislative Data Center working for the state of California

:beer::beer::beer:s all around

im so damn stoked
no more worrying about layoffs
no more bs from craptastic bosses
as my boss is just kewl

Working?

 

[olds]

Originally posted by: BlancoNino

Originally posted by: oldsmoboat

Originally posted by: BlancoNino
And if you want a raise they'll give it to you at the expense of the tax payers without thinking twice!

Hey, ****** for brains. Who do you think fixed the roads your mother drives you on taking you to your ballet lessons?
You going to do it?

Union construction workers hired by the state to work at a government set wage (Davis-Bacon Act) that is much too high and allows the union thugs to keep their jobs at a high wage without worrying about base-level workers taking their jobs all at the expense of tax payers. That's who fixes the roads.

As usual, you don't know what you are talking about. But then, that suprises no one. What is the wage you are talking about? Here, break it down for us, please fill in the $$:

State Highwayworker pay:
Private contractor Highwayworker pay:
Prevailing wage Highwayworker pay:

 

[BlancoNino]

Originally posted by: oldsmoboat

Originally posted by: BlancoNino

Originally posted by: oldsmoboat

Originally posted by: BlancoNino
And if you want a raise they'll give it to you at the expense of the tax payers without thinking twice!

Hey, ****** for brains. Who do you think fixed the roads your mother drives you on taking you to your ballet lessons?
You going to do it?

Union construction workers hired by the state to work at a government set wage (Davis-Bacon Act) that is much too high and allows the union thugs to keep their jobs at a high wage without worrying about base-level workers taking their jobs all at the expense of tax payers. That's who fixes the roads.

As usual, you don't know what you are talking about. But then, that suprises no one. What is the wage you are talking about? Here, break it down for us, please fill in the $$:

State Highwayworker pay:
Private contractor Highwayworker pay:
Prevailing wage Highwayworker pay:

It's different everywhere. I'm out of school now, everyone quit making me think so hard. I'm tired of being on 1 side of a debate against 2,3,4, sometimes 8 other people

 

[olds]

Originally posted by: BlancoNino

Originally posted by: oldsmoboat

Originally posted by: BlancoNino

Originally posted by: oldsmoboat

Originally posted by: BlancoNino
And if you want a raise they'll give it to you at the expense of the tax payers without thinking twice!

Hey, ****** for brains. Who do you think fixed the roads your mother drives you on taking you to your ballet lessons?
You going to do it?

Union construction workers hired by the state to work at a government set wage (Davis-Bacon Act) that is much too high and allows the union thugs to keep their jobs at a high wage without worrying about base-level workers taking their jobs all at the expense of tax payers. That's who fixes the roads.

As usual, you don't know what you are talking about. But then, that suprises no one. What is the wage you are talking about? Here, break it down for us, please fill in the $$:

State Highwayworker pay:
Private contractor Highwayworker pay:
Prevailing wage Highwayworker pay:

It's different everywhere. I'm out of school now, everyone quit making me think so hard. I'm tired of being on 1 side of a debate against 2,3,4, sometimes 8 other people

Let me give you a clue. I have worked for the State of California for 16 years. I work in the Transportation Division. I didn't get my information though osmosis because my grandpa did this or that. I have lived it for 16 years.
If you think a private contractor or prevailing wage employee makes the same of LESS than I do, you are sadly mistaken.
We are short people right now because no one will take the jobs. Try living in the Bay Area or LA on what an operator for the State makes:
Base Salary Range: 2991.00 - 3259.00
Sound like prevailing wage to you?

 

[bctbct]

Originally posted by: BlancoNino


It's different everywhere. I'm out of school now, everyone quit making me think so hard. I'm tired of being on 1 side of a debate against 2,3,4, sometimes 8 other people

Usually the first sign that you dont know what you are talking about. I worked 11 hours today for a union contractor and have to work tommorrow, you?

 

[Svnla]

Originally posted by: dartworth
No, I said for the most part a nonunion shop can't compete. I know for a fact that there are nonunion companies that provide quality work. I also know that most of them pay their workers substantially less and provide little to no benefits.

Nobody forced me to join a union. But being in a union, I know I will have excellent training, good working conditions, fair compensation, and a safe work environment. You won?t get those benefits working for most nonunion shops.

Call BS all you want. I see what is going on in the industry everyday.

Don't know about contruction but in the auto industry, Honda/Nissan/Toyota plants are paying their workers pretty well <salary,benefits,training, working condition, etc.>. IRRC, UAW tried many times to set up unions in those plants and they hadn't been able to do so.

Nobody forced you to join a union? Try to tell the people that didn't join the union and see their names in the union newsletter every week and the treatment/dirtly looks and other tactics from union people.

The funny thing is nonunion plants from Honda/Nissan/Toyota are running full speed to crank out vehicles, while union plants are shutting down or cutting back production <see GM/Ford news in the last few months>. Must be those poor quality craftmanship prducts from nonunion shops that American public love to buy...eh?.

<<<-----worked amost 10 years for the largest <or soon to be former> auto maker in the world <you can guess which one..lol.> so I do know what I am talking about.

 

[madeupfacts]

blah more lazy worthless govenment employees

 

[HomeAppraiser]

So what department / job did you get hired at???

 

[BoomerD]

Congrats to ya! I've worked with Cal-Trans people for many years, and while I was a business agent, represented the workers in B.U. 12 Talk about underpaid employees...sheesh, they made about 1/2 what our members in the construction trades make, with lesser benefit packages. Even with that, still not BAD jobs, but certainly not the gold mine some posters are painting this to be.

Blanco, you always bash unions...every post you make on the subject is pure union bashing. One thing you fail to consider, is that if the unions all closed up tomorrow, wages would plummet. The higher union wages are what keeps scab employers from paying everyone $5/ hr (or less) THEY have to compete against the unions to keep their better hands. As for keeping the "entry-level" companies out of the jobs...I don't necessarily see that as a bad thing. Why would you want a roadway, building or bridge built by a company with no experience, that hires in-experienced employees? It's been proven numerous times, that union labor (at least in the building trades) is far more efficient, and better trained than the RATS ( non-union counterparts), and get the job done faster and cheaper than the RATS...
Let's see...I make between $35-$40/hr PLUS great benefits, and pay about 50 cents/hr in union dues.
The NON-union contractors (RATCO) around here (on non-prevailing wage jobs) pay about $15-$20/hr, with few or NO benefits...I consider the difference to be what is called Non-Union dues...(what it costs you to be non-union) All too often, the RATCO contractors pay their employees (on prevailing wage jobs) the appropriate wage scale, but then demand a rebate. Happens quite frequently, and we have people who watch for that all the time. Another "trick" is to send someone to the jobsite...say a mechanic, who would be entitled to $35/hr plus the benefits, but instead, lists them as a laborer, so they can pay them about $10/hour less. We do our best to catch those kinds of crooks, and prosecute them...


Damn, I almost forgot...OP...what's orange and sleeps 6? A Cal-Trans truck!

 

[Tobolo]

<--- Govt worker

What is this thing you call a raise? i think last year eveyone got like 1.25%.

 

[Whisper]

Originally posted by: BlancoNino

Originally posted by: dartworth
A lie? I've been in the industry for over 15 years, and have worked on some fairly large projects around the country. I like to think I know a little bit of what I am talking about.

Everyone is entitled to their own opinion. However try to be a little more informed when forming one.

My grandpa was in construction for YEARS and did some major non-union projects. He retired doing some easy work for a union company and a lot of the upper-management and other workers told him that there was no way they could have ever done some of the projects he's done.

In all honesty, I'd trust the word of someone who's personally worked in the business for 15+ years over the word of someone who's grandfather worked in the business for however long. But that's just me.

Edit: as far as high starting wages go, it really depends on where you'll be working. I know that when I interviewed for DFACS (Dept. of Family and Child Services) in GA, the starting pay for a master's level worker was around $30k; bachelor's was maybe $22k. Prisons pay a bit more because, quite frankly, it's a high-risk environment, and not many people can/would work there.