It is possible that Islam has a better understanding of God than Christianity

[Doc Savage Fan]

It's possible everybody is wrong.

That's highly likely imo.

 

[piasabird]

I would not say that Jesus taught people to be pacifists. He whipped and punished the money changers at the temple for desecrating the temple grounds. He also taught a very important parable about the demands of justice and paying your debts. In the bible God used the unrighteous to punish the the sinners. He also sent prophets to testify that people need to repent to offer them a chance to repent.

God was willing to show mercy if people repented of their sins. If you look at the story of the reluctant prophet Noah (Swallowed By Whale), he was commanded to preach repentence and he tried to run away in fear. He eventually did preach repentence and the people repented of their sins and God Blessed them.

Jesus did teach mercy and compassion, but dont confuse that for being a pacifist.

 

[shadow9d9]

Is it possible that atheists are wrong and are wasting their lives?

Since there isn't a shred of evidence, I go to logic. There is a chance there are unicorns too.. just ridiculously unlikely.

 

[piasabird]

How come most religious leaders of islam are also facist totalitarian leaders who demean women and want to kill everyone who will not follow their authority. They also kill their fellow muslims they have disagreements with i.e. Shia/Sunni. They teach religious hatred and persecution, and religious Murder. It is all about power, not compassion and mercy.

 

[1prophet]

No, its an observation.

Using all the current infomation availible, the only sane and logic conclusion to make is that god doesn't exist.

In just the same way that all the evidence shows that unicorns dont exist.

If factual infomation comes to light that contradicts this, I will be happy to reevaluate my position.

What factual information would you deem acceptable?

 

[Doc Savage Fan]

Since there isn't a shred of evidence, I go to logic. There is a chance there are unicorns too.. just ridiculously unlikely.

Atheists are in the vast minority as about 3.8% of the world's population are considered atheist. Some type of spirituality is normative...which is quite odd considering "there isn't a shred of evidence". Consider this...logic and religiosity are not mutually exclusive paradigms.

 

[Doc Savage Fan]

I would not say that Jesus taught people to be pacifists. He whipped and punished the money changers at the temple for desecrating the temple grounds. He also taught a very important parable about the demands of justice and paying your debts. In the bible God used the unrighteous to punish the the sinners. He also sent prophets to testify that people need to repent to offer them a chance to repent.

God was willing to show mercy if people repented of their sins. If you look at the story of the reluctant prophet Noah (Swallowed By Whale), he was commanded to preach repentence and he tried to run away in fear. He eventually did preach repentence and the people repented of their sins and God Blessed them.

Jesus did teach mercy and compassion, but dont confuse that for being a pacifist.

Jonah....and it really pissed him off that Ninevah repented.

 

[Orignal Earl]

Given that "God" is an entirely fictional concept made up by people, with no evidence whatsoever to support its existence, EVERYONE's understanding of God is equally invalid.

And yet the US is by far the most religious western country and this very much influences your politics, whether you can admit it or not
Oh, and of course don't forget according to ALOT of posters here, Islam is the greatest threat to mankind and is trying to take over the world

 

[micrometers]

And yet the US is by far the most religious western country and this very much influences your politics, whether you can admit it or not
Oh, and of course don't forget according to ALOT of posters here, Islam is the greatest threat to mankind and is trying to take over the world

That is what we would call projection of inner psychological states onto others. Much of fundie christianity is practically devil worship given the emphasis on hell, and so they see evil in everyone.

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

Since there isn't a shred of evidence, I go to logic. There is a chance there are unicorns too.. just ridiculously unlikely.

What a small world some people live in. "Logic" is a system that an animal species with a three pound brain use to fit everything into a box. I accept that there are many things that a finite mind cannot understand simply because we are finite. Consequently I wouldn't point down from the pedestal you've placed yourself upon. There are atheists who are quite willing to pass on the attitude. Those happen to be the most intelligent of the lot though

 

[JEDIYoda]

Oh, and of course don't forget according to ALOT of posters here, Islam is the greatest threat to mankind and is trying to take over the world

Thank you for the revelation!!! My eyes have finally been opened.....

 

[JEDIYoda]

Indeed , even you were....


Quote:




Abū Rayhān al-Bīrūnī, an Islamic scholar and polymath scientist, understood natural law as the law of the jungle. He argued that the antagonism between human beings can only be overcome through a divine law, which he believed to have been sent through prophets. This is also the position of the Ashari school, the largest school of Sunni theology.[72] Averroes (Ibn Rushd), in his treatise on Justice and Jihad and his commentary on Plato's Republic, writes that the human mind can know of the unlawfulness of killing and stealing and thus of the five maqasid or higher intents of the Islamic sharia or to protect religion, life, property, offspring, and reason. The concept of natural law entered the mainstream of Western culture through his Aristotelian commentaries, influencing the subsequent Averroist movement and the writings of Thomas Aquinas.[73]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Natural_law

so what do you know other than you posted a link that you probably know very little about...........

The universe obeys certain rules—laws to which all things must adhere. These laws are precise, and many of them are mathematical in nature. Natural laws are hierarchical in nature; secondary laws of nature are based on primary laws of nature, which have to be just right in order for our universe to be possible. But, where did these laws come from, and why do they exist? If the universe were merely the accidental by-product of a big bang, then why should it obey orderly principles—or any principles at all for that matter? Such laws are consistent with biblical creation. Natural laws exist because the universe has a Creator God who is logical and has imposed order on His universe (Genesis 1:1).

The Word of God

Everything in the universe, every plant and animal, every rock, every particle of matter or light wave, is bound by laws which it has no choice but to obey. The Bible tells us that there are laws of nature—“ordinances of heaven and earth” (Jeremiah 33:25). These laws describe the way God normally accomplishes His will in the universe.

God’s logic is built into the universe, and so the universe is not haphazard or arbitrary. It obeys laws of chemistry that are logically derived from the laws of physics, many of which can be logically derived from other laws of physics and laws of mathematics. The most fundamental laws of nature exist only because God wills them to; they are the logical, orderly way that the Lord upholds and sustains the universe He has created. The atheist is unable to account for the logical, orderly state of the universe. Why should the universe obey laws if there is no law-giver? But laws of nature are perfectly consistent with biblical creation. In fact, the Bible is the foundation for natural laws.

http://www.answersingenesis.org/articles/am/v1/n2/God-natural-law

 

[davmat787]

I think you have a point and it should be titled "who gives a fuck".

Another reason for a separate forum for religion: In any thread even tangentially related to religion, there are a group of posters who always thread crap with "sky ferry" type comments that add absolutely nothing to the conversation. There are plenty in this thread I am sure. With a separate forum, there could be separate rules regarding thread crapping like this if needed.

Besides, the founders saw fit to try to separate politics from religion, so maybe we should too.

Ausm: Glad you and I can agree on something for once. :thumbsup:

And I am not religious at all, last time I was in a church was probably 35 years ago. However, I do think many comments in religious threads go unchecked that if were in regular political thread (heh, regular political thread?) would not.

 

[Orignal Earl]

Thank you for the revelation!!! My eyes have finally been opened.....

Lol

See...

When you where in Military intel did you pass the spiritual part?

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

Another reason for a separate forum for religion: In any thread even tangentially related to religion, there are a group of posters who always thread crap with "sky ferry" type comments that add absolutely nothing to the conversation. There are plenty in this thread I am sure. With a separate forum, there could be separate rules regarding thread crapping like this if needed.

Besides, the founders saw fit to try to separate politics from religion, so maybe we should too.

Ausm: Glad you and I can agree on something for once. :thumbsup:

And I am not religious at all, last time I was in a church was probably 35 years ago. However, I do think many comments in religious threads go unchecked that if were in regular political thread (heh, regular political thread?) would not.

It would seem that under the new rules that those who attack atheists or the religious will be sanctioned, unless religious bigotry is accepted.

 

[Orignal Earl]

Should of had this in my last post, but took me a minute to find it

http://scienceblogs.com/dispatches/2010/12/army_declares_atheists_spiritu.php#more

 

[davmat787]

It would seem that under the new rules that those who attack atheists or the religious will be sanctioned, unless religious bigotry is accepted.

Hopefully that will be the case, but I still envision many who will ride that line right to the edge to antagonize those who choose to post in a thread related to religion.

Maybe it's the pedestal they seem to have placed themselves upon so highly that really irritates me. It is like they think anyone who chooses to be religious MUST prove to them that (insert deity(s) of relevance) exists in order to not be crapped upon. They have given themselves license to ridicule simply because they disagree, or have a different threshold for belief. Or simply don't understand faith. I don't know for sure, all I know is the comments are usually always of the same vein (how about some new ones besides unicorns assholes?) and are always inevitable.

 

[AnitaPeterson]

I think atheists have a better understanding of "God" than Christianity or any other religion.

Quoted for truth.

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

Hopefully that will be the case, but I still envision many who will ride that line right to the edge to antagonize those who choose to post in a thread related to religion.

Maybe it's the pedestal they seem to have placed themselves upon so highly that really irritates me. It is like they think anyone who chooses to be religious MUST prove to them that (insert deity(s) of relevance) exists in order to not be crapped upon. They have given themselves license to ridicule simply because they disagree, or have a different threshold for belief. Or simply don't understand faith. I don't know for sure, all I know is the comments are usually always of the same vein (how about some new ones besides unicorns assholes?) and are always inevitable.

That has been my primary objection to how these thread generally go. There are ways to make a point and to disagree with someone without demonstrating how high they score on the asshole scale. That's why I think more highly of Martin Rees than someone like Dawkins and his ilk. We'll see how it goes in the near future.

 

[JEDIYoda]

I think atheists have a better understanding of "God" than Christianity or any other religion.

quoted for the irony....

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

Should of had this in my last post, but took me a minute to find it

http://scienceblogs.com/dispatches/2010/12/army_declares_atheists_spiritu.php#more

Assuming the contention is accurate then what done is wrong. Now would an atheistic government with an interest in removing religion be better?

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

quoted for the irony....

What many do not understand is their nature and that is where freedom and mastery lie. Being free from religion does not free them from themselves.

 

[The Green Bean]

It is incorrect to group "Islam" as one theological sect. Muslims have highly contradictory views on the essence of God. Some believe God a a physical entity. Some say He is spiritual and while others think He is neither. This subject has been the most debated amongst Muslim intellectuals for 1400 years.

103. No vision can grasp Him, but His grasp is over all vision: He is above all comprehension, yet is acquainted with all things.

22. Some faces, that Day, will beam (in brightness and beauty);-

23. Looking towards their Lord;

 

[The Green Bean]

How come most religious leaders of islam are also facist totalitarian leaders who demean women and want to kill everyone who will not follow their authority. They also kill their fellow muslims they have disagreements with i.e. Shia/Sunni. They teach religious hatred and persecution, and religious Murder. It is all about power, not compassion and mercy.

That's not true. You have been brainwashed by your media to believe so. There is admittedly a problem but not on the scale your government wants you to believe.

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

It is incorrect to group "Islam" as one theological sect. Muslims have highly contradictory views on the essence of God. Some believe God a a physical entity. Some say He is spiritual and while others think He is neither. This subject has been the most debated amongst Muslim intellectuals for 1400 years.

That is an excellent point. Most Westerners view Islam as a religion derived from the teachings of Mohammed, but there are indeed great divides within Islam itself as to what they mean. It's somewhat akin to Christianity as it is believed by Catholics and Protestants. One Jesus but different ways of thinking of how their religion ought to be.