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Israel celebrates its 60th Anniversary

Dari

Lifer
Oct 25, 2002
17,136
37
91
Celebrations began today but I believe the official date is May 14.

I hope they change their electoral system so they can have more stable governments going forward (and not be held hostage to small parties). This will lead to better governance.
 

BoomerD

No Lifer
Feb 26, 2006
56,532
4,933
126
And the USA celebrates its 60th year of propping them up...financially and militarily.
 

tvarad

Golden Member
Jun 25, 2001
1,130
0
0
BoomerD:

"And the USA celebrates its 60th year of propping them up...financially and militarily."

Go to the gas station, look at the prices and figure out who we are actually propping up in the ME.
 

MovingTarget

Diamond Member
Jun 22, 2003
8,990
84
91
Que President Ahmadijinidad (sp?) for yet another inflamatory Israel nonexistence quote....
 

IronWing

No Lifer
Jul 20, 2001
61,448
14,355
136
Originally posted by: tvarad
BoomerD:

"And the USA celebrates its 60th year of propping them up...financially and militarily."

Go to the gas station, look at the prices and figure out who we are actually propping up in the ME.
We get gas in return for our payments at the gas station. What do we get in return for our payments to Israel?
 

palehorse

Lifer
Dec 21, 2005
11,547
0
76
Originally posted by: ironwing
Originally posted by: tvarad
BoomerD:

"And the USA celebrates its 60th year of propping them up...financially and militarily."

Go to the gas station, look at the prices and figure out who we are actually propping up in the ME.
We get gas in return for our payments at the gas station. What do we get in return for our payments to Israel?
lots of headaches and unnecessary drama...?

our inexplicable relationship with them is certainly at odds with most of what our founding fathers believed...
 

tvarad

Golden Member
Jun 25, 2001
1,130
0
0
ironwing:

"We get gas in return for our payments at the gas station."

And to ensure that supply, we have to endure wars, 9/11, London and Madrid bombings, USS Cole and ceaseless attacks on everything the West stands for. All paid for with the money you feed to the gas pump God every time you fill up.
 

tvarad

Golden Member
Jun 25, 2001
1,130
0
0
palehorse74:

"our inexplicable relationship with them is certainly at odds with most of what our founding fathers believed..."

Right. I'm sure they'd be extremely upset about us be-friending a country patterned after most Western democracies. Whereas they'd be thrilled to bits about out warm and friendly relationships with the Saudi-Arabia, Egypt, Jordan and various other dictatorships in the Middle-East.
 

magomago

Lifer
Sep 28, 2002
10,973
14
76
Originally posted by: tvarad
palehorse74:

"our inexplicable relationship with them is certainly at odds with most of what our founding fathers believed..."

Right. I'm sure they'd be extremely upset about us be-friending a country patterned after most Western democracies. Whereas they'd be thrilled to bits about out warm and friendly relationships with the Saudi-Arabia, Egypt, Jordan and various other dictatorships in the Middle-East.
I think our entire mid east policy as a whole is at odds with the romanticized visions of the founding fathers
 

JD50

Lifer
Sep 4, 2005
11,056
363
126
Originally posted by: tvarad
palehorse74:

"our inexplicable relationship with them is certainly at odds with most of what our founding fathers believed..."

Right. I'm sure they'd be extremely upset about us be-friending a country patterned after most Western democracies. Whereas they'd be thrilled to bits about out warm and friendly relationships with the Saudi-Arabia, Egypt, Jordan and various other dictatorships in the Middle-East.
I'm hardly an expert on the subject, but after watching John Adams on HBO and seeing how we handled the French Revolution and Napolean taking power, I think you might be wrong. And yes I got the sarcasm and am responding to your actual thoughts on the subject.
 

Genx87

Lifer
Apr 8, 2002
41,086
493
126
Originally posted by: BoomerD
And the USA celebrates its 60th year of propping them up...financially and militarily.
Our financial aid didnt start until the late 60's early 70's.
 

RichardE

Banned
Dec 31, 2005
10,247
2
0
Originally posted by: tvarad
palehorse74:

"our inexplicable relationship with them is certainly at odds with most of what our founding fathers believed..."

Right. I'm sure they'd be extremely upset about us be-friending a country patterned after most Western democracies. Whereas they'd be thrilled to bits about out warm and friendly relationships with the Saudi-Arabia, Egypt, Jordan and various other dictatorships in the Middle-East.
What is really funny is the fact that Israel has received around 80-90 billion dollars in aid since the first 100k loan in 49, and other countries around Israel have seen somewhat equal amounts (50 billion to Egypt since 1975). Wonder why no one ever mentions this?


Either way, happy birthday Israel :beer:
 
Jun 26, 2007
11,925
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Happy birthday Israel!

I'm kind of in the middle of all of this, because i do believe that collectively punishing the population is a crime against humanity as stated in the Human rights international law, but then again, with hundreds of rockets a week raining down on a civilian population.... I think Israel has shown great restraint in the matter, anything less than eradicating them is showing restraint when they do not respect a cease fire agreement and when they use civilans to hide behind.

Now, if Israel would open up though, to show the Palestinians that they do not hate them (which i believe Hamas has done it's worst to make them believe), that if there are no attacks, then the borders will open up and while it may not be a negotiated peace, it will be a peace for the people.

The new settlings and that shit though, that is just fucking stupid and i don't know why it's happening, perhaps it's just Israel trying to piss off the world until they don't even have US as an ally, i really don't know but it's the stupidest move i've EVER seen a nation make (well except the US invading Iraq, but that's a given no1 of stupidity in this century)
 

Lemon law

Lifer
Nov 6, 2005
20,991
2
0
The JOS giant delusion is here---Now, if Israel would open up though, to show the Palestinians that they do not hate them

First Israel disenfranchised the Palestinians while taking their land, then herded them into concentrations camps, and for this the Palestinian people are supposed to LOVE ISRAEL??????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????

Earth to JOS, the right to return still drives this conflict. And if Israel would open up and return the land, you might be right.
But to add injury to insult, Israel keeps settling on the disputed land in which a future Palestinian State might be made up of.
 

RichardE

Banned
Dec 31, 2005
10,247
2
0
Originally posted by: Lemon law
The JOS giant delusion is here---Now, if Israel would open up though, to show the Palestinians that they do not hate them

First Israel disenfranchised the Palestinians while taking their land, then herded them into concentrations camps, and for this the Palestinian people are supposed to LOVE ISRAEL??????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????

Earth to JOS, the right to return still drives this conflict. And if Israel would open up and return the land, you might be right.
But to add injury to insult, Israel keeps settling on the disputed land in which a future Palestinian State might be made up of.
If you paid attention to this conflict at all you would know the land being settled is land that will not be returned at all ever, as has been stated time and time again. All the border proposals drawn up for a two state solution do not include this land, nor have the arabs ever claimed (until very very recently) that there was anything wrong with this. Only recently have they been bitching about it.
 

brandonb

Diamond Member
Oct 17, 2006
3,731
2
0
Originally posted by: RichardE

What is really funny is the fact that Israel has received around 80-90 billion dollars in aid since the first 100k loan in 49, and other countries around Israel have seen somewhat equal amounts (50 billion to Egypt since 1975). Wonder why no one ever mentions this?


Either way, happy birthday Israel :beer:
Nobody mentions it because the amount of aid giong to Israel to other Arab nations around Israel is really like 3:1 in Israel's favor. The only reason we are paying other Arab states around Israel is to prevent them from attack Israel onsite. Its bribery. Either way, the USA is paying Israel and its neighbhors to keep the area stable.

To me, its just not worth it. The only thing Jews give us is Hollywood movies and our news media, but both are horseshit so I'd rather not pay and keep the money. The Arabs give us nothing but Oil. But we have to still buy it on the market like anybody else, so again, its horseshit and I'd rather keep the money.

My kids school is barely operational, I'd like to see our states receive the aid we'd send to Israel and its neighbhors instead. The funny thing is, Israel's schools are probably better than our own, and we are the ones funding Israel. /boggle.
 

Lemon law

Lifer
Nov 6, 2005
20,991
2
0
RichardE, Its quite apparent that you are only listening to the Israeli version of the truth.

The Oslo accords were the European US version, and then there is the Arab version that turns increasing less pragmatic.
 

RichardE

Banned
Dec 31, 2005
10,247
2
0
Originally posted by: brandonb
Originally posted by: RichardE

What is really funny is the fact that Israel has received around 80-90 billion dollars in aid since the first 100k loan in 49, and other countries around Israel have seen somewhat equal amounts (50 billion to Egypt since 1975). Wonder why no one ever mentions this?


Either way, happy birthday Israel :beer:
Nobody mentions it because the amount of aid giong to Israel to other Arab nations around Israel is really like 3:1 in Israel's favor. The only reason we are paying other Arab states around Israel is to prevent them from attack Israel onsite. Its bribery. Either way, the USA is paying Israel and its neighbhors to keep the area stable.

To me, its just not worth it. The only thing Jews give us is Hollywood movies and our news media, but both are horseshit so I'd rather not pay and keep the money. The Arabs give us nothing but Oil. But we have to still buy it on the market like anybody else, so again, its horseshit and I'd rather keep the money.

My kids school is barely operational, I'd like to see our states receive the aid we'd send to Israel and its neighbors instead. The funny thing is, Israel's schools are probably better than our own, and we are the ones funding Israel. /boggle.
Well, Israel to Egypt is a almost 2:1, more like a 1.5:1...and thats one Arab country. What about the rest thrown in? While I agree that US military aid should be dropping (as other aid has already been cut significantly.)

As well, the US spent more on cruise missiles last year than aid to Israel. The aid to Israel is not responsible to issues at home in the US, mismanagement is. 1-2billion a year is not going to fix the education issues in the US sadly. I'm not playing down the significance of the aid Israel receives, just saying that overall US/Israel have been working for a while now to cut all aid off and peoples anger at money misspent is better directed elsewhere (pork spending for example).
 

event8horizon

Senior member
Nov 15, 2007
675
0
0
thank u british gov and mr rothschild, job well done.


balfour declaration

Balfour Declaration of 1917: An official letter from the British Foreign Office headed by Arthur Balfour, the UK's Foreign Secretary (from December 1916 to October 1919), to Lord Rothschild, who was seen as a representative of the Jewish people. The letter stated that the British government "view[ed] with favour the establishment in Palestine of a national home for the Jewish people, and will use their best endeavours to facilitate the achievement of this object, it being clearly understood that nothing shall be done which may prejudice the civil and religious rights of existing non-Jewish communities in Palestine, or the rights and political status enjoyed by Jews in any other country".
 

RichardE

Banned
Dec 31, 2005
10,247
2
0
Originally posted by: Lemon law
RichardE, Its quite apparent that you are only listening to the Israeli version of the truth.

The Oslo accords were the European US version, and then there is the Arab version that turns increasing less pragmatic.
As I said already, only recently have the Arabs been complaining about the land Israel is now building upon. Until recently it was more or less agreed that would be Israels land with a right to return in effect. Now the Arabs want all of it *shrug*. It goes back to what I have said where they are trying to squeeze all they can out of peace agreements instead of coming to compromises.
 

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