Israel After Iraq

[Dari]

Am I the only person here that thinks Israel will be sacrificed after Iraq is dealt with? I mean, come on, conservative american administrations and right-wing Israeli governments do not mix. Their primary and secondary priorities in the Mid-East are oil and God, respectifully. Once Iraq has been liberated, like in 1991, Israel will be forced into an uncompromising position when it comes to the Palestinian issue. They may try to wiggle out of it like they did in the 1990s but it'll be a lot harder this time. While a liberated iraq is good for israel, that does not mean that iraq or other arabs will open their arms to the jewish state. No, Iraq will probably become another 'moderate' arab nation with vile hatred of israel. Iran and an arab union form the greatest threat to the security. That is what israel should worry about. In a situation like that, the US would be foolish to attack on of its 'friends and allies' (arabs) for the sake of another 'friend and ally' (Israel) should another arab/israeli conflict come about. Furthermore, with israeli policy choosing the primacy of a jewish state first and a democratic state second, the jewish state might implode before anyone attacks it.

All in all, until israel recognizes the arab issue from within and without, it is going to have a bleak future. As the United States take the entire arab world under her wings there could be infighting among 'friends and allies.' The best thing any administration could do would be to mediate, as it did between india and Pakistan.

 

[WinkOsmosis]

I think you're confused.

 

[Red Dawn]

Originally posted by: Dari
Am I the only person here that thinks Israel will be sacrificed after Iraq is dealt with? I mean, come on, conservative american administrations and right-wing Israeli governments do not mix. Their primary and secondary priorities in the Mid-East are oil and God, respectifully. Once Iraq has been liberated, like in 1991, Israel will be forced into an uncompromising position when it comes to the Palestinian issue. They may try to wiggle out of it like they did in the 1990s but it'll be a lot harder this time. While a liberated iraq is good for israel, that does not mean that iraq or other arabs will open their arms to the jewish state. No, Iraq will probably become another 'moderate' arab nation with vile hatred of israel. Iran and an arab union form the greatest threat to the security. That is what israel should worry about. In a situation like that, the US would be foolish to attack on of its 'friends and allies' (arabs) for the sake of another 'friend and ally' (Israel) should another arab/israeli conflict come about. Furthermore, with israeli policy choosing the primacy of a jewish state first and a democratic state second, the jewish state might implode before anyone attacks it.

All in all, until israel recognizes the arab issue from within and without, it is going to have a bleak future. As the United States take the entire arab world under her wings there could be infighting among 'friends and allies.' The best thing any administration could do would be to mediate, as it did between india and Pakistan.

Just a note. India had to negotiate in good faith with Pakistan because Pakistan has the ability to put a massive hurt on her. The Palistenians aren't in the same position with regards to Israel.

 

[Dari]

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: Dari
Am I the only person here that thinks Israel will be sacrificed after Iraq is dealt with? I mean, come on, conservative american administrations and right-wing Israeli governments do not mix. Their primary and secondary priorities in the Mid-East are oil and God, respectifully. Once Iraq has been liberated, like in 1991, Israel will be forced into an uncompromising position when it comes to the Palestinian issue. They may try to wiggle out of it like they did in the 1990s but it'll be a lot harder this time. While a liberated iraq is good for israel, that does not mean that iraq or other arabs will open their arms to the jewish state. No, Iraq will probably become another 'moderate' arab nation with vile hatred of israel. Iran and an arab union form the greatest threat to the security. That is what israel should worry about. In a situation like that, the US would be foolish to attack on of its 'friends and allies' (arabs) for the sake of another 'friend and ally' (Israel) should another arab/israeli conflict come about. Furthermore, with israeli policy choosing the primacy of a jewish state first and a democratic state second, the jewish state might implode before anyone attacks it.

All in all, until israel recognizes the arab issue from within and without, it is going to have a bleak future. As the United States take the entire arab world under her wings there could be infighting among 'friends and allies.' The best thing any administration could do would be to mediate, as it did between india and Pakistan.

Just a note. India had to negotiate in good faith with Pakistan because Pakistan has the ability to put a massive hurt on her. The Palistenians aren't in the same position with regards to Israel.

Not just the Palestinians, but Israeli arabs and other arab countries. Israel has to manage her internal and external issues better.

 

[Red Dawn]

Originally posted by: Dari

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: Dari
Am I the only person here that thinks Israel will be sacrificed after Iraq is dealt with? I mean, come on, conservative american administrations and right-wing Israeli governments do not mix. Their primary and secondary priorities in the Mid-East are oil and God, respectifully. Once Iraq has been liberated, like in 1991, Israel will be forced into an uncompromising position when it comes to the Palestinian issue. They may try to wiggle out of it like they did in the 1990s but it'll be a lot harder this time. While a liberated iraq is good for israel, that does not mean that iraq or other arabs will open their arms to the jewish state. No, Iraq will probably become another 'moderate' arab nation with vile hatred of israel. Iran and an arab union form the greatest threat to the security. That is what israel should worry about. In a situation like that, the US would be foolish to attack on of its 'friends and allies' (arabs) for the sake of another 'friend and ally' (Israel) should another arab/israeli conflict come about. Furthermore, with israeli policy choosing the primacy of a jewish state first and a democratic state second, the jewish state might implode before anyone attacks it.

All in all, until israel recognizes the arab issue from within and without, it is going to have a bleak future. As the United States take the entire arab world under her wings there could be infighting among 'friends and allies.' The best thing any administration could do would be to mediate, as it did between india and Pakistan.

Just a note. India had to negotiate in good faith with Pakistan because Pakistan has the ability to put a massive hurt on her. The Palistenians aren't in the same position with regards to Israel.

Not just the Palestinians, but Israeli arabs and other arab countries. Israel has to manage her internal and external issues better.

No doubt, but unlike India Israsel does so from a position of strentgh. I was just point out to you one of the major differences between the Indian/Pakistan Conflict and that if the Isralei/Arab conflict.

 

[Dari]

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: Dari

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: Dari
Am I the only person here that thinks Israel will be sacrificed after Iraq is dealt with? I mean, come on, conservative american administrations and right-wing Israeli governments do not mix. Their primary and secondary priorities in the Mid-East are oil and God, respectifully. Once Iraq has been liberated, like in 1991, Israel will be forced into an uncompromising position when it comes to the Palestinian issue. They may try to wiggle out of it like they did in the 1990s but it'll be a lot harder this time. While a liberated iraq is good for israel, that does not mean that iraq or other arabs will open their arms to the jewish state. No, Iraq will probably become another 'moderate' arab nation with vile hatred of israel. Iran and an arab union form the greatest threat to the security. That is what israel should worry about. In a situation like that, the US would be foolish to attack on of its 'friends and allies' (arabs) for the sake of another 'friend and ally' (Israel) should another arab/israeli conflict come about. Furthermore, with israeli policy choosing the primacy of a jewish state first and a democratic state second, the jewish state might implode before anyone attacks it.

All in all, until israel recognizes the arab issue from within and without, it is going to have a bleak future. As the United States take the entire arab world under her wings there could be infighting among 'friends and allies.' The best thing any administration could do would be to mediate, as it did between india and Pakistan.

Just a note. India had to negotiate in good faith with Pakistan because Pakistan has the ability to put a massive hurt on her. The Palistenians aren't in the same position with regards to Israel.

Not just the Palestinians, but Israeli arabs and other arab countries. Israel has to manage her internal and external issues better.

No doubt, but unlike India Israsel does so from a position of strentgh. I was just point out to you one of the major differences between the Indian/Pakistan Conflict and that if the Isralei/Arab conflict.

That is true. But let's also remember that Iran is less than a decade away from nuclear bombs. The arabs are less than a decade (or two) from economic and political union. The latter may sound far-fetched but the preliminary framework is building for a monetary union (at least starting with the rich gulf nations). When all is said and done, Israel could be marginalized politically and economically from all the unions forming around the globe. She has to deal with these political issues (religion and land) before she can be accepted.

 

[HeroOfPellinor]

Originally posted by: Dari

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: Dari

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: Dari
Am I the only person here that thinks Israel will be sacrificed after Iraq is dealt with? I mean, come on, conservative american administrations and right-wing Israeli governments do not mix. Their primary and secondary priorities in the Mid-East are oil and God, respectifully. Once Iraq has been liberated, like in 1991, Israel will be forced into an uncompromising position when it comes to the Palestinian issue. They may try to wiggle out of it like they did in the 1990s but it'll be a lot harder this time. While a liberated iraq is good for israel, that does not mean that iraq or other arabs will open their arms to the jewish state. No, Iraq will probably become another 'moderate' arab nation with vile hatred of israel. Iran and an arab union form the greatest threat to the security. That is what israel should worry about. In a situation like that, the US would be foolish to attack on of its 'friends and allies' (arabs) for the sake of another 'friend and ally' (Israel) should another arab/israeli conflict come about. Furthermore, with israeli policy choosing the primacy of a jewish state first and a democratic state second, the jewish state might implode before anyone attacks it.

All in all, until israel recognizes the arab issue from within and without, it is going to have a bleak future. As the United States take the entire arab world under her wings there could be infighting among 'friends and allies.' The best thing any administration could do would be to mediate, as it did between india and Pakistan.

Just a note. India had to negotiate in good faith with Pakistan because Pakistan has the ability to put a massive hurt on her. The Palistenians aren't in the same position with regards to Israel.

Not just the Palestinians, but Israeli arabs and other arab countries. Israel has to manage her internal and external issues better.

No doubt, but unlike India Israsel does so from a position of strentgh. I was just point out to you one of the major differences between the Indian/Pakistan Conflict and that if the Isralei/Arab conflict.

That is true. But let's also remember that Iran is less than a decade away from nuclear bombs. The arabs are less than a decade (or two) from economic and political union. The latter may sound far-fetched but the preliminary framework is building for a monetary union (at least starting with the rich gulf nations). When all is said and done, Israel could be marginalized politically and economically from all the unions forming around the globe. She has to deal with these political issues (religion and land) before she can be accepted.

In a decade the world's reliance on oil will be down to negligible levels and money will be getting poured into intelligent engineers and manufacturing firms making hydrogen fueled cars. What will this "monetary union" be backed by once oil isn't as valueable? Without having money flood into their countries for doing absolutly nothing, I think this "union" will be what's marginalized.

 

[MinorityReport]

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: Dari

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: Dari
Am I the only person here that thinks Israel will be sacrificed after Iraq is dealt with? I mean, come on, conservative american administrations and right-wing Israeli governments do not mix. Their primary and secondary priorities in the Mid-East are oil and God, respectifully. Once Iraq has been liberated, like in 1991, Israel will be forced into an uncompromising position when it comes to the Palestinian issue. They may try to wiggle out of it like they did in the 1990s but it'll be a lot harder this time. While a liberated iraq is good for israel, that does not mean that iraq or other arabs will open their arms to the jewish state. No, Iraq will probably become another 'moderate' arab nation with vile hatred of israel. Iran and an arab union form the greatest threat to the security. That is what israel should worry about. In a situation like that, the US would be foolish to attack on of its 'friends and allies' (arabs) for the sake of another 'friend and ally' (Israel) should another arab/israeli conflict come about. Furthermore, with israeli policy choosing the primacy of a jewish state first and a democratic state second, the jewish state might implode before anyone attacks it.

All in all, until israel recognizes the arab issue from within and without, it is going to have a bleak future. As the United States take the entire arab world under her wings there could be infighting among 'friends and allies.' The best thing any administration could do would be to mediate, as it did between india and Pakistan.

Just a note. India had to negotiate in good faith with Pakistan because Pakistan has the ability to put a massive hurt on her. The Palistenians aren't in the same position with regards to Israel.

Not just the Palestinians, but Israeli arabs and other arab countries. Israel has to manage her internal and external issues better.

No doubt, but unlike India Israsel does so from a position of strentgh. I was just point out to you one of the major differences between the Indian/Pakistan Conflict and that if the Isralei/Arab conflict.

Palestine does not have nukes like pakistan does. Israel can crush Palestine in one day ..if allowed. Also if cornered, Israel by itself can take on Syria, Jordan, Egypt, Lebanon.

The India pakistan conflict is nothing similar to Israeli Palestinian one. Pakistan has nuclear weapons and has warned to use them against India in case of war.

Already India pakistan have fought 3 wars, the last in 1999. In 1971 pakistan was defeated and broken into 2 countries by India .. Pakistan on west and Bangladesh on east.

India's strength lies in its size and economy and huge manpower base.

Pakistan is outnumbered and outmatched but has nuclear weapons as deterrent. Hence India will have to think 100 times before lauching an attack on Pakistan/

However if Pakistan lauches a nuclear attack first on India, it will be erased from the world map. Hence they too will think 10000 times before doing such a stupid thing.

The focus of the conflict is Kashmir. Kashmir is a Indian state on the northen most part, where Pakistan has been supporting Islamic terrorism inside Kashmir since 1989 and has caused the death of 60,000 people since last 12 years.

Pakistan controls a part of Kashmir called POK or Pakistani occupied Kashmir. They claim entrie Kashmir belongs to them as it has a muslim majority. India differs and claims that religious majority is no criteria for a new state or los of a state.

The situation is like Latinos asking for a separate Nation for California, supported by Mexico.
USA will beat the crap out of them real bad .. if that ever happens.


The Indo-Pak conflict is very complex and I doubt any nation will ever use a nuclear weapon on either side .. but India being 11 times bigger will survive and Pakistan will be gone from the planet earth.

 

[Red Dawn]

Originally posted by: Dari

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: Dari

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: Dari
Am I the only person here that thinks Israel will be sacrificed after Iraq is dealt with? I mean, come on, conservative american administrations and right-wing Israeli governments do not mix. Their primary and secondary priorities in the Mid-East are oil and God, respectifully. Once Iraq has been liberated, like in 1991, Israel will be forced into an uncompromising position when it comes to the Palestinian issue. They may try to wiggle out of it like they did in the 1990s but it'll be a lot harder this time. While a liberated iraq is good for israel, that does not mean that iraq or other arabs will open their arms to the jewish state. No, Iraq will probably become another 'moderate' arab nation with vile hatred of israel. Iran and an arab union form the greatest threat to the security. That is what israel should worry about. In a situation like that, the US would be foolish to attack on of its 'friends and allies' (arabs) for the sake of another 'friend and ally' (Israel) should another arab/israeli conflict come about. Furthermore, with israeli policy choosing the primacy of a jewish state first and a democratic state second, the jewish state might implode before anyone attacks it.

All in all, until israel recognizes the arab issue from within and without, it is going to have a bleak future. As the United States take the entire arab world under her wings there could be infighting among 'friends and allies.' The best thing any administration could do would be to mediate, as it did between india and Pakistan.

Just a note. India had to negotiate in good faith with Pakistan because Pakistan has the ability to put a massive hurt on her. The Palistenians aren't in the same position with regards to Israel.

Not just the Palestinians, but Israeli arabs and other arab countries. Israel has to manage her internal and external issues better.

No doubt, but unlike India Israsel does so from a position of strentgh. I was just point out to you one of the major differences between the Indian/Pakistan Conflict and that if the Isralei/Arab conflict.

That is true. But let's also remember that Iran is less than a decade away from nuclear bombs. The arabs are less than a decade (or two) from economic and political union. The latter may sound far-fetched but the preliminary framework is building for a monetary union (at least starting with the rich gulf nations). When all is said and done, Israel could be marginalized politically and economically from all the unions forming around the globe. She has to deal with these political issues (religion and land) before she can be accepted.

Well you are now talking about Iran who isn't an Arab State.

 

[Dari]

Originally posted by: MinorityReport

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: Dari

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: Dari
Am I the only person here that thinks Israel will be sacrificed after Iraq is dealt with? I mean, come on, conservative american administrations and right-wing Israeli governments do not mix. Their primary and secondary priorities in the Mid-East are oil and God, respectifully. Once Iraq has been liberated, like in 1991, Israel will be forced into an uncompromising position when it comes to the Palestinian issue. They may try to wiggle out of it like they did in the 1990s but it'll be a lot harder this time. While a liberated iraq is good for israel, that does not mean that iraq or other arabs will open their arms to the jewish state. No, Iraq will probably become another 'moderate' arab nation with vile hatred of israel. Iran and an arab union form the greatest threat to the security. That is what israel should worry about. In a situation like that, the US would be foolish to attack on of its 'friends and allies' (arabs) for the sake of another 'friend and ally' (Israel) should another arab/israeli conflict come about. Furthermore, with israeli policy choosing the primacy of a jewish state first and a democratic state second, the jewish state might implode before anyone attacks it.

All in all, until israel recognizes the arab issue from within and without, it is going to have a bleak future. As the United States take the entire arab world under her wings there could be infighting among 'friends and allies.' The best thing any administration could do would be to mediate, as it did between india and Pakistan.

Just a note. India had to negotiate in good faith with Pakistan because Pakistan has the ability to put a massive hurt on her. The Palistenians aren't in the same position with regards to Israel.

Not just the Palestinians, but Israeli arabs and other arab countries. Israel has to manage her internal and external issues better.

No doubt, but unlike India Israsel does so from a position of strentgh. I was just point out to you one of the major differences between the Indian/Pakistan Conflict and that if the Isralei/Arab conflict.

Palestine does not have nukes like pakistan does. Israel can crush Palestine in one day ..if allowed. Also if cornered, Israel by itself can take on Syria, Jordan, Egypt, Lebanon.

The India pakistan conflict is nothing similar to Israeli Palestinian one. Pakistan has nuclear weapons and has warned to use them against India in case of war.

Already India pakistan have fought 3 wars, the last in 1999. In 1971 pakistan was defeated and broken into 2 countries by India .. Pakistan on west and Bangladesh on east.

India's strength lies in its size and economy and huge manpower base.

Pakistan is outnumbered and outmatched but has nuclear weapons as deterrent. Hence India will have to think 100 times before lauching an attack on Pakistan/

However if Pakistan lauches a nuclear attack first on India, it will be erased from the world map. Hence they too will think 10000 times before doing such a stupid thing.

The focus of the conflict is Kashmir. Kashmir is a Indian state on the northen most part, where Pakistan has been supporting Islamic terrorism inside Kashmir since 1989 and has caused the death of 60,000 people since last 12 years.

Pakistan controls a part of Kashmir called POK or Pakistani occupied Kashmir. They claim entrie Kashmir belongs to them as it has a muslim majority. India differs and claims that religious majority is no criteria for a new state or los of a state.

The situation is like Latinos asking for a separate Nation for California, supported by Mexico.
USA will beat the crap out of them real bad .. if that ever happens.


The Indo-Pak conflict is very complex and I doubt any nation will ever use a nuclear weapon on either side .. but India being 11 times bigger will survive and Pakistan will be gone from the planet earth.

If you think israel can take on all those arab countries at once then you've forgotten about the Korean war. With millions of soldiers coming at you at once, there's no way you could win a war. Even if they did win a war, Israel can't control such a vast territory. All it can do is tell them not to do it again. No to mention the cost would be castratophic. Furthermore, a war of attrition on an unheard-of scale would commense, devouring whatever gains israel has made. The Jericho-2 missiles (nuclear bombs) that israel has, if launched, would do nothing less than guarantee a mutually assured destruction. That would be the end of civilization in that part of the world.

Israel needs to make peace with its neighbors.

 

[HeroOfPellinor]

Originally posted by: Dari

Originally posted by: MinorityReport

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: Dari

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: Dari
Am I the only person here that thinks Israel will be sacrificed after Iraq is dealt with? I mean, come on, conservative american administrations and right-wing Israeli governments do not mix. Their primary and secondary priorities in the Mid-East are oil and God, respectifully. Once Iraq has been liberated, like in 1991, Israel will be forced into an uncompromising position when it comes to the Palestinian issue. They may try to wiggle out of it like they did in the 1990s but it'll be a lot harder this time. While a liberated iraq is good for israel, that does not mean that iraq or other arabs will open their arms to the jewish state. No, Iraq will probably become another 'moderate' arab nation with vile hatred of israel. Iran and an arab union form the greatest threat to the security. That is what israel should worry about. In a situation like that, the US would be foolish to attack on of its 'friends and allies' (arabs) for the sake of another 'friend and ally' (Israel) should another arab/israeli conflict come about. Furthermore, with israeli policy choosing the primacy of a jewish state first and a democratic state second, the jewish state might implode before anyone attacks it.

All in all, until israel recognizes the arab issue from within and without, it is going to have a bleak future. As the United States take the entire arab world under her wings there could be infighting among 'friends and allies.' The best thing any administration could do would be to mediate, as it did between india and Pakistan.

Just a note. India had to negotiate in good faith with Pakistan because Pakistan has the ability to put a massive hurt on her. The Palistenians aren't in the same position with regards to Israel.

Not just the Palestinians, but Israeli arabs and other arab countries. Israel has to manage her internal and external issues better.

No doubt, but unlike India Israsel does so from a position of strentgh. I was just point out to you one of the major differences between the Indian/Pakistan Conflict and that if the Isralei/Arab conflict.

Palestine does not have nukes like pakistan does. Israel can crush Palestine in one day ..if allowed. Also if cornered, Israel by itself can take on Syria, Jordan, Egypt, Lebanon.

The India pakistan conflict is nothing similar to Israeli Palestinian one. Pakistan has nuclear weapons and has warned to use them against India in case of war.

Already India pakistan have fought 3 wars, the last in 1999. In 1971 pakistan was defeated and broken into 2 countries by India .. Pakistan on west and Bangladesh on east.

India's strength lies in its size and economy and huge manpower base.

Pakistan is outnumbered and outmatched but has nuclear weapons as deterrent. Hence India will have to think 100 times before lauching an attack on Pakistan/

However if Pakistan lauches a nuclear attack first on India, it will be erased from the world map. Hence they too will think 10000 times before doing such a stupid thing.

The focus of the conflict is Kashmir. Kashmir is a Indian state on the northen most part, where Pakistan has been supporting Islamic terrorism inside Kashmir since 1989 and has caused the death of 60,000 people since last 12 years.

Pakistan controls a part of Kashmir called POK or Pakistani occupied Kashmir. They claim entrie Kashmir belongs to them as it has a muslim majority. India differs and claims that religious majority is no criteria for a new state or los of a state.

The situation is like Latinos asking for a separate Nation for California, supported by Mexico.
USA will beat the crap out of them real bad .. if that ever happens.


The Indo-Pak conflict is very complex and I doubt any nation will ever use a nuclear weapon on either side .. but India being 11 times bigger will survive and Pakistan will be gone from the planet earth.

If you think israel can take on all those arab countries at once then you've forgotten about the Korean war. With millions of soldiers coming at you at once, there's no way you could win a war. Even if they did win a war, Israel can't control such a vast territory. All it can do is tell them not to do it again. No to mention the cost would be castratophic. Furthermore, a war of attrition on an unheard-of scale would commense, devouring whatever gains israel has made. The Jericho-2 missiles (nuclear bombs) that israel has, if launched, would do nothing less than guarantee a mutually assured destruction. That would be the end of civilization in that part of the world.

Israel needs to make peace with its neighbors.

OMG you're ignorant. They've already beat them in a war...TWICE!

 

[bernse]

Originally posted by: HeroOfPellinor
In a decade the world's reliance on oil will be down to negligible levels and money will be getting poured into intelligent engineers and manufacturing firms making hydrogen fueled cars. What will this "monetary union" be backed by once oil isn't as valueable? Without having money flood into their countries for doing absolutly nothing, I think this "union" will be what's marginalized.

Is that right? Negligible levels?

How much do you want to bet on this?

Edit:Fixed coding

 

[MinorityReport]

Originally posted by: Dari

Originally posted by: MinorityReport

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: Dari

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: Dari
Am I the only person here that thinks Israel will be sacrificed after Iraq is dealt with? I mean, come on, conservative american administrations and right-wing Israeli governments do not mix. Their primary and secondary priorities in the Mid-East are oil and God, respectifully. Once Iraq has been liberated, like in 1991, Israel will be forced into an uncompromising position when it comes to the Palestinian issue. They may try to wiggle out of it like they did in the 1990s but it'll be a lot harder this time. While a liberated iraq is good for israel, that does not mean that iraq or other arabs will open their arms to the jewish state. No, Iraq will probably become another 'moderate' arab nation with vile hatred of israel. Iran and an arab union form the greatest threat to the security. That is what israel should worry about. In a situation like that, the US would be foolish to attack on of its 'friends and allies' (arabs) for the sake of another 'friend and ally' (Israel) should another arab/israeli conflict come about. Furthermore, with israeli policy choosing the primacy of a jewish state first and a democratic state second, the jewish state might implode before anyone attacks it.

All in all, until israel recognizes the arab issue from within and without, it is going to have a bleak future. As the United States take the entire arab world under her wings there could be infighting among 'friends and allies.' The best thing any administration could do would be to mediate, as it did between india and Pakistan.

Just a note. India had to negotiate in good faith with Pakistan because Pakistan has the ability to put a massive hurt on her. The Palistenians aren't in the same position with regards to Israel.

Not just the Palestinians, but Israeli arabs and other arab countries. Israel has to manage her internal and external issues better.

No doubt, but unlike India Israsel does so from a position of strentgh. I was just point out to you one of the major differences between the Indian/Pakistan Conflict and that if the Isralei/Arab conflict.

Palestine does not have nukes like pakistan does. Israel can crush Palestine in one day ..if allowed. Also if cornered, Israel by itself can take on Syria, Jordan, Egypt, Lebanon.

The India pakistan conflict is nothing similar to Israeli Palestinian one. Pakistan has nuclear weapons and has warned to use them against India in case of war.

Already India pakistan have fought 3 wars, the last in 1999. In 1971 pakistan was defeated and broken into 2 countries by India .. Pakistan on west and Bangladesh on east.

India's strength lies in its size and economy and huge manpower base.

Pakistan is outnumbered and outmatched but has nuclear weapons as deterrent. Hence India will have to think 100 times before lauching an attack on Pakistan/

However if Pakistan lauches a nuclear attack first on India, it will be erased from the world map. Hence they too will think 10000 times before doing such a stupid thing.

The focus of the conflict is Kashmir. Kashmir is a Indian state on the northen most part, where Pakistan has been supporting Islamic terrorism inside Kashmir since 1989 and has caused the death of 60,000 people since last 12 years.

Pakistan controls a part of Kashmir called POK or Pakistani occupied Kashmir. They claim entrie Kashmir belongs to them as it has a muslim majority. India differs and claims that religious majority is no criteria for a new state or los of a state.

The situation is like Latinos asking for a separate Nation for California, supported by Mexico.
USA will beat the crap out of them real bad .. if that ever happens.


The Indo-Pak conflict is very complex and I doubt any nation will ever use a nuclear weapon on either side .. but India being 11 times bigger will survive and Pakistan will be gone from the planet earth.

If you think israel can take on all those arab countries at once then you've forgotten about the Korean war. With millions of soldiers coming at you at once, there's no way you could win a war. Even if they did win a war, Israel can't control such a vast territory. All it can do is tell them not to do it again. No to mention the cost would be castratophic. Furthermore, a war of attrition on an unheard-of scale would commense, devouring whatever gains israel has made. The Jericho-2 missiles (nuclear bombs) that israel has, if launched, would do nothing less than guarantee a mutually assured destruction. That would be the end of civilization in that part of the world.

Israel needs to make peace with its neighbors.

I am pretty sure Israeli Government and their people know better than us what to do in such a scenario.

Hence I suggest you leave the thinking to the concerned authorities.

Also as Red Dawn has mentioned, Iran is a non Arab state. They are SHIA muslims .. and will object to any sunni Arab Alliance which weakens their stance in the ISlamic world.

The most powerful Islamic nation is Pakistan.

One thing you need to worry is Pakistan not supplying its nukes to Iran or an Arab state more than anythign else.

Cause a couple of nukes on Isreal and its wiped off from earth ... and Pakistan will be very very happy to do so, at least indirectly.

 

[Dari]

Originally posted by: HeroOfPellinor

Originally posted by: Dari

Originally posted by: MinorityReport

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: Dari

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: Dari
Am I the only person here that thinks Israel will be sacrificed after Iraq is dealt with? I mean, come on, conservative american administrations and right-wing Israeli governments do not mix. Their primary and secondary priorities in the Mid-East are oil and God, respectifully. Once Iraq has been liberated, like in 1991, Israel will be forced into an uncompromising position when it comes to the Palestinian issue. They may try to wiggle out of it like they did in the 1990s but it'll be a lot harder this time. While a liberated iraq is good for israel, that does not mean that iraq or other arabs will open their arms to the jewish state. No, Iraq will probably become another 'moderate' arab nation with vile hatred of israel. Iran and an arab union form the greatest threat to the security. That is what israel should worry about. In a situation like that, the US would be foolish to attack on of its 'friends and allies' (arabs) for the sake of another 'friend and ally' (Israel) should another arab/israeli conflict come about. Furthermore, with israeli policy choosing the primacy of a jewish state first and a democratic state second, the jewish state might implode before anyone attacks it.

All in all, until israel recognizes the arab issue from within and without, it is going to have a bleak future. As the United States take the entire arab world under her wings there could be infighting among 'friends and allies.' The best thing any administration could do would be to mediate, as it did between india and Pakistan.

Just a note. India had to negotiate in good faith with Pakistan because Pakistan has the ability to put a massive hurt on her. The Palistenians aren't in the same position with regards to Israel.

Not just the Palestinians, but Israeli arabs and other arab countries. Israel has to manage her internal and external issues better.

No doubt, but unlike India Israsel does so from a position of strentgh. I was just point out to you one of the major differences between the Indian/Pakistan Conflict and that if the Isralei/Arab conflict.

Palestine does not have nukes like pakistan does. Israel can crush Palestine in one day ..if allowed. Also if cornered, Israel by itself can take on Syria, Jordan, Egypt, Lebanon.

The India pakistan conflict is nothing similar to Israeli Palestinian one. Pakistan has nuclear weapons and has warned to use them against India in case of war.

Already India pakistan have fought 3 wars, the last in 1999. In 1971 pakistan was defeated and broken into 2 countries by India .. Pakistan on west and Bangladesh on east.

India's strength lies in its size and economy and huge manpower base.

Pakistan is outnumbered and outmatched but has nuclear weapons as deterrent. Hence India will have to think 100 times before lauching an attack on Pakistan/

However if Pakistan lauches a nuclear attack first on India, it will be erased from the world map. Hence they too will think 10000 times before doing such a stupid thing.

The focus of the conflict is Kashmir. Kashmir is a Indian state on the northen most part, where Pakistan has been supporting Islamic terrorism inside Kashmir since 1989 and has caused the death of 60,000 people since last 12 years.

Pakistan controls a part of Kashmir called POK or Pakistani occupied Kashmir. They claim entrie Kashmir belongs to them as it has a muslim majority. India differs and claims that religious majority is no criteria for a new state or los of a state.

The situation is like Latinos asking for a separate Nation for California, supported by Mexico.
USA will beat the crap out of them real bad .. if that ever happens.


The Indo-Pak conflict is very complex and I doubt any nation will ever use a nuclear weapon on either side .. but India being 11 times bigger will survive and Pakistan will be gone from the planet earth.

If you think israel can take on all those arab countries at once then you've forgotten about the Korean war. With millions of soldiers coming at you at once, there's no way you could win a war. Even if they did win a war, Israel can't control such a vast territory. All it can do is tell them not to do it again. No to mention the cost would be castratophic. Furthermore, a war of attrition on an unheard-of scale would commense, devouring whatever gains israel has made. The Jericho-2 missiles (nuclear bombs) that israel has, if launched, would do nothing less than guarantee a mutually assured destruction. That would be the end of civilization in that part of the world.

Israel needs to make peace with its neighbors.

OMG you're ignorant. They've already beat them in a war...TWICE!

At most Israel fought 3 arab countries (in 1967): Egypt/Syria/Jordan. Jordan reluctantly got into the battle when it was (mistakenly) told by Egyptians that their (Egyptian) aircrafts were doing the rounds when it was really the israelis. Since Jordan was already in the WB, they were an easy target for the Israeli army. Furthermore, let's not forget that Israel initiated the attack that also brought down one of our intelligence ships in the Gulf of Aqaba/Red Sea (sic?) or the Mediterranean. Everyone on board died.

 

[Dari]

Originally posted by: MinorityReport

Originally posted by: Dari

Originally posted by: MinorityReport

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: Dari

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: Dari
Am I the only person here that thinks Israel will be sacrificed after Iraq is dealt with? I mean, come on, conservative american administrations and right-wing Israeli governments do not mix. Their primary and secondary priorities in the Mid-East are oil and God, respectifully. Once Iraq has been liberated, like in 1991, Israel will be forced into an uncompromising position when it comes to the Palestinian issue. They may try to wiggle out of it like they did in the 1990s but it'll be a lot harder this time. While a liberated iraq is good for israel, that does not mean that iraq or other arabs will open their arms to the jewish state. No, Iraq will probably become another 'moderate' arab nation with vile hatred of israel. Iran and an arab union form the greatest threat to the security. That is what israel should worry about. In a situation like that, the US would be foolish to attack on of its 'friends and allies' (arabs) for the sake of another 'friend and ally' (Israel) should another arab/israeli conflict come about. Furthermore, with israeli policy choosing the primacy of a jewish state first and a democratic state second, the jewish state might implode before anyone attacks it.

All in all, until israel recognizes the arab issue from within and without, it is going to have a bleak future. As the United States take the entire arab world under her wings there could be infighting among 'friends and allies.' The best thing any administration could do would be to mediate, as it did between india and Pakistan.

Just a note. India had to negotiate in good faith with Pakistan because Pakistan has the ability to put a massive hurt on her. The Palistenians aren't in the same position with regards to Israel.

Not just the Palestinians, but Israeli arabs and other arab countries. Israel has to manage her internal and external issues better.

No doubt, but unlike India Israsel does so from a position of strentgh. I was just point out to you one of the major differences between the Indian/Pakistan Conflict and that if the Isralei/Arab conflict.

Palestine does not have nukes like pakistan does. Israel can crush Palestine in one day ..if allowed. Also if cornered, Israel by itself can take on Syria, Jordan, Egypt, Lebanon.

The India pakistan conflict is nothing similar to Israeli Palestinian one. Pakistan has nuclear weapons and has warned to use them against India in case of war.

Already India pakistan have fought 3 wars, the last in 1999. In 1971 pakistan was defeated and broken into 2 countries by India .. Pakistan on west and Bangladesh on east.

India's strength lies in its size and economy and huge manpower base.

Pakistan is outnumbered and outmatched but has nuclear weapons as deterrent. Hence India will have to think 100 times before lauching an attack on Pakistan/

However if Pakistan lauches a nuclear attack first on India, it will be erased from the world map. Hence they too will think 10000 times before doing such a stupid thing.

The focus of the conflict is Kashmir. Kashmir is a Indian state on the northen most part, where Pakistan has been supporting Islamic terrorism inside Kashmir since 1989 and has caused the death of 60,000 people since last 12 years.

Pakistan controls a part of Kashmir called POK or Pakistani occupied Kashmir. They claim entrie Kashmir belongs to them as it has a muslim majority. India differs and claims that religious majority is no criteria for a new state or los of a state.

The situation is like Latinos asking for a separate Nation for California, supported by Mexico.
USA will beat the crap out of them real bad .. if that ever happens.


The Indo-Pak conflict is very complex and I doubt any nation will ever use a nuclear weapon on either side .. but India being 11 times bigger will survive and Pakistan will be gone from the planet earth.

If you think israel can take on all those arab countries at once then you've forgotten about the Korean war. With millions of soldiers coming at you at once, there's no way you could win a war. Even if they did win a war, Israel can't control such a vast territory. All it can do is tell them not to do it again. No to mention the cost would be castratophic. Furthermore, a war of attrition on an unheard-of scale would commense, devouring whatever gains israel has made. The Jericho-2 missiles (nuclear bombs) that israel has, if launched, would do nothing less than guarantee a mutually assured destruction. That would be the end of civilization in that part of the world.

Israel needs to make peace with its neighbors.

I am pretty sure Israeli Government and their people know better than us what to do in such a scenario.

Hence I suggest you leave the thinking to the concerned authorities.

Also as Red Dawn has mentioned, Iran is a non Arab state. They are SHIA muslims .. and will object to any sunni Arab Alliance which weakens their stance in the ISlamic world.

The most powerful Islamic nation is Pakistan.

One thing you need to worry is Pakistan not supplying its nukes to Iran or an Arab state more than anythign else.

Cause a couple of nukes on Isreal and its wiped off from earth ... and Pakistan will be very very happy to do so, at least indirectly.

That's one of my points. Israel is running out of time to solve these problems. Iran and Pakistan are friendly towards each other. Once Iraq is dealt with, Iran will be Israel's biggest threat. While I doubt an islamic union (which would include Iran and Pakistan), let's not forget that Iran has excellent ties with Syria and Lebanon. Just like Afghanistan, Iraq will not forget its powerful neighbor to the east when it comes to making friends. I'm sure ties will develop that will continue the virile hatred of Israel.

 

[achiral]

in response to the original post, as much as you atheists don't want to hear this, Israel will be protected by the USA for as long as the USA is around. ask yourself why we should give a damn about israel. there is no reason. none at all. yet time and time again we have fought for them and defended them. i don't like the idea of us always coming to their side on things, but to tell you the truth this is a biblical prophecy in the works. God will not let his chosen people be destroyed and is using the might of the US to see that through. because really, why do we care? there is no reason besides the fact that the main parts of the Christian religion comes from that area. so it will never be able to be explained or understood, unless you look at it from a biblical perspective

 

[MinorityReport]

Israel alone can take on entrie Arab World ..

They have the brians and techonology and US support to do so.

Besides the arabs are a whole lot worse than what they were during Saladin's time in the Crusades, with all due respect.

Learn somethign new : In the Arab Israeli confict, Pakistan sent 24 fighter jets against ISrealis with their pilots to attack. The entire Egyptian Air Force was dessimated by the ISraelis and they had to call for Pakistani support.

Fear Pakistan not Iraq or Iran. Reason being all said and done, they have the most brains of any Islamic nation, the only nuclear power and the most powerful military.

However Uncle Sam seems to have a good hold on Musharaff and if things go bad in Iraq and rest of SIlamic world, Mushy will be thrown out by his Islamists and the nukes would fall into the hands of Jihadis who will first nuke Israel then India.

Not a good time for humanity specially muslims. Cause after this, they will number 100-300 million from the billion the are now.

India will guarantee 50% of that hit.

 

[Dari]

Originally posted by: achiral
in response to the original post, as much as you atheists don't want to hear this, Israel will be protected by the USA for as long as the USA is around. ask yourself why we should give a damn about israel. there is no reason. none at all. yet time and time again we have fought for them and defended them. i don't like the idea of us always coming to their side on things, but to tell you the truth this is a biblical prophecy in the works. God will not let his chosen people be destroyed and is using the might of the US to see that through. because really, why do we care? there is no reason besides the fact that the main parts of the Christian religion comes from that area. so it will never be able to be explained or understood, unless you look at it from a biblical perspective

Please don't preach that bible nonsense in this political thread. As I've mentioned in the first post it is one of the political reasons (religion) the US has interests in the region.
Religion is used, it does not dispel prophecy of any future conflicts.

The notion of God is debatable at best and pure fallacy at worst.

 

[Dari]

Originally posted by: MinorityReport
Israel alone can take on entrie Arab World ..

They have the brians and techonology and US support to do so.

Besides the arabs are a whole lot worse than what they were during Saladin's time in the Crusades, with all due respect.

Learn somethign new : In the Arab Israeli confict, Pakistan sent 24 fighter jets against ISrealis with their pilots to attack. The entire Egyptian Air Force was dessimated by the ISraelis and they had to call for Pakistani support.

Fear Pakistan not Iraq or Iran. Reason being all said and done, they have the most brains of any Islamic nation, the only nuclear power and the most powerful military.

However Uncle Sam seems to have a good hold on Musharaff and if things go bad in Iraq and rest of SIlamic world, Mushy will be thrown out by his Islamists and the nukes would fall into the hands of Jihadis who will first nuke Israel then India.

Not a good time for humanity specially muslims. Cause after this, they will number 100-300 million from the billion the are now.

India will guarantee 50% of that hit.

Your stupidity is a non-starter for this debate.

 

[MinorityReport]

Originally posted by: Dari

Originally posted by: MinorityReport
Israel alone can take on entrie Arab World ..

They have the brians and techonology and US support to do so.

Besides the arabs are a whole lot worse than what they were during Saladin's time in the Crusades, with all due respect.

Learn somethign new : In the Arab Israeli confict, Pakistan sent 24 fighter jets against ISrealis with their pilots to attack. The entire Egyptian Air Force was dessimated by the ISraelis and they had to call for Pakistani support.

Fear Pakistan not Iraq or Iran. Reason being all said and done, they have the most brains of any Islamic nation, the only nuclear power and the most powerful military.

However Uncle Sam seems to have a good hold on Musharaff and if things go bad in Iraq and rest of SIlamic world, Mushy will be thrown out by his Islamists and the nukes would fall into the hands of Jihadis who will first nuke Israel then India.

Not a good time for humanity specially muslims. Cause after this, they will number 100-300 million from the billion the are now.

India will guarantee 50% of that hit.

Your stupidity is a non-starter for this debate.

What ???

Your ignorant self did not know the difference between Palestine/Israel and India Pakistan conflict ..and now you are juding me stupid ?

Can you find these 4 counties on the world map ?

Troll away plz ... and I am out of your "debate"

 

[hagbard]

Originally posted by: Dari
Am I the only person here that thinks Israel will be sacrificed after Iraq is dealt with? I mean, come on, conservative american administrations and right-wing Israeli governments do not mix. Their primary and secondary priorities in the Mid-East are oil and God, respectifully. Once Iraq has been liberated, like in 1991, Israel will be forced into an uncompromising position when it comes to the Palestinian issue. They may try to wiggle out of it like they did in the 1990s but it'll be a lot harder this time. While a liberated iraq is good for israel, that does not mean that iraq or other arabs will open their arms to the jewish state. No, Iraq will probably become another 'moderate' arab nation with vile hatred of israel. Iran and an arab union form the greatest threat to the security. That is what israel should worry about. In a situation like that, the US would be foolish to attack on of its 'friends and allies' (arabs) for the sake of another 'friend and ally' (Israel) should another arab/israeli conflict come about. Furthermore, with israeli policy choosing the primacy of a jewish state first and a democratic state second, the jewish state might implode before anyone attacks it.

All in all, until israel recognizes the arab issue from within and without, it is going to have a bleak future. As the United States take the entire arab world under her wings there could be infighting among 'friends and allies.' The best thing any administration could do would be to mediate, as it did between india and Pakistan.

Yeah, like the other guys said, your a bit confused. Israel is a primary, if not the primary issue driving US policy in the mideast. They are not going to stand up against the zionist fundamentalist Christians or the zionist Jews. Combined with the neocons, they're too great a force. Look, if they can get the US to fork over an average $3 Billion a year to Israel, they obviously have some muscle in congress and the administration. They're not going to allow the US to in any way harm Israel. And why would they? Israelis are the most "westernized" people in that region, in the US view, there's nothing to change.

IMO, this is going to end up as a crucade, as Bush II discribed it shortly after 9/11. Its going to be the Christians and Jews against the Muslims, and this will create a Jihad.

 

[HeroOfPellinor]

Originally posted by: MinorityReport
Israel alone can take on entrie Arab World ..

Besides the arabs are a whole lot worse than what they were during Saladin's time in the Crusades, with all due respect.

That's because Islam shapes a society into a high medieval society which, obviously, is more advanced that the western medieval society prevalent during Saladin's time. The problem is that Islam strangles change and thus progression while Christianity, the dominant religeon in western civilization, can easily coexist with any society or culture because it is independent of society.

We can only hope that Islam is currently being abused by the leaders in the Middle East, like Chistianity was during the Holy Roman Empire, to exert power and control and that, at some point, there will be a renaissance and then a reformation like there was in the west. Until then, what you have is a culture and society completely out of place in the modern world that, because it cannot grow, can only lash out and rage at the world around them.

 

[Dari]

Originally posted by: hagbard

Originally posted by: Dari
Am I the only person here that thinks Israel will be sacrificed after Iraq is dealt with? I mean, come on, conservative american administrations and right-wing Israeli governments do not mix. Their primary and secondary priorities in the Mid-East are oil and God, respectifully. Once Iraq has been liberated, like in 1991, Israel will be forced into an uncompromising position when it comes to the Palestinian issue. They may try to wiggle out of it like they did in the 1990s but it'll be a lot harder this time. While a liberated iraq is good for israel, that does not mean that iraq or other arabs will open their arms to the jewish state. No, Iraq will probably become another 'moderate' arab nation with vile hatred of israel. Iran and an arab union form the greatest threat to the security. That is what israel should worry about. In a situation like that, the US would be foolish to attack on of its 'friends and allies' (arabs) for the sake of another 'friend and ally' (Israel) should another arab/israeli conflict come about. Furthermore, with israeli policy choosing the primacy of a jewish state first and a democratic state second, the jewish state might implode before anyone attacks it.

All in all, until israel recognizes the arab issue from within and without, it is going to have a bleak future. As the United States take the entire arab world under her wings there could be infighting among 'friends and allies.' The best thing any administration could do would be to mediate, as it did between india and Pakistan.

Yeah, like the other guys said, your a bit confused. Israel is a primary, if not the primary issue driving US policy in the mideast. They are not going to stand up against the zionist fundamentalist Christians or the zionist Jews. Combined with the neocons, they're too great a force. Look, if they can get the US to fork over an average $3 Billion a year to Israel, they obviously have some muscle in congress and the administration. They're not going to allow the US to in any way harm Israel. And why would they? Israelis are the most "westernized" people in that region, in the US view, there's nothing to change.

IMO, this is going to end up as a crucade, as Bush II discribed it shortly after 9/11. Its going to be the Christians and Jews against the Muslims, and this will create a Jihad.

you must be confused. OIL is our primary reason in that region. Religion is second. We aid israel just like we aid other countries and people. Israel is not alone when it comes to opening up the coffers. Besides, the jews in america are one of if not the wealthiest minorities (if you can call them that).

 

[Analog]

when iraq is liberated, then the other despotic middle eastern dictators will fall eventually as well. This will bring on moderation by the arabs in the middle east, thus a comprimise to the palistinian issue.

 

[hagbard]

Originally posted by: Dari

Originally posted by: hagbard

Originally posted by: Dari
Am I the only person here that thinks Israel will be sacrificed after Iraq is dealt with? I mean, come on, conservative american administrations and right-wing Israeli governments do not mix. Their primary and secondary priorities in the Mid-East are oil and God, respectifully. Once Iraq has been liberated, like in 1991, Israel will be forced into an uncompromising position when it comes to the Palestinian issue. They may try to wiggle out of it like they did in the 1990s but it'll be a lot harder this time. While a liberated iraq is good for israel, that does not mean that iraq or other arabs will open their arms to the jewish state. No, Iraq will probably become another 'moderate' arab nation with vile hatred of israel. Iran and an arab union form the greatest threat to the security. That is what israel should worry about. In a situation like that, the US would be foolish to attack on of its 'friends and allies' (arabs) for the sake of another 'friend and ally' (Israel) should another arab/israeli conflict come about. Furthermore, with israeli policy choosing the primacy of a jewish state first and a democratic state second, the jewish state might implode before anyone attacks it.

All in all, until israel recognizes the arab issue from within and without, it is going to have a bleak future. As the United States take the entire arab world under her wings there could be infighting among 'friends and allies.' The best thing any administration could do would be to mediate, as it did between india and Pakistan.

Yeah, like the other guys said, your a bit confused. Israel is a primary, if not the primary issue driving US policy in the mideast. They are not going to stand up against the zionist fundamentalist Christians or the zionist Jews. Combined with the neocons, they're too great a force. Look, if they can get the US to fork over an average $3 Billion a year to Israel, they obviously have some muscle in congress and the administration. They're not going to allow the US to in any way harm Israel. And why would they? Israelis are the most "westernized" people in that region, in the US view, there's nothing to change.

IMO, this is going to end up as a crucade, as Bush II discribed it shortly after 9/11. Its going to be the Christians and Jews against the Muslims, and this will create a Jihad.

you must be confused. OIL is our primary reason in that region. Religion is second.

Its about protecting the State of Israel.

We aid israel just like we aid other countries and people.

The US aids Israel to the tune of over $3 billion a year, that's more than it gives the rest of the world in aid combined. Aid to Israel is a very large government expense.

Israel is not alone when it comes to opening up the coffers. Besides, the jews in america are one of if not the wealthiest minorities (if you can call them that).

Yes...now connect the dots.