Is Trump Trying to Stage a Coup?

[gothuevos]

There’s a pretty good chance that Republicans will control the house and senate in 2024, yes. I agree with you to some extent that if the election is close I think Republicans will seat their own candidate if they lose. If it’s not close I think they wouldn’t do it.

Regardless though the unmistakeable takeaway here is that they have demonstrated that they now consider respecting the outcome of elections to be optional and more of a political question than a legal one. If they think they can do so successfully they will.

Yup, I agree.

The American experiment is over.

 

[MixMasterTang]

Trump is basing his entire argument on accusations of election fraud, for which he has yet to provide any compelling evidence and all available avenues to him are shutting down. All he is doing now is what he always does is shout and tantrum on social media. I would call that delusion.

My personal opinion, the noise he is now making is to paint himself as a victim and fuel whatever his next move might be. He seems more inclined to destroy the GOP and carve out his own cult political entity than lead a coup.

Judges have asked on multiple occasions if Trump’s lawsuits are accusing election fraud and as far as I know every time his lawyers have been asked they responded with either “no” or “not at this time”. Yes, Trump is saying that in public while trying to overturn the elections via any means he can.

 

[zzyzxroad]

Judges have asked on multiple occasions if Trump’s lawsuits are accusing election fraud and as far as I know every time his lawyers have been asked they responded with either “no” or “not at this time”. Yes, Trump is saying that in public while trying to overturn the elections via any means he can.

In the middle of a global pandemic no less.

 

[sportage]

After Biden and Harris actually take over I expect a major national reality check as to why so many republican house members willfully engaged in a coup attempt and to willfully go against American democracy and to willfully go against the American electoral system. This is one thing they must be held accountable for. This is not some OH-WELL moment. This should eventually drum all of them out of politics completely and haunt them for the rest of their lives. I personally would prefer the Abraham Lincoln approach, to hang the traitors in the public square. If we don’t hang them now, every one of them, they could come back in the future to do much greater harm to our democracy.

 

[Starbuck1975]

Ok, for the last time:

SO WHAT WORD/TERM WOULD YOU USE TO DESCRIBE IT AS?

Maybe, just maybe. Your reluctance to answer this question is truly baffling.

Take your pick. Corruption. Opportunism. Desperation. Deception. Distraction. Narcissism. Denial. Pettiness. Selfishness. Showmanship. Pied Piperism.

 

[MtnMan]

Except that....

Let’s look at reality.

Trump is going to implement a totalitarian fascist regime - stopped at every turn by the judiciary and does not have the support of the military. Except that he has tried, appointing moles into virtually every agency, including the pentagon. One was just thrown out of the CDC.

Trump is going to deploy his brown shirts to intimidate polling locations - didn’t happen, except that many of his followers were turned away from polling places. In my own town, they were harassing people on their way to vote.

Russian is going to hack our voting machines - didn’t happen, Wait, wasn't it Venezuela, that what Trump said. Russia had bots on social media

Trump’s cronies are going to break the post office and prevent mail in ballots from getting through - didn’t happen - Except that the courts stepped in and told DeJoy to cease and desist with the destruction.

Trump’s SCOTUS appointments are going to stage a judicial coup - nope - Except that they tried, full in the belief that the court would throw the constitution under the bus.

There’s going to be a coup - nope - because the military has made it clear that their oath is to the Constitution, not an individual. Again, now how Trump envisioned it going down.

My being naive is not the problem here - Except that you assume failure in no way doesn't indicate intent. The man can bankrupt casinos, he can fuck up anything.

 

[Starbuck1975]

Lol it never fails. Even when Republicans are attempting to end democracy in the US you’re still criticizing Democrats.

Like I’ve told you for years, your insipid #bothsides-ing has led to ever more extreme Republican behavior because they pay no price for it. People like you aren’t the only reason we have come to this but you’re a big reason why. As it continues to get worse I hope you remember that you helped make it happen and are ashamed of your behavior.

So convinced there is a coup, and yet your inclination is to perform for the peanut gallery. I have nothing to be ashamed of, but as always, your projection is entertaining.

 

[Commodus]

I can't help but hesitate to call it an attempted coup. Not that Trump doesn't want to hold on to power — he clearly does.

Rather, it's that a coup implies a calculated, sophisticated effort to subvert a political system. And I don't think Trump is capable of that. He's an impulsive, simplistic narcissist who rarely considers things beyond the short-term demands of his ego. In his mind, he always wins everything because he's always the best; if it looks like he'll lose, it's only because he was cheated out of what he deserves.

Trump is scrambling to find something, anything that satisfies this narcissistic view, and coup-like behavior is an extension of that. But it's more like a whale flapping around on the beach than a carefully coordinated operation, hence why virtually all of his court cases have failed almost immediately.

 

[pmv]

Great, you can start with getting the President elect and his transition team to acknowledge it.

Much of the time I'd be happy to look askance at the mainstream centrist way of doing things, and I _could_ try and criticize Biden for his "just look the other way and pretend nothing's happening" approach (which is very much what I would have expected from him - he's obviously decided the key point is to look Presidential and 'grown up', do that "when they go low we go high" thing, and concede absolutely nothing to the overexcitability of either right or left).

But, really, my heart wouldn't be in that criticism on this occasion - it's hard for anyone to know what the 'right' way is to react to the weirdest, most psychologically-unstable, and most norm-busting President in our lifetimes.

 

[zzyzxroad]

Much of the time I'd be happy to look askance at the mainstream centrist way of doing things, and I _could_ try and criticize Biden for his "just look the other way and pretend nothing's happening" approach (which is very much what I would have expected from him - he's obviously decided the key point is to look Presidential and 'grown up', do that "when they go low we go high" thing, and concede absolutely nothing to the overexcitability of either right or left).

But, really, my heart wouldn't be in that criticism on this occasion - it's hard for anyone to know what the 'right' way is to react to the weirdest, most psychologically-unstable, and most norm-busting President in our lifetimes.

Your heart is in the right place. Biden is trying to unit the country and should not take part in this shit show. Suggesting he should is an idiotic idea. The spineless silent republicans should be the ones denouncing Trump's circus. Every single republican senator should have comes forward and acknowledged Trump's chicanery. The fact that they stayed silent with all that is going in the world shows their lack of morals.

 

[pmv]

I can't help but hesitate to call it an attempted coup. Not that Trump doesn't want to hold on to power — he clearly does.

Rather, it's that a coup implies a calculated, sophisticated effort to subvert a political system. And I don't think Trump is capable of that. He's an impulsive, simplistic narcissist who rarely considers things beyond the short-term demands of his ego. In his mind, he always wins everything because he's always the best; if it looks like he'll lose, it's only because he was cheated out of what he deserves.

Trump is scrambling to find something, anything that satisfies this narcissistic view, and coup-like behavior is an extension of that. But it's more like a whale flapping around on the beach than a carefully coordinated operation, hence why virtually all of his court cases have failed almost immediately.

I'd call it an attempted coup - just an unusually inept and disorganised one. Main thing seems to keep a very close eye on developments, and maintain as much unity as humanly possible in the face of the madness.

 

[zzyzxroad]

I'd call it an attempted coup - just an unusually inept and disorganised one. Main thing seems to keep a very close eye on developments, and maintain as much unity as humanly possible in the face of the madness.

Let's coin a new term for what Trump has done to prevent any confusion. My vote is for Drooliani.

 

[NWRMidnight]

There’s a pretty good chance that Republicans will control the house and senate in 2024, yes. I agree with you to some extent that if the election is close I think Republicans will seat their own candidate if they lose. If it’s not close I think they wouldn’t do it.

Regardless though the unmistakeable takeaway here is that they have demonstrated that they now consider respecting the outcome of elections to be optional and more of a political question than a legal one. If they think they can do so successfully they will.

I wouldn't count on it. There won't be a President spending every waking moment constantly blaming the other party that they are responsible for all the bad things that happen. We just spent the last 4 years with Trump "programming" the weak minded that everything is the Democrats fault. Yes it's been going on for years, but it has been much, much worse, and not as direct as Trump, who did it nearly every time he got in front of the Camera, every interview, every time he opened his mouth practically, as well as Twitter.

 

[sportage]

Well tomorrow the electors will meet to formally vote for the next president. And, that's pretty much it. Ballgame over. So it will be interesting to watch Trump's tweets, McConnell's response if any, and others like little Lindsey and Ted Cruz. Should be interesting. And while all this is happening, Melania continues her packing. Aw Baron, can you be a good boy and pack mommies toothbrush for her?

 

[mikeymikec]

I can't help but hesitate to call it an attempted coup. Not that Trump doesn't want to hold on to power — he clearly does.

Rather, it's that a coup implies a calculated, sophisticated effort to subvert a political system. And I don't think Trump is capable of that. He's an impulsive, simplistic narcissist who rarely considers things beyond the short-term demands of his ego. In his mind, he always wins everything because he's always the best; if it looks like he'll lose, it's only because he was cheated out of what he deserves.

Trump is scrambling to find something, anything that satisfies this narcissistic view, and coup-like behavior is an extension of that. But it's more like a whale flapping around on the beach than a carefully coordinated operation, hence why virtually all of his court cases have failed almost immediately.

Incompetence has nothing to do with defining what an act is, intent does, and you already stated his intent.

If a couple of guys attempt to rob a bank but they forgot to fill their car with petrol, left their ammo at home and get caught fleeing the bank without any cash, you'd still say they attempted to rob a bank. Furthermore, society doesn't pat them on the head and act like they're benign because they're not; on that occasion they failed, on the next occasion they might fail again but kill a bunch of people because of their incompetence.

Or these guys:

Burglar hits partner in head with brick in China in comical break-in

Two would-be burglars in China have comically caused their own undoing after one man hurled a brick at the head of his partner-in-crime.

www.dailymail.co.uk

Trump is utterly incompetent at just about everything he does, it doesn't alter the fact that he has acted with malicious intent from day one as a presidential candidate. Justice (be it law enforcement, overwhelmingly massive protests, etc) should dog his steps at every turn. A civilised society should be overwhelming in its judgement and put him at least in fear of losing his liberty, and possibly his life.

He just tried to steal democracy from you all and you're still treating him like a child, even though he's over 70 and everything he does is obvious yet calculated. The main thing you're demonstrating though is that the next guy who tries this shit just needs to be more subtle about it and give moderates the chance to think they're clever by doing nothing except saying, "you can't be sure...", until it's too late for them to decide they can be sure. It wouldn't have taken a awful lot for a few goons to be sent around to select judges to sway their votes in his favour. In my opinion, the only thing that stopped it happening is that Trump of all people thought he wouldn't get away with it, even though the GOP will give him a pass for just about anything possibly except WW3 and his base are willing and eager to pretend black is white if that's what he wants them to believe.

 

[Starbuck1975]

Incompetence has nothing to do with defining what an act is, intent does, and you already stated his intent.

If a couple of guys attempt to rob a bank but they forgot to fill their car with petrol, left their ammo at home and get caught fleeing the bank without any cash, you'd still say they attempted to rob a bank. Furthermore, society doesn't pat them on the head and act like they're benign because they're not; on that occasion they failed, on the next occasion they might fail again but kill a bunch of people because of their incompetence.

Or these guys:

Burglar hits partner in head with brick in China in comical break-in

Two would-be burglars in China have comically caused their own undoing after one man hurled a brick at the head of his partner-in-crime.

www.dailymail.co.uk

Trump is utterly incompetent at just about everything he does, it doesn't alter the fact that he has acted with malicious intent from day one as a presidential candidate. Justice (be it law enforcement, overwhelmingly massive protests, etc) should dog his steps at every turn. A civilised society should be overwhelming in its judgement and put him at least in fear of losing his liberty, and possibly his life.

He just tried to steal democracy from you all and you're still treating him like a child, even though he's over 70 and everything he does is obvious yet calculated. The main thing you're demonstrating though is that the next guy who tries this shit just needs to be more subtle about it and give moderates the chance to think they're clever by doing nothing except saying, "you can't be sure...", until it's too late for them to decide they can be sure. It wouldn't have taken a awful lot for a few goons to be sent around to select judges to sway their votes in his favour. In my opinion, the only thing that stopped it happening is that Trump of all people thought he wouldn't get away with it, even though the GOP will give him a pass for just about anything possibly except WW3 and his base are willing and eager to pretend black is white if that's what he wants them to believe.

You are of course assuming his intent. I grew up in NY listening to Howard Stern, so I had an awareness to Donald Trump well before he became a national celebrity due to his being on Howard’s show on numerous occasions. Howard in recent weeks has spoken to this topic, especially when Trump supporters dial into the show, which happens often. This is an interesting dynamic, because his audience is very blue collar, so Stern has to maintain a balance. Howard often notes that the unpredictable, callous, narcissistic and unfiltered characteristics that made Trump a great radio guest also make him a horrible President. I agree with this assessment of who Trump is. He is a unique product of the American misguided social media and reality television culture, but his act has reached its end.

 

[fskimospy]

You are of course assuming his intent. I grew up in NY listening to Howard Stern, so I had an awareness to Donald Trump well before he became a national celebrity due to his being on Howard’s show on numerous occasions. Howard in recent weeks has spoken to this topic, especially when Trump supporters dial into the show, which happens often. This is an interesting dynamic, because his audience is very blue collar, so Stern has to maintain a balance. Howard often notes that the unpredictable, callous, narcissistic and unfiltered characteristics that made Trump a great radio guest also make him a horrible President. I agree with this assessment of who Trump is. He is a unique product of the American misguided social media and reality television culture, but his act has reached its end.

Yeah guys, no reason to think a guy wants to overturn an election just because he has spent the last month and a half saying he wants to overturn the election while repeatedly attempting to overturn the election.

That’s just crazy

 

[MtnMan]

You are of course assuming his intent. I grew up in NY listening to Howard Stern, so I had an awareness to Donald Trump well before he became a national celebrity due to his being on Howard’s show on numerous occasions. Howard in recent weeks has spoken to this topic, especially when Trump supporters dial into the show, which happens often. This is an interesting dynamic, because his audience is very blue collar, so Stern has to maintain a balance. Howard often notes that the unpredictable, callous, narcissistic and unfiltered characteristics that made Trump a great radio guest also make him a horrible President. I agree with this assessment of who Trump is. He is a unique product of the American misguided social media and reality television culture, but his act has reached its end.

Stern is a total waste of the oxygen he consumes. He worked with a man for decades, and when the man's wife died of cancer, he could only find it in his heart to send his condolences in a fucking email.

But apparently you started your worship of worthless shit bags long before trump came along.

 

[sportage]

So it seems Donald Trump feels that he is “entitled” to gain a second term simply because he has delivered on a vaccine before the end of the year. HISTORY.... remember that Richard Nixon also felt that he too was ENTITLED to evade impeachment simply because Nixon ended the Vietnam war. Having a vaccine AND ending the Vietnam war were both indeed great accomplishments for any president, but in no way the granting of entitlement.

 

[Starbuck1975]

Stern is a total waste of the oxygen he consumes. He worked with a man for decades, and when the man's wife died of cancer, he could only find it in his heart to send his condolences in a fucking email.

But apparently you started your worship of worthless shit bags long before trump came along.

Edgy

 

[Starbuck1975]

Yeah guys, no reason to think a guy wants to overturn an election just because he has spent the last month and a half saying he wants to overturn the election while repeatedly attempting to overturn the election.

That’s just crazy

ButVenezuela

 

[fskimospy]

So it seems Donald Trump feels that he is “entitled” to gain a second term simply because he has delivered on a vaccine before the end of the year. HISTORY.... remember that Richard Nixon also felt that he too was ENTITLED to evade impeachment simply because Nixon ended the Vietnam war. Having a vaccine AND ending the Vietnam war were both indeed great accomplishments for any president, but in no way the granting of entitlement.

The vaccine was developed in Germany.