Is there anything John Kerry won't flip-flop on? First he loves Arafat, now he hates him?

[Dari]

What Gives?

link

Democratic presidential nominee-to-be John Kerry called Yasser Arafat a "statesman" and a "role model" in a 1997 book that Kerry cites as proof of his own foresight about foreign policy.

Kerry expressed the opposite view eight days ago, when he told Jewish leaders in New York that he shares President Bush's belief that Arafat must be isolated because he's not a "partner for peace" - much less a statesman.

The revelation of Kerry's comments in his 1997 book "The New War" comes on the heels of his contradictory remarks about Israel's security fence and whether or not he'd rely on Jimmy Carter as a Mideast envoy.

"Terrorist organizations with specific political agendas may be encouraged and emboldened by Yasser Arafat's transformation from outlaw to statesman," Kerry wrote in "The New War," now out of print.

Kerry added that terrorists "whose only object is to disrupt society require no such 'role models [as Arafat].' "

Kerry's remarks came as he was dismissing noted historian Paul Johnson as out of date for saying the Palestinian Liberation Organization is "the quintessential terrorist movement" but has achieved nothing for its people.

Just last month, Kerry pointed to his book and told Fox News that it shows he'd be "a president who does see ahead."

Kerry changed his mind "in the years when Arafat rejected peace proposal after peace proposal and failed to stop the violence," said spokesman David Wade.

News of Kerry's about-face on Arafat comes as Bush is seeking to paint Kerry as a waffler who can't be trusted because he flip-flops on key issues.

Last July, Kerry told the Arab American Institute that Israel's security fence is "provocative" and a barrier to peace, but last week, he told Jewish leaders at a New York debate that the fence is "necessary to the security of Israel."

"There's no question that I was none too pleased with reports on what he said [to Jewish leaders]," said Arab American Institute head Jim Zogby, a member of the Democratic National Committee who backs Kerry.

Zogby said he contacted Kerry aides and was told that the Democrat objects to the location of the fence.

 

[Czar]

he is in essence what politics are, telling people what they want to hear not what they need to hear

 

[Red Dawn]

So Kerry strives to get it right while Bush comtinues to get it wrong! I don't know about you guys but over the years I have changed my opinion about many things when I realized that I was wrong in the first place.

Another big Waffler was Clinton. Before the Republicans took over the House he was rather Liberal but once the American People spoke he actually started to out Republican the Republicans (well at least fell square in the Middle like the majority of Americans) and became one of the more effective Presidents we have had in a long time.

 

[Dari]

Originally posted by: Czar
he is in essence what politics are, telling people what they want to hear not what they need to hear

No, not all politicians will change their story that quickly. Sometimes, a man has to make tough choice. Being a fair-weather politician says a lot about your integrity and honor. Taking a stand and staying with it goes a long way. Waffling and determining your policies by what the polls only says that you have no spine and don't deserve to be anywhere near the White House. The most powerful country in history doesn't need a weak-knee as President.

 

[Red Dawn]

Originally posted by: Dari

Originally posted by: Czar
he is in essence what politics are, telling people what they want to hear not what they need to hear

No, not all politicians will change their story that quickly. Sometimes, a man has to make tough choice. Being a fair-weather politician says a lot about your integrity and honor. Taking a stand and staying with it goes a long way. Waffling and determining your policies by what the polls only says that you have no spine and don't deserve to be anywhere near the White House. The most powerful country in history doesn't need a weak-knee as President.

Or a weak minded easily controlled President... not to say the Dub is weak minded.


Actually it seems to me that niether Candidate is satisfactory. We've already seen how poor of a job Bush has done. The question is will Kerry be able to do a better job? That's up tp the American Voters to decide.

 

[Czar]

Originally posted by: Dari

Originally posted by: Czar
he is in essence what politics are, telling people what they want to hear not what they need to hear

No, not all politicians will change their story that quickly. Sometimes, a man has to make tough choice. Being a fair-weather politician says a lot about your integrity and honor. Taking a stand and staying with it goes a long way. Waffling and determining your policies by what the polls only says that you have no spine and don't deserve to be anywhere near the White House. The most powerful country in history doesn't need a weak-knee as President.

so what you are saying is that its better to have someone who sticks to his decisions no matter if the actual outcome is totaly different from the expected outcome than someone who reacts and keeps an open mind to alternative thoughts from his point of view?

 

[Dari]

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: Dari

Originally posted by: Czar
he is in essence what politics are, telling people what they want to hear not what they need to hear

No, not all politicians will change their story that quickly. Sometimes, a man has to make tough choice. Being a fair-weather politician says a lot about your integrity and honor. Taking a stand and staying with it goes a long way. Waffling and determining your policies by what the polls only says that you have no spine and don't deserve to be anywhere near the White House. The most powerful country in history doesn't need a weak-knee as President.

Or a weak minded easily controlled President!

Tell me, why is this Administration considered so conservative when you have so many moderates and "neo-cons" there?

BTW, don't try to get the topic away from your liberal Massachusetts senator. Fact is, he's completely unreliable and will sell himself to the highest bidder. He'll also marry anyone that has money.

 

[Dari]

Originally posted by: Czar

Originally posted by: Dari

Originally posted by: Czar
he is in essence what politics are, telling people what they want to hear not what they need to hear

No, not all politicians will change their story that quickly. Sometimes, a man has to make tough choice. Being a fair-weather politician says a lot about your integrity and honor. Taking a stand and staying with it goes a long way. Waffling and determining your policies by what the polls only says that you have no spine and don't deserve to be anywhere near the White House. The most powerful country in history doesn't need a weak-knee as President.

so what you are saying is that its better to have someone who sticks to his decisions no matter if the actual outcome is totaly different from the expected outcome than someone who reacts and keeps an open mind to alternative thoughts from his point of view?

Nice way of spinnging a waffler. Unfortunately, many people, including myself, see right through this unreliable fool.

 

[Czar]

Originally posted by: Dari

Originally posted by: Czar

Originally posted by: Dari

Originally posted by: Czar
he is in essence what politics are, telling people what they want to hear not what they need to hear

No, not all politicians will change their story that quickly. Sometimes, a man has to make tough choice. Being a fair-weather politician says a lot about your integrity and honor. Taking a stand and staying with it goes a long way. Waffling and determining your policies by what the polls only says that you have no spine and don't deserve to be anywhere near the White House. The most powerful country in history doesn't need a weak-knee as President.

so what you are saying is that its better to have someone who sticks to his decisions no matter if the actual outcome is totaly different from the expected outcome than someone who reacts and keeps an open mind to alternative thoughts from his point of view?

Nice way of spinnging a waffler. Unfortunately, many people, including myself, see right through this unreliable fool.

im just asking, if its not that then could you clarify your position?

 

[Red Dawn]

Originally posted by: Dari

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: Dari

Originally posted by: Czar
he is in essence what politics are, telling people what they want to hear not what they need to hear

No, not all politicians will change their story that quickly. Sometimes, a man has to make tough choice. Being a fair-weather politician says a lot about your integrity and honor. Taking a stand and staying with it goes a long way. Waffling and determining your policies by what the polls only says that you have no spine and don't deserve to be anywhere near the White House. The most powerful country in history doesn't need a weak-knee as President.

Or a weak minded easily controlled President!

Tell me, why is this Administration considered so conservative when you have so many moderates and "neo-cons" there?

BTW, don't try to get the topic away from your liberal Massachusetts senator. Fact is, he's completely unreliable and will sell himself to the highest bidder. He'll also marry anyone that has money.

The fact is? Try proving that he only married Hienz for her money!

 

[zzzz]

you mean he is like this?

 

[Dari]

Originally posted by: Czar

Originally posted by: Dari

Originally posted by: Czar

Originally posted by: Dari

Originally posted by: Czar
he is in essence what politics are, telling people what they want to hear not what they need to hear

No, not all politicians will change their story that quickly. Sometimes, a man has to make tough choice. Being a fair-weather politician says a lot about your integrity and honor. Taking a stand and staying with it goes a long way. Waffling and determining your policies by what the polls only says that you have no spine and don't deserve to be anywhere near the White House. The most powerful country in history doesn't need a weak-knee as President.

so what you are saying is that its better to have someone who sticks to his decisions no matter if the actual outcome is totaly different from the expected outcome than someone who reacts and keeps an open mind to alternative thoughts from his point of view?

Nice way of spinnging a waffler. Unfortunately, many people, including myself, see right through this unreliable fool.

im just asking, if its not that then could you clarify your position?

I expect leaders to make an informed judgement the first time around and stick with it. Their judgement should be based upon their own convictions, not the polls. Leaders are here to lead, and lead with the best interests of the nation behind them. A leader is not someone that will change course everytime a new opportunity presents itself. People like that look incredibly unreliable, dubious, and capricious. People like John Kerry, who is the very definition of a "Massachusetts liberal," are so far left and waffle so much, that they're prone to follow rather than lead. People like that can't make the tough choices to make America and the world a better place.

The world may not be fond of Bush, but at the very least, they can rely on him to stick to his Principles. Remember, a wise man once said that it is better to be Trusted than to be loved.

 

[Dari]

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: Dari

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: Dari

Originally posted by: Czar
he is in essence what politics are, telling people what they want to hear not what they need to hear

No, not all politicians will change their story that quickly. Sometimes, a man has to make tough choice. Being a fair-weather politician says a lot about your integrity and honor. Taking a stand and staying with it goes a long way. Waffling and determining your policies by what the polls only says that you have no spine and don't deserve to be anywhere near the White House. The most powerful country in history doesn't need a weak-knee as President.

Or a weak minded easily controlled President!

Tell me, why is this Administration considered so conservative when you have so many moderates and "neo-cons" there?

BTW, don't try to get the topic away from your liberal Massachusetts senator. Fact is, he's completely unreliable and will sell himself to the highest bidder. He'll also marry anyone that has money.

The fact is? Try proving that he only married Hienz for her money!

The proof is in the precedent. As soon as her husband died, Kerry was asking her out.

 

[Red Dawn]

Originally posted by: Dari

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: Dari

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: Dari

Originally posted by: Czar
he is in essence what politics are, telling people what they want to hear not what they need to hear

No, not all politicians will change their story that quickly. Sometimes, a man has to make tough choice. Being a fair-weather politician says a lot about your integrity and honor. Taking a stand and staying with it goes a long way. Waffling and determining your policies by what the polls only says that you have no spine and don't deserve to be anywhere near the White House. The most powerful country in history doesn't need a weak-knee as President.

Or a weak minded easily controlled President!

Tell me, why is this Administration considered so conservative when you have so many moderates and "neo-cons" there?

BTW, don't try to get the topic away from your liberal Massachusetts senator. Fact is, he's completely unreliable and will sell himself to the highest bidder. He'll also marry anyone that has money.

The fact is? Try proving that he only married Hienz for her money!

The proof is in the precedent. As soon as her husband died, Kerry was asking her out.

I know that hetrosexual love is something that is foriegn to you but despite your ignorance you must at least concede that is more probably the likelyhood for her marrying him. BTW, wasn't there a Pre-nup involved?

 

[Dari]

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: Dari

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: Dari

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: Dari

Originally posted by: Czar
he is in essence what politics are, telling people what they want to hear not what they need to hear

No, not all politicians will change their story that quickly. Sometimes, a man has to make tough choice. Being a fair-weather politician says a lot about your integrity and honor. Taking a stand and staying with it goes a long way. Waffling and determining your policies by what the polls only says that you have no spine and don't deserve to be anywhere near the White House. The most powerful country in history doesn't need a weak-knee as President.

Or a weak minded easily controlled President!

Tell me, why is this Administration considered so conservative when you have so many moderates and "neo-cons" there?

BTW, don't try to get the topic away from your liberal Massachusetts senator. Fact is, he's completely unreliable and will sell himself to the highest bidder. He'll also marry anyone that has money.

The fact is? Try proving that he only married Hienz for her money!

The proof is in the precedent. As soon as her husband died, Kerry was asking her out.

I know that hetrosexual love is something that is foriegn to you but despite your ignorance you must at least concede that is more probably the likelyhood for her marrying him. BTW, wasn't there a Pre-nup involved?

Interesting, in one thread you defend homosexual marriage. In another, you deride others as homosexuals. Either you're confused or bi, maybe both. But I have no problem proving my heterosexuality with your wife. At least for once in her life, she'll go to sleep with a smile (among other things) on her face. But I digress...

Of course there was a pre-nup, she saw his gameplan, again, based on precedent, and was quick to protect her stash from this old lolita.

 

[dirtboy]

I love reading how all the liberals here are saying it's okay to waffle. hahahaha

Yet in the light of the 9/11 attacks, Bush was forced to change his mind and they will be the first to tell you that he is a liar and didn't keep his word.

Yet they want to elect someone who changes his views on an hourly basis -- and they respect it!

They hypocritical liberal mind never ceases to amaze me.

 

[Red Dawn]

Originally posted by: Dari

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: Dari

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: Dari

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: Dari

Originally posted by: Czar
he is in essence what politics are, telling people what they want to hear not what they need to hear

No, not all politicians will change their story that quickly. Sometimes, a man has to make tough choice. Being a fair-weather politician says a lot about your integrity and honor. Taking a stand and staying with it goes a long way. Waffling and determining your policies by what the polls only says that you have no spine and don't deserve to be anywhere near the White House. The most powerful country in history doesn't need a weak-knee as President.

Or a weak minded easily controlled President!

Tell me, why is this Administration considered so conservative when you have so many moderates and "neo-cons" there?

BTW, don't try to get the topic away from your liberal Massachusetts senator. Fact is, he's completely unreliable and will sell himself to the highest bidder. He'll also marry anyone that has money.

The fact is? Try proving that he only married Hienz for her money!

The proof is in the precedent. As soon as her husband died, Kerry was asking her out.

I know that hetrosexual love is something that is foriegn to you but despite your ignorance you must at least concede that is more probably the likelyhood for her marrying him. BTW, wasn't there a Pre-nup involved?

Interesting, in one thread you defend homosexual marriage. In another, you deride others as homosexuals. Either you're confused or bi, maybe both. But I have no problem proving my heterosexuality with your wife. At least for once in her life, she'll go to sleep with a smile (among other things) on her face. But I digress...

Of course there was a pre-nup, she saw his gameplan, again, based on precedent, and was quick to protect her stash from this old lolita.

Hey I didn't mean to deride you for being gay, after all it's really none of my business just like the reason Kerry and his wifes reason for getting married is none or your or our business.

You say you would make my wife smile, what would you do, redecorate her liivng room?

 

[sMiLeYz]

Big deal. everyone thought Arafat was a cool cat back in day. But then everyone else realized he was a two faced control freak, who only continues to perpetuate the Palestinian condition.

How is that weak-ass argument going to change my mind about voting against Bush? Even though it turned out not to be true, that cheating on his wife bit had me questioning Kerry's abilities more than this.

But keep trying to humor us, Dari.

 

[Czar]

Originally posted by: Dari
I expect leaders to make an informed judgement the first time around and stick with it. Their judgement should be based upon their own convictions, not the polls. Leaders are here to lead, and lead with the best interests of the nation behind them. A leader is not someone that will change course everytime a new opportunity presents itself. People like that look incredibly unreliable, dubious, and capricious. People like John Kerry, who is the very definition of a "Massachusetts liberal," are so far left and waffle so much, that they're prone to follow rather than lead. People like that can't make the tough choices to make America and the world a better place.

The world may not be fond of Bush, but at the very least, they can rely on him to stick to his Principles. Remember, a wise man once said that it is better to be Trusted than to be loved.

so that if a leader makes up his mind on something based on what is currently known he should not change his decision if some new information comes up?


btw, a wise man indeed

 

[Dari]

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: Dari

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: Dari

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: Dari

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: Dari

Originally posted by: Czar
he is in essence what politics are, telling people what they want to hear not what they need to hear

No, not all politicians will change their story that quickly. Sometimes, a man has to make tough choice. Being a fair-weather politician says a lot about your integrity and honor. Taking a stand and staying with it goes a long way. Waffling and determining your policies by what the polls only says that you have no spine and don't deserve to be anywhere near the White House. The most powerful country in history doesn't need a weak-knee as President.

Or a weak minded easily controlled President!

Tell me, why is this Administration considered so conservative when you have so many moderates and "neo-cons" there?

BTW, don't try to get the topic away from your liberal Massachusetts senator. Fact is, he's completely unreliable and will sell himself to the highest bidder. He'll also marry anyone that has money.

The fact is? Try proving that he only married Hienz for her money!

The proof is in the precedent. As soon as her husband died, Kerry was asking her out.

I know that hetrosexual love is something that is foriegn to you but despite your ignorance you must at least concede that is more probably the likelyhood for her marrying him. BTW, wasn't there a Pre-nup involved?

Interesting, in one thread you defend homosexual marriage. In another, you deride others as homosexuals. Either you're confused or bi, maybe both. But I have no problem proving my heterosexuality with your wife. At least for once in her life, she'll go to sleep with a smile (among other things) on her face. But I digress...

Of course there was a pre-nup, she saw his gameplan, again, based on precedent, and was quick to protect her stash from this old lolita.

Hey I didn't mean to deride you for being gay, after all it's really none of my business just like the reason Kerry and his wifes reason for getting married is none or your or our business.

You say you would make my wife smile, what would you do, redecorate her liivng room?

No, no decorating from me. That's not my style. What would make her smile would be a big change from your grass snake.

As for Kerry, I really don't know what else to say to you. If precedent does show you a pattern, I don't know what will. Either you're stupid or confused.

Originally posted by: sMiLeYz
Big deal. everyone thought Arafat was a cool cat back in day. But then everyone else realized he was a two faced control freak, who only continues to perpetuate the Palestinian condition.

How is that weak-ass argument going to change my mind about voting against Bush? Even though it turned out not to be true, that cheating on his wife bit had me questioning Kerry's abilities more than this.

But keep trying to humor us, Dari.

Speak for yourself. there were many people, including me, questioning Clinton's eagerness to work with arafat. The man could not be trusted 30, 20, 10 years ago. He can't even be trusted today. Hell, the man stole billions of dollars meant for the Palestinian people. Hmmm, maybe Kerry wanted to marry him because of that.

As for you not voting for the President, intelligence never was your strong point.

Originally posted by: Czar

Originally posted by: Dari
I expect leaders to make an informed judgement the first time around and stick with it. Their judgement should be based upon their own convictions, not the polls. Leaders are here to lead, and lead with the best interests of the nation behind them. A leader is not someone that will change course everytime a new opportunity presents itself. People like that look incredibly unreliable, dubious, and capricious. People like John Kerry, who is the very definition of a "Massachusetts liberal," are so far left and waffle so much, that they're prone to follow rather than lead. People like that can't make the tough choices to make America and the world a better place.

The world may not be fond of Bush, but at the very least, they can rely on him to stick to his Principles. Remember, a wise man once said that it is better to be Trusted than to be loved.

so that if a leader makes up his mind on something based on what is currently known he should not change his decision if some new information comes up?


btw, a wise man indeed

nothing has changed about Arafat in all his 60-odd years. Kerry changed his mind when the numerologists at the polling houses told him to.

 

[zzzz]

I think a leader should make his decisions based on a (approx) 2000 year old book. That way, he doesnt have to change his decisions based on the so called "new evidence".

 

[JackStorm]

Yeah, this sounds like Kerry alright. And people wonder why I wouldn't vote for the guy. I mean, I do want Bush out of office. But do I want him replaced by this guy? Hell no. And I'm inclined to agree with Dari on one point, people (yeah, that includes me) may not like Bush. But I doubt Kerry will be much better. Kerry seems to flip-flop way to often (There's a limit to how much someone can flip-flop without looking like an idiot).

Which brings me to the conclusion that this election will suck. Both Bush and Kerry have said one thing then done another. I mean, how can an election NOT suck when both of the main candidates are fuckwads.

 

[Czar]

Originally posted by: JackStorm
Yeah, this sounds like Kerry alright. And people wonder why I wouldn't vote for the guy. I mean, I do want Bush out of office. But do I want him replaced by this guy? Hell no. And I'm inclined to agree with Dari on one point, people (yeah, that includes me) may not like Bush. But I doubt Kerry will be much better. Kerry seems to flip-flop way to often (There's a limit to how much someone can flip-flop without looking like an idiot).

Which brings me to the conclusion that this election will suck. Both Bush and Kerry have said one thing then done another. I mean, how can an election NOT suck when both of the main candidates are fuckwads.

I agree, except I want Kerry more there than Bush. Its not about being happy with one guy over the other its about saying I dont accept what is currently happening so I want someone new. By allowing Bush to have 4 more years you are sending him the message that he is doing a good job and can continue doing what he has been doing.

 

[Dari]

Originally posted by: Czar

Originally posted by: JackStorm
Yeah, this sounds like Kerry alright. And people wonder why I wouldn't vote for the guy. I mean, I do want Bush out of office. But do I want him replaced by this guy? Hell no. And I'm inclined to agree with Dari on one point, people (yeah, that includes me) may not like Bush. But I doubt Kerry will be much better. Kerry seems to flip-flop way to often (There's a limit to how much someone can flip-flop without looking like an idiot).

Which brings me to the conclusion that this election will suck. Both Bush and Kerry have said one thing then done another. I mean, how can an election NOT suck when both of the main candidates are fuckwads.

I agree, except I want Kerry more there than Bush. Its not about being happy with one guy over the other its about saying I dont accept what is currently happening so I want someone new. By allowing Bush to have 4 more years you are sending him the message that he is doing a good job and can continue doing what he has been doing.

Since when are foreigners allowed to debate/vote in an American election?
BTW, Bush is doing a great job.

EDIT: BTW, Czar, John Kerry looks like the fantasy President you and a lot of liberal Europeans have envisioned. That alone should be a red flag for any American.

 

[sMiLeYz]

Speak for yourself. there were many people, including me, questioning Clinton's eagerness to work with arafat. The man could not be trusted 30, 20, 10 years ago. He can't even be trusted today. Hell, the man stole billions of dollars meant for the Palestinian people. Hmmm, maybe Kerry wanted to marry him because of that.

As for you not voting for the President, intelligence never was your strong point.

hahhaah... classic irony!

I'm being called 'stupid' by Dari, for choosing not to vote for a president whos known for his stupidity.

Oh man, I thought you said you were a democrat too? Or was that suppose to be ironic?

Nevertheless, keep reminding me and the rest of the forum why we never take you seriously.