Is there a difference between memory manufacturers?

[DarkRogue]

Hello,

I'm looking to purchase parts for a new PC in the next couple days, and I've gotten most of my list together except I'm still missing RAM and a mobo (lol..)

Anyway, I used to use Crucial's ram almost exclusively back in the PC133 SDRAM days and into the DDR1 sticks I am using in my currently aging PC. I'm looking to build my next rig with 4GB of DDR2 800, but it seems Newegg does not stock any made by Crucial, so I have to choose another manufacturer. Is there a difference between all these different companies or can I just go with the cheapest one and go nuts with it?

For the record, I will be OC'ing an e8400 to 400FSB just to match the DDR speed, I believe I'll be leaving the ram alone but I do recall reading some people had preferences about the chips on the sticks themselves, and I'm not sure what to look for in "good" memory anymore.

Any help (or a link to a newegg recommendation) would be much appreciated, thanks in advance.

 

[NinjaJedi]

Most high end modules will be using mircron chips. There is little difference in modules that use like chips other than binning, brand name, heat sink, warranty and price. Most of these top tier manufacturers receive the chips already binned and then they just slap them on the PCB and add a heat sink. Here is a link to manufacturing process. There are link to other companies at the bottom and they all pretty much do the same thing.
http://www.hardwaresecrets.com/article/203

 

[DarkRogue]

Thanks for the reply.

"Most" high end modules? How would you check this to make sure? And are there any known brands that don't use this? What's the advantage of the Micron chips anyway?
I'm sorry for the machinegun rate of questions but I used to think most ram was the same.

 

[NinjaJedi]

No problem. Most companies will use many different types/brands of chips and sometimes it is hard to determine if they use micron chips or not. Usually checking the manufacturers web site can determine this. Sometimes it may require a little more research like asking in forums or emailing the company. The reason the micron chips are liked by the enthusiast community is because they are usually very good over clockers.

 

[NXIL]

it seems Newegg does not stock any made by Crucial

Hi!

Lots of Crucial @ Newegg:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/...yCodeValue=523%3A29188

Sorry, didn't filter out the non-800+ models, but....

Lots of other brands to choose from, here sorted by best rating--

http://www.newegg.com/Product/...yCodeValue=524%3A27481

Some I would recommend: Kingston, Crucial, Corsair, in that order, then others....Mushkin, Geil, Adata, etc.....

http://www.newegg.com/Product/...5590%2CN82E16820220144

Just the two by 2GB kits:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/...yCodeValue=524%3A27481

Ones I would recommend: YMMV

All 1.8V, standard, like the Crucial you are used to, including one Crucial set:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/...4582%2CN82E16820148160

HTH

NXIL

 

[NinjaJedi]

Originally posted by: NXIL

it seems Newegg does not stock any made by Crucial

Hi!

Lots of Crucial @ Newegg:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/...yCodeValue=523%3A29188

Sorry, didn't filter out the non-800+ models, but....

Lots of other brands to choose from, here sorted by best rating--

http://www.newegg.com/Product/...yCodeValue=524%3A27481

Some I would recommend: Kingston, Crucial, Corsair, in that order, then others....Mushkin, Geil, Adata, etc.....

http://www.newegg.com/Product/...5590%2CN82E16820220144

Just the two by 2GB kits:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/...yCodeValue=524%3A27481

Ones I would recommend: YMMV

All 1.8V, standard, like the Crucial you are used to, including one Crucial set:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/...4582%2CN82E16820148160

HTH

NXIL

he is looking for 4gb kits of crucial.

 

[DarkRogue]

Man, for some reason this thread isn't notifying me of new replies.

Anyway, that last link actually is a 4GB Crucial kit but it's out of stock lol.
But yes, I am looking for 4GB Dual Channel kits (2x2GB).

I'm not going to "overclock" the ram though, the only thing I'm doing is increasing my CPU's FSB to 400 to match the ram's speed. (That and OC my 8800GT slightly but that's a different story..) I have heard of Kingston and Corsair before and they seem fairly popular. Mushkin, Geil and Adata are completely unknown to me. I'm surprised no one's talked about OCZ yet, I see them used a lot in hardware review/benchmark sites. Is there something bad I should know about them?

Also do the timings matter too much? I'm aware tighter/lower timings are better but when the difference between these modules are rated at 5-5-5-18 vs 5-4-4-12, is there that big of an improvement or is it like a 1% difference in performance? Last thing I don't know about is the voltages.. I used to just plug them in and go at it, but is it something I should keep my eye on?

Thanks again.

FWIW, I was eyeing the Corsair and OCZ kits myself, but I was unsure if any of the others were better or not.

 

[NXIL]

he is looking for 4gb kits of crucial.

Hey Nin, you his boyfriend?

I'm not sure what to look for in "good" memory anymore.

Any help (or a link to a newegg recommendation) would be much appreciated, thanks in advance.

I'm looking to build my next rig with 4GB of DDR2 800 [no brand name inserted here]

Links above lists one 2 x 2gb Crucial kit, ddr2 800. At Newegg.

It lists other high quality 2 x 2GB kits as well, as the OP is comfortable with Crucial, but is not a Crucial fan boy.

Your link to the Patriot Memory Factory in Fremont: excellent, but, that helps because

??

Cute:

http://www.hardwaresecrets.com/fullimage.php?image=1895

All he has to do is figure out where the memory she is assembling gets delivered to, and go there and buy it.

 

[NXIL]

Hi Rogue,

my own personal view, based on experiences of people I work with is that OCZ ram is not quite as good/easy to work with as Kingston, Crucial, and Corsair.

I have had the best luck with Kingston and Crucial myself, though I have seen reports that some of Crucial's high end ram has issues, perhaps pertaining to its needing high (2.2) voltage.

I do prefer to use JDEC standard 1.8V ram, and in the last link with the 2 x 2gb kits, all of them were filtered for being 1.8v parts. That way you *will* be able to just plug them in and go.

Timings: from what I read, they make more of a difference in benchmarks than in actual use, and that most people cannot tell a difference. Memory bandwidth doesn't seem to be too much of a bottleneck on newer systems.

I do think one of these two, both in stock, will serve you well:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/...2c2599%3a22476&bop=And

HTH

NXIL

 

[n7]

Some clarification here:

NinjaJedi is right. Somewhat.

The high end 2x1 GB kits use Micron D9GMH or [very rare now] D9GKX.

There is a ton of lower end Micron RAM though, which doesn't clock well at all.

For 2x2 GB kits, Micron used to make some nice ICs, like D9GSV in all the best Mushkin kits, but those days are gone now, as they no longer make that.

Since we're talking 2x2 GB, the best kits use Powerchips right now, NOT Micron (unless you want to spend $300+ on the old Mushkin kits).

If all you really want is to OC an E8400 to 3200 Mhz, then DDR2-800 will do the trick.

Considering you can usually do 4+ GHz though, some DDR2-800 kits might not get that far.

DDR2-1000 is a safe bet if you want 4+ GHz for an E8400.

If you're not concerned with tweaking the RAM much or clocking the CPU very high, but still want something that could do some overclocking if so desired, here's a few suggestion for kits i know will clock decently.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/...x?Item=N82E16820231122

http://www.newegg.com/Product/...x?Item=N82E16820146731

http://www.newegg.com/Product/...x?Item=N82E16820146726

http://www.newegg.com/Product/...x?Item=N82E16820220269

http://www.newegg.com/Product/...x?Item=N82E16820227267

http://www.newegg.com/Product/...x?Item=N82E16820313042

The one i'd look at for an E8400: http://www.newegg.com/Product/...x?Item=N82E16820231145

A general rule is that if a kit can do DDR2-800 TCL 4 (CAS 4), it can likely get DDR2-900 TCL 5, if not much better.

 

[DarkRogue]

So good memory modules no longer use Micron chips, but rather "Powerchips"?
Not that I know how to find that out to begin with lol, I just checked the Corsair site and got completely lost.

In any case, all of the kits you linked to seem to use above 1.8v, although the 4-4-4-12 timings look impressive.
Is the higher voltage a cause for concern, or is there something extra I need to do to get it running?

The Corsair kit still seems the most affordable at $75 after MIR though.
Is Mushkin a very good company? The name sounds kinda ..... well.. lol.

I don't want to go crazy overclocking the CPU because I only have a 380w PSU, I can't push it too far. I'll be happy if I can get it to boot 3.6GHz lol.

 

[NinjaJedi]

Honestly IMO if you are not going to go past the specified speed it does not matter what brand you use.

 

[n7]

No offense, but if you're judging companies by the sound of their name...

For relatively basic OCing like you're looking at, any DDR2-800 will do, sure.

 

[DarkRogue]

I was trying to be funny, sorry

In any case, I'm not sure a cas latency difference of 1 will make or break my games so if that's the case I will probably go with the Corsairs as they seem really cheap with that MIR.

 

[n7]

They won't break anything

TCL 4 vs. 5 doesn't noticeably affect things other than your SuperPi & Everest scores (or overclockability in some cases).

 

[Mr Fox]

Originally posted by: DarkRogue
So good memory modules no longer use Micron chips, but rather "Powerchips"?
Not that I know how to find that out to begin with lol, I just checked the Corsair site and got completely lost.

keep this in mind that it applies to 2 x 2 Gig kits only the 512 Mbit IC's are most economically provided by Superchips from Taiwan. The Micron Chips perform the same, and cost more.

Originally posted by: DarkRogue
In any case, all of the kits you linked to seem to use above 1.8v, although the 4-4-4-12 timings look impressive.
Is the higher voltage a cause for concern, or is there something extra I need to do to get it running?

Higher voltage is not as major of an issue as it was in the past, there have been engineering solutions that have been applied to improve thermal impedance, and electron leakage.

Originally posted by: DarkRogue
The Corsair kit still seems the most affordable at $75 after MIR though.
Is Mushkin a very good company? The name sounds kinda ..... well.. lol.

I don't want to go crazy overclocking the CPU because I only have a 380w PSU, I can't push it too far. I'll be happy if I can get it to boot 3.6GHz lol.

Mushkin is an outstanding small vendor, and they are known for quality, and customer service. They are great as far as support, and customer service. They want you as a future customer, and you are treated that way in asking questions, and handling issues.

Crucial is the only other vendor that is that good IMHO.

 

[NinjaJedi]

I'm almost 100% that these use micron D9 chips. Low timings like the 2GB kits. A little more expensive but if you want the best you got to pay to play.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/...x?Item=N82E16820146726

I would also recommend Patriot I have them in my machine. I am not certain on the chips in them though.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/...x?Item=N82E16820220269

With a better HS

http://www.newegg.com/Product/...x?Item=N82E16820220293

 

[Penley]

What's are your folks' opinions of G.Skill as a product and as a company? I know anandtech recommended them as the way to go for 2x1GB DDR2 800 but I hear they use something other than micron? I want to OC an E8400 to 4GHz, so 450 FSB at 1:1 -> DDR2 900. I tried some crucial DDR2 800, but was disappointed by the lack of FSB capability even at 2.2V and really lose timings. Will the G.Skill do better or should I go for a ballistix or other module rated at DDR2 1066?

 

[Mr Fox]

Originally posted by: Penley
What's are your folks' opinions of G.Skill as a product and as a company? I know anandtech recommended them as the way to go for 2x1GB DDR2 800 but I hear they use something other than micron? I want to OC an E8400 to 4GHz, so 450 FSB at 1:1 -> DDR2 900. I tried some crucial DDR2 800, but was disappointed by the lack of FSB capability even at 2.2V and really lose timings. Will the G.Skill do better or should I go for a ballistix or other module rated at DDR2 1066?

G. Skill is also an excellent vendor N7, JustaGeek and a number of others here speak very highly about their products. I have some of their Laptop Memory, and it has been good so far, and runs like OEM no errors or funkyness.

To hit the target you are going for PC2 8000 is probably best.

G.SKILL 4GB(2 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 1000 (PC2 8000) ----It is also available 2 x 1 Gig.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/...x?Item=N82E16820231145

 

[NinjaJedi]

Originally posted by: Mr Fox

Originally posted by: Penley
What's are your folks' opinions of G.Skill as a product and as a company? I know anandtech recommended them as the way to go for 2x1GB DDR2 800 but I hear they use something other than micron? I want to OC an E8400 to 4GHz, so 450 FSB at 1:1 -> DDR2 900. I tried some crucial DDR2 800, but was disappointed by the lack of FSB capability even at 2.2V and really lose timings. Will the G.Skill do better or should I go for a ballistix or other module rated at DDR2 1066?

G. Skill is also an excellent vendor N7, JustaGeek and a number of others here speak very highly about their products. I have some of their Laptop Memory, and it has been good so far, and runs like OEM no errors or funkyness.

To hit the target you are going for PC2 8000 is probably best.

G.SKILL 4GB(2 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 1000 (PC2 8000) ----It is also available 2 x 1 Gig.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/...x?Item=N82E16820231145

I would recommend them also though I have never used them myself. The kit I have Patriot pc-6400 (4-4-4-12) is rated to run at 1000 with 5-5-5-15 timings. I am not sure at what point the timings will need to be raised but I assume it might be around 900.
The kit is only $45 at frys.

http://shop4.outpost.com/produ...2ccMg2VBTlhkD3ZfeQik+g**.node1?site=sr:SEARCH:MAIN_RSLT_PG

 

[Mr Fox]

Originally posted by: NinjaJedi
I'm almost 100% that these use micron D9 chips. Low timings like the 2GB kits. A little more expensive but if you want the best you got to pay to play.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/...x?Item=N82E16820146726

I would also recommend Patriot I have them in my machine. I am not certain on the chips in them though.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/...x?Item=N82E16820220269

With a better HS

http://www.newegg.com/Product/...x?Item=N82E16820220293

Mushkin 996580 is confirmed to be Powerchips... I called Mushkin Last week to confirm what they were fabricating.

They will clock over 1000 with the right MoBo.

With memory prices at bargin basement prices the fabricators are forced by economics to use different chips... we are lucky that Powerchips clock well.

 

[NinjaJedi]

Originally posted by: Mr Fox

Originally posted by: NinjaJedi
I'm almost 100% that these use micron D9 chips. Low timings like the 2GB kits. A little more expensive but if you want the best you got to pay to play.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/...x?Item=N82E16820146726

I would also recommend Patriot I have them in my machine. I am not certain on the chips in them though.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/...x?Item=N82E16820220269

With a better HS

http://www.newegg.com/Product/...x?Item=N82E16820220293

Mushkin 996580 is confirmed to be Powerchips... I called Mushkin Last week to confirm what they were fabricating.

They will clock over 1000 with the right MoBo.

With memory prices at bargin basement prices the fabricators are forced by economics to use different chips... we are lucky that Powerchips clock well.

Ah I stand corrected. I remember newegg having a mushkin kit (same specs and heatsink) that stated "uses micron D9 chips" I guess that was an older kit that they don't sell anymore.

 

[n7]

Originally posted by: NinjaJedi

Originally posted by: Mr Fox

Originally posted by: NinjaJedi
I'm almost 100% that these use micron D9 chips. Low timings like the 2GB kits. A little more expensive but if you want the best you got to pay to play.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/...x?Item=N82E16820146726

I would also recommend Patriot I have them in my machine. I am not certain on the chips in them though.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/...x?Item=N82E16820220269

With a better HS

http://www.newegg.com/Product/...x?Item=N82E16820220293

Mushkin 996580 is confirmed to be Powerchips... I called Mushkin Last week to confirm what they were fabricating.

They will clock over 1000 with the right MoBo.

With memory prices at bargin basement prices the fabricators are forced by economics to use different chips... we are lucky that Powerchips clock well.

Ah I stand corrected. I remember newegg having a mushkin kit (same specs and heatsink) that stated "uses micron D9 chips" I guess that was an older kit that they don't sell anymore.

The older Mushkin 2x2 GB kits used to use D9GSV, as i mentioned in an earlier post, but all their newer kits don't.

The Mushkin 996580 is an extremely good 2x2 GB DDR2-800 kit, more than likely the best one out there.
It clocks just as high as the DDR2-1000 kits out there, in some cases higher.

I can't even properly clock mine since i have to use SPD to keep TRFC @ 51, but even with SPD (which is actually very tight subtimings other than TRFC), i got to over DDR2-1100
http://img166.imageshack.us/im...mtestddr2110183fd8.jpg

 

[NinjaJedi]

Originally posted by: NXIL

he is looking for 4gb kits of crucial.

Hey Nin, you his boyfriend?

I'm not sure what to look for in "good" memory anymore.

Any help (or a link to a newegg recommendation) would be much appreciated, thanks in advance.

I'm looking to build my next rig with 4GB of DDR2 800 [no brand name inserted here]

Links above lists one 2 x 2gb Crucial kit, ddr2 800. At Newegg.

It lists other high quality 2 x 2GB kits as well, as the OP is comfortable with Crucial, but is not a Crucial fan boy.

Your link to the Patriot Memory Factory in Fremont: excellent, but, that helps because

??

Cute:

http://www.hardwaresecrets.com/fullimage.php?image=1895

All he has to do is figure out where the memory she is assembling gets delivered to, and go there and buy it.

To be honest after clicking the first two links and seeing no 4GB kits I didn't bother clicking the others. My mistake. All I did was inform you that he wanted 4GB kits. He wanted 4GB kits of crucial but since they did not have what he wanted he asked if there is a difference in different memory manufacturers. My link help show that there is very little difference.

 

[n7]

Let's keep this thread on track, take the flaming to PMs...