Is the whole muslim world guilty of letting the Taliban grow in strength

dahunan

Lifer
Jan 10, 2002
18,191
3
0
they have been around for a long time now..

all they do is demand society go back into the stone ages

I think all muslims should stand up and take arms against them and kill them all

Why were they allowed to become so powerful?

---

Thanks for the bigotry. Posted for mod discussion.

Harvey
Senior AnandTech Moderator
 

Dari

Lifer
Oct 25, 2002
17,133
38
91
That's a silly and bias notion. Just because you're a Muslim does not mean you can control the action of other Muslims. That's like you blaming Christians for the countless pogroms against Jews, including the Holocaust.
 

dahunan

Lifer
Jan 10, 2002
18,191
3
0
Originally posted by: Dari
That's a silly and bias notion. Just because you're a Muslim does not mean you can control the action of other Muslims. That's like you blaming Christians for the countless pogroms against Jews, including the Holocaust.



lmao.... Hitler was a Christian? ok..

Uhm.. Jews had the ultimate christian killed, no?
 

Craig234

Lifer
May 1, 2006
38,548
350
126
Go read Devil's Game: How the United States Helped Unleash Fundamentalist Islam, a book that describes the history starting with Englands support of Islamic radical forces though the US doing the same.

That'll be a start for understanding the issue. BTW, which side invades more?

Synopsis

The first complete account of America?s most
dangerous foreign policy miscalculation: sixty years of support for Islamic fundamentalism

Devil?s Game is the gripping story of America?s misguided efforts, stretching across decades, to dominate the strategically vital Middle East by courting and cultivating Islamic fundamentalism. Among all the books about Islam, this is the first comprehensive inquiry into the touchiest issue: How and why did the United States encourage and finance the spread of radical political Islam?

Backed by extensive archival research and interviews with dozens of policy makers and CIA, Pentagon, and foreign service officials, Robert Dreyfuss argues that this largely hidden relationship is greatly to blame for the global explosion of terrorism. He follows the trail of American collusion from support for the Muslim Brotherhood in 1950s Egypt to links with Khomeini and Afghani jihadists to cooperation with Hamas and Saudi Wahhabism. Dreyfuss also uncovers long-standing ties between radical Islamists and the leading banks of the West. The result is as tragic as it is paradoxical: originally deployed as pawns to foil nationalism and communism, extremist mullahs and ayatollahs now dominate the region, thundering against freedom of thought, science, women?s rights, secularism?and their former patron.

Wide-ranging and deeply informed, Devil?s Game reveals a history of double-dealing, cynical exploitation, and humiliating embarrassment. What emerges is a pattern that, far from furthering democracy or security, ensures a future of blunders and blowback.


Publishers Weekly
One of the CIA's first great moments of institutional reflection occurred in 1953, after American covert operatives helped overthrow Iran's left-leaning government and restored the Shah to power. The agency, then only six years old, had funded ayatollahs, mobilized the religious right and engineered a sophisticated propaganda campaign to successfully further its aims, and it wanted to know how it could reapply such tradecraft elsewhere, so it commissioned an internal report. Half a century later, the most prescient line from that report is one of caution, not optimism. "Possibilities of blowback against the United States should always be in the back of the minds of all CIA officers," the document warned. Since this first known use of the term "blowback," countless journalists and scholars have chronicled the greatest blowback of all: how the staggering quantities of aid that America provided to anti-Marxist Islamic extremists during the Cold War inadvertently positioned those very same extremists to become America's next great enemy. (Indeed, Iran's religious leaders were among the first to turn against the United States.) Dreyfuss's volume reaches farther and deeper into the subject than most. He convincingly situates America's attempt to build an Islamic bulwark against Soviet expansion into Britain's history of imperialism in the region. And where other authors restrict their focus to the Afghan mujahideen, Dreyfuss details a history of American support-sometimes conducted with startling blindness, sometimes, tacitly through proxies-for Islamic radicals in Egypt, Israel, Saudi Arabia and Syria. At times, the assistance occurred openly through the American private sector, as Dreyfuss describes in a fascinating digression on Islamic banking. But ultimately, too few government officials were paying attention to the growth and dangers of political Islam. A CIA officer summarizes Dreyfuss's case when he says, "We saw it all in a short-term perspective"-the long-term consequences are what we're facing now. (Nov.) Copyright 2005 Reed Business Information.
 

0marTheZealot

Golden Member
Apr 5, 2004
1,692
0
0
Originally posted by: dahunan
Originally posted by: Dari
That's a silly and bias notion. Just because you're a Muslim does not mean you can control the action of other Muslims. That's like you blaming Christians for the countless pogroms against Jews, including the Holocaust.



lmao.... Hitler was a Christian? ok..

Uhm.. Jews had the ultimate christian killed, no?

Hitler was most definitely a theist, perhaps not a Roman Catholic or a Protestant. There are hundreds of quotes by him showing that he believed in the Creator and that what he was doing was favored by the Creator. I don't know how the meme that Hitler was an atheist started. It was Stalin that was the atheist, not Hitler.
 

FaaR

Golden Member
Dec 28, 2007
1,056
412
136
Originally posted by: dahunan
Uhm.. Jews had the ultimate christian killed, no?
History fail! Go back to school with you.

THE ROMANS alledgedly killed "Jesus" (which is a greek name btw and not a hebrew one...) So therefore we should blame all italians instead, rather than the jews. :p

Anyway, you can't collectively blame people for the actions of others, including people who live in entirely different countries and on different continents. Otherwise there's no limit to the amount of nonsense we'd have to accept when trying to place blame. So all muslims are guilty for the taliban growing strong, okay. Well, some of those muslims are american citizens. That automatically makes all americans guilty as well.

Also, america actively supported the taliban in the past, when it suited U.S. geopolitical motives and goals...

See how dumb your reasoning is?
 

IronWing

No Lifer
Jul 20, 2001
72,426
33,010
136
Originally posted by: dahunan

Why were they allowed to become so powerful?

The Pakistanis fund the Taliban to exert Pakistani influence in Afghanistan. The US funds Pakistan to fight al-Qaeda. Al-Qaeda is sheltered by the Taliban. The snake eats its own tail.
 

IronWing

No Lifer
Jul 20, 2001
72,426
33,010
136
Originally posted by: FaaR
Originally posted by: dahunan
Uhm.. Jews had the ultimate christian killed, no?
History fail! Go back to school with you.

THE ROMANS alledgedly killed "Jesus" (which is a greek name btw and not a hebrew one...) So therefore we should blame all italians instead, rather than the jews. :p
...
See how dumb your reasoning is?

<cough> Um, scholars settled this some time ago...

:music:

Now some say the Romans killed Jesus
And some say it was the Jews
And some say that it was King Herod
And some say it was me and you

But when I think of the cross he was nailed to
And the tree that was logged for the wood
I realize 'twas the loggers killed Jesus
And it's time that we got them back good

So spike a tree for Jesus spike a tree for Jesus
and Jesus will love you you know
Spike a tree for Jesus Spike a tree for Jesus
and someday to heaven you'll go
Now the logger who cut that old tree down
He was just going 'long with the mob
When asked why he did it he answered
I was only just doing my job
I don't care what they do with the timber
As long as they pay me my price
They can go make a frame to hang a picture
They can go make a cross to hang Christ
Now as Jesus he hung on that cross there
It was not some thing that he liked
And his last words were father I would not be here
If all of the trees had been spiked!
 

BassBomb

Diamond Member
Nov 25, 2005
8,390
1
81
Is the whole christian world guilty of letting the Americans grow in strength
 

Moonbeam

Elite Member
Nov 24, 1999
74,575
6,712
126
This is the fault of atheists. Their hate for religion has been registered in the religious community and that community is now out to make sure we have no more of that kind on nonsense, permannently. It's a war of ideas that will be determined by numbers.

The Taliban and the Fundies are an autoimmune response.
 

Siddhartha

Lifer
Oct 17, 1999
12,505
3
81
Originally posted by: dahunan
Originally posted by: Dari
That's a silly and bias notion. Just because you're a Muslim does not mean you can control the action of other Muslims. That's like you blaming Christians for the countless pogroms against Jews, including the Holocaust.



lmao.... Hitler was a Christian? ok..

Uhm.. Jews had the ultimate christian killed, no?

Jesus was a Jew.

Muslims are no more a monolithic religious group than Christians.
 

Moonbeam

Elite Member
Nov 24, 1999
74,575
6,712
126
Atheists are fucking amazing. They don't believe in a magical being in the sky but they spew their shit from the energy and chemicals they ate for breakfast. Listen to me, a tiny pile of ash that will return to the soil, as I expound that the universe is dead. Hehe, what's dead is the brains of atheists, a pile of dead chemicals claiming the universe has no intelligence. Hilarious.
 

StageLeft

No Lifer
Sep 29, 2000
70,150
5
0
Originally posted by: Moonbeam
Atheists are fucking amazing. They don't believe in a magical being in the sky but they spew their shit from the energy and chemicals they ate for breakfast. Listen to me, a tiny pile of ash that will return to the soil, as I expound that the universe is dead. Hehe, what's dead is the brains of atheists, a pile of dead chemicals claiming the universe has no intelligence. Hilarious.
This is one of your better statements. I very much like it.

Anyway to answer OP, no, you cannot blame all Muslims.
 

LunarRay

Diamond Member
Mar 2, 2003
9,993
1
76
Originally posted by: Moonbeam
Atheists are fucking amazing. They don't believe in a magical being in the sky but they spew their shit from the energy and chemicals they ate for breakfast. Listen to me, a tiny pile of ash that will return to the soil, as I expound that the universe is dead. Hehe, what's dead is the brains of atheists, a pile of dead chemicals claiming the universe has no intelligence. Hilarious.

If Brooks says so it must be so... Skoorb, sorry.

I have trouble at time understanding exactly what you mean... The first sentence... four words. One is 'Fu...ng' is that a verb? If so, who is amazing? I suppose Amazing could be used as a noun - Amazement, but it usually is a verb so 'fu...ng' don't really modify it... so I'm left with ... who is amazing?
"... They don't believe ...", is that Atheists and Amazing don't believe?
Just kidding Moonerator... ehhehehehehe

Pretty profound statement there! Atheists are on chemicals? So that is how they sustain their incomprehensible belief with absolutely no proof. A magical being ha... everyone knows magic is not real but everyone believes that what occurs without logical explanation is magic... so they do believe in what magic represents. They are no different than I am... I believe in what the magical being in the sky represents and they only exclude 'being' from that which is a bias and perhaps racist and bigoted too.. we've known at least one of the persona of a magical being as being of a certain faith and nationality - loosely construed. So, I agree with the conclusion you proffer... Dead brains can claim nothing! Especially an unintelligent universe. Which I just proved to my satisfaction...
Ergo, the Muslims are not responsible for the Taliban... The Taliban are.
 

JKing106

Platinum Member
Mar 19, 2009
2,193
0
0
Is the entire Christian faith guilty of committing mass genocide on brown, black, and red people for near 2,000 years?
 

IronWing

No Lifer
Jul 20, 2001
72,426
33,010
136
Originally posted by: LunarRay
Originally posted by: Moonbeam
Atheists are fucking amazing. They don't believe in a magical being in the sky but they spew their shit from the energy and chemicals they ate for breakfast. Listen to me, a tiny pile of ash that will return to the soil, as I expound that the universe is dead. Hehe, what's dead is the brains of atheists, a pile of dead chemicals claiming the universe has no intelligence. Hilarious.

If Brooks says so it must be so... Skoorb, sorry.

I have trouble at time understanding exactly what you mean... The first sentence... four words. One is 'Fu...ng' is that a verb? If so, who is amazing? I suppose Amazing could be used as a noun - Amazement, but it usually is a verb so 'fu...ng' don't really modify it... so I'm left with ... who is amazing?
"... They don't believe ...", is that Atheists and Amazing don't believe?
Just kidding Moonerator... ehhehehehehe

...

Are is the verb, a verb of being, and is sufficient to complete a sentence.
 

peonyu

Platinum Member
Mar 12, 2003
2,038
23
81
Originally posted by: JKing106
Is the entire Christian faith guilty of committing mass genocide on brown, black, and red people for near 2,000 years?

So by default a brown black or red person isnt Christian ? Coulda fooled me, here I thought the first Christians were Arab looking folks in the middle east. Though your quote could easily be changed in the same way with Islam...replace brown with white. Eastern Europe and Spain were at the mercy of Islamic fanatics for centuries. Nice try at attempting to kill a thread with a dumb comment though, guess its the same as calling everyone a nazi if theres a disagreement.


Originally posted by: JKing106
Is the entire Muslim faith guilty of committing mass genocide on white, black, and red people for near 1400 years?

:roll:
 

IronWing

No Lifer
Jul 20, 2001
72,426
33,010
136
Originally posted by: peonyu
Originally posted by: JKing106
Is the entire Christian faith guilty of committing mass genocide on brown, black, and red people for near 2,000 years?

So by default a brown black or red person isnt Christian ? Coulda fooled me, here I thought the first Christians were Arab looking folks in the middle east. Though your quote could easily be changed in the same way with Islam...replace brown with white. Eastern Europe and Spain were at the mercy of Islamic fanatics for centuries.


Originally posted by: JKing106
Is the entire Muslim faith guilty of committing mass genocide on white, black, and red people for near 1400 years?

:roll:

Read up on the Ottomans and the Moors. While certainly not up to modern standards of religious tolerance, Christians and Jews fared far better under Islam than Muslims and Jews fared under Christian rule. The Christian reconquest of Spain was a disaster for religious tolerance.
 

peonyu

Platinum Member
Mar 12, 2003
2,038
23
81
Originally posted by: ironwing
Originally posted by: peonyu
Originally posted by: JKing106
Is the entire Christian faith guilty of committing mass genocide on brown, black, and red people for near 2,000 years?

So by default a brown black or red person isnt Christian ? Coulda fooled me, here I thought the first Christians were Arab looking folks in the middle east. Though your quote could easily be changed in the same way with Islam...replace brown with white. Eastern Europe and Spain were at the mercy of Islamic fanatics for centuries.


Originally posted by: JKing106
Is the entire Muslim faith guilty of committing mass genocide on white, black, and red people for near 1400 years?

:roll:

Read up on the Ottomans and the Moors. While certainly not up to modern standards of religious tolerance, Christians and Jews fared far better under Islam than Muslims and Jews fared under Christian rule. The Christian reconquest of Spain was a disaster for religious tolerance.

Thats debatable. First Caliph in Spain was tolerant, the second was not at all. The Almoravids [starting around 1000 ad] were about as tolerant as the Taliban if you read up on them. Forced conversions, forced tax if you were not Muslim, definately not tolerant. And they ruled Spain till it was liberated from the Muslims. So first 200 years under Islam were ok, next 500 like the Taliban...Everyone likes to cherry pick the first Caliph in spain though.

The Christians wernt kind when they retook Spain but its hard to fault them for it. Afterall thier land was occupied for centuries by outsiders who didnt treat them well.
 

LunarRay

Diamond Member
Mar 2, 2003
9,993
1
76
Originally posted by: ironwing

Are is the verb, a verb of being, and is sufficient to complete a sentence.

I was asking what F...ing was. Adjective? Verb? Is Amazing a noun to be modified by the adjective? Or... is F...ing a verb... and if so... Amazing is a nice name, I think.

Perhaps you can help this tired mind..

But in any event, I was messing with my buddy... you know ? :)
 

LunarRay

Diamond Member
Mar 2, 2003
9,993
1
76
Originally posted by: JKing106
Is the entire Christian faith guilty of committing mass genocide on brown, black, and red people for near 2,000 years?

No.. of course not... God is.. he said to do that.. why else would they?