Is Shin Etsu as effective as Arctic Silver 5 for CPU cooling?

Discussion in 'Cases & Cooling' started by muddled, Jul 5, 2005.

  1. muddled

    muddled Member

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    Subject up above! :)
     
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  3. The Pentium Guy

    The Pentium Guy Diamond Member

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    I've been waiting for a post like this (I was a bit too lazy to make my own). I heard Shin Etsu stuff is comparable to AS5 -> AS5's generally overrated IMO, but easier to apply.
     
  4. CheesePoofs

    CheesePoofs Diamond Member

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    I saw a graph somewhere that showed shin etsu being just as good as AS5. Don't know where though.
     
  5. keeleysam

    keeleysam Diamond Member

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    If you already have it, don't pay extra for AS5
     
  6. overst33r

    overst33r Diamond Member

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    if its not cheaper dont bother, AS5 i king!
     
  7. Zepper

    Zepper Elite Member

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    They are within a degree or so on most well run comparison tests. But as mentioned above, it is more difficult to apply. SVC has some on clearance being sold under the CoolerMaster name for about 4 bucks. It's the PTK-001. Shin Etsu has one large advantage over AS5 - it won't settle out in storage...

    .bh.
     
  8. 1313

    1313 Senior member

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    CoolerMaster compound contains ~some~ Shin Etsu....but they are merely buying some Shin Etsu and mixing into their formula. While not a bad product, it does not compare to top performance of Arctic Silver AS5 or Shin Etsu X23-7783D.

    I sell 100% pure Shin etsu X23-7783D compound direct from Shin Etsu Micro Si. They pack it in the syringes and I do not modify it.

    Shin Etsu and AS5 are very close to each other in performance, and are both good products.

    X23-7783D is electrically neutral, long lasting, AMD approved, and $6.33 per 1 gram tube...so price is comparable.

    If you have Artic Silver AS5 or Ceramique don't worry its great stuff. I just think Shin Etsu is slightly better overall, and that is why I make it available to other forum members.



     
  9. imported_Kensai

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    They're both good stuff. I prefer AS5 personally.
    6.33$ for 1g is too much IMO.
     
  10. 1313

    1313 Senior member

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    I think by weight you use more AS5 per application...so cost is probably similar.

    Ceramique is the real bargain if you buy a large tube...but unless I was doing assembly line work I can't see where the expense matters.

     
  11. imported_Kensai

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    I use like... 200mg per application. 0.50$ per gram of AS5.
     
  12. JEDIYoda

    JEDIYoda Lifer

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    CoolerMaster compound contains ~some~ Shin Etsu....but they are merely buying some Shin Etsu and mixing into their formula. While not a bad product, it does not compare to top performance of Arctic Silver AS5 or Shin Etsu X23-7783D.


    Amazing!!
    So how would you know that for certain?

    Sounds like a salesman putting down the competition...heheee
     
  13. 1313

    1313 Senior member

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    The source on the Coolermaster use of Shin Etsu is Shin Etsu Micro Si. They know who they sell to and they have analyzed the compound.

    I'm not trying to be a salesman...just contributing to the thread. If you looked at my income from work and my real business versus my 'profit' on selling Shin Etsu to forum members, you'd realize I do this just to make Shin Etsu available.

    Before I leave for work today I have to ship out 2 tubes of Shin Etsu, and I have done this for a couple of years. I'd be surprised if I made enough in two years to buy a motherboard and processor, an amount I could earn in 2 hours work.



     
  14. 1313

    1313 Senior member

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    Based on that, the cost is not similar...since I can cover 10 to 12 CPU's with 1 gram of Shin Etsu that costs $6.33. or 63 cents per application.

    SVC.com sells AS5 for $5.99 with free shipping so you could get 17.5 applications at 200 mg / application or 34 cents per application


     
  15. eastvillager

    eastvillager Senior member

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    I've used both. If there is a performance difference between the two, it is miniscule.

    Most people introduce a bigger difference just by how they apply the stuff.
     
  16. imported_Kensai

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    Notice that I pay $0.50 per gram of AS5. ;)
     
  17. 1313

    1313 Senior member

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    I did notice that...but I don't think that that price is available to everyone. If so then Arctic Silver AS5 is much less expensive to make than Shin Etsu...since I buy Shin Etsu in large quantities to get the lowest wholesale price and AS5 at 50 cents per gram is almost 90% cheaper.

    So unless Arctic Silver sells to you at a loss, it must be less expensive to manufacture AS5 than X23-7783D.


     
  18. 1313

    1313 Senior member

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    I agree 100%!

    This is what I've found, performance is very close and is variable. Apllication is one of the most important factors.

    I like Shin Etsu because it is electrically neutral, easier to clean up [ but not easier to apply ].

    I think it is longer lasting, resists thermal pumpout, doesn't create a suction that needs to be broken by twisting a warm heatsink [ or there is a risk of pulling the chip out of the socket and bending pins when pulling a heatsink ],.......... and it is AMD approved and I use 90% AMD.

    I've used Shin Etsu for a number of years with zero problems and I think it is a good product, and having more good products available to forum members probably helps to keep prices down and motivate competition to improve thermal compounds.

    But I've used Arctic Silver products, and if I didn't have Shin etsu with me, but had Ceramnique or AS5 ...I assemble the PC and not feel like I had to redo it with Shin Etsu. These are both good products...and they are only thermal compounds, a small part of building good PC's.

    I've also learned that Thermal Compound is like lots of things...like tires or brands of gas.

    There are all sorts of loyalties and opinions for and against. I've found that doesn't work for me.

    I just try to judge each item on its own, and judge fairly. But, just because I think a new product from company A or B is worth a look , it doesn't mean that some people won't have very strong , even inflexible opinions about the same product.

    I've noticed this is especially true on the internet, which can bring out some interesting behaviors among forum members.
     
  19. Richardito

    Richardito Golden Member

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    I personally exposed a number of "Artic Silver + biased" individuals who posted under the 'CPU & overclocking' forum some years ago. They kept praising AS and called a lier anyone who's opinion or experience was not positive to the AS product line. I could swear that they had a commercial benefit in the sales of AS. I followed them on the forum and made their existence a living he11 anytime they tried their commercial crap on other forum members. Very interesting and classic threads... Close inspection to those long threads reveals how full of crap they were and how they constantly contradicted themselves when pinned against the wall with evidence. They went as far as telling people that I had a commercial stake with one of AS's competitors. Those type of trolls should not be allowed in public forums like this one. If you have a coomercial stake any which way you have to: make it clear that you have $ at stake and state just facts, no opinions, etc. about the subject. Either do this or ignore the threads. It is the only ethical thing to do.
     
  20. klah

    klah Diamond Member

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  21. imported_Kensai

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    Old review though. :p
     
  22. JEDIYoda

    JEDIYoda Lifer

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    yeah right! but hey that ok.
    I hardly doubt they would even care what Coolermaster uses in there product!

    Its called $$$$$$$!
     
  23. JEDIYoda

    JEDIYoda Lifer

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    In alll honesty The CoolerMaster PKT_001 is 100% made of Shin Estu Thermal Compound!!
    Its not diluted!!
    There are no filler products!
    It is 100% Shin Estu!!

    All you need to do is do a google or a yahoo search and you will see that Shin Estu is used 100% in the Cooler Master Thermal Compound!!

     
  24. 1313

    1313 Senior member

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    I don't want to argue, but let me offer these facts:

    I have spoken with the engineeers at Shin Etsu Micro Si many times...they state that the Cooler Master products does contain some Shin Etsu thermal compound, but it is not 100% Shin Etsu in formulation. Also there are more evaporative chemicals in the Cooler Master

    CoolerMaster's own instructions show spreading the compound with a card within their template and reworking as needed.

    http://www.coolermaster.com/installatio...l/1984dc3162f23f9d9519074a77b73a38.jpg

    The way CoolerMaster speads and can reworked is different from Shin Etsu, CoolerMaster has a very nice kit with the clear plastic template and it is easy to apply....but since I have the Cooler Master kit I can tell you that it is different from Shin Etsu easier to apply but runs 3 to 4 degrees Celsius warmer.

    If I had to guess, CoolerMaster probably used some Shin Etsu G765 but may have later switched to G751 since it tested 3 to 4 degrees warmer than Ceramique and later tested 1 degree cooler. But it has a creamy texture and spreads easy, which is quite different from Shin Etsu.

    Also, please remember that Shin Etsu varies the particle size, uniformity of particle size, and evaporative chemicals in its various products...so even though Cooler Master no doubt uses a Shin Etsu product..we don't know much about which materials are used inthe CoolerMaster, and Shin Etsu does not disclose that info.

    If Shin Etsu thought that the CoolerMaster formula was best, I'd wager that Shin Etsu would use a similar formula. CoolerMaster is probably a better mass market product and more user friendly.

    I thought that the Cooler Master is an OK product, but it isn't fair to Shin Etsu or forum members to think that Cooler Master is equal to Shin Etsu. Just as it wouldn't be fair if there was a compound that contained some Arctic Silver material and enthusiasts thought that it was the same as AS5 or Ceramique.
     
  25. JEDIYoda

    JEDIYoda Lifer

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    I understand and not to argue with you but....

    but it isn't fair to Shin Etsu or forum members to think that Cooler Master is equal to Shin Etsu. Just as it wouldn't be fair if there was a compound that contained some Arctic Silver material and enthusiasts thought that it was the same as AS5 or Ceramique.


    Actually if you read the label on the CoolerMaster products it out right states that there product is Shin Estu!

    I honestly see no cover up as to whats obvious!!

    With that said--

    Have a nice day!!
     
  26. 1313

    1313 Senior member

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    This thread is:


    "Is Shin Etsu as effective as Arctic Silver 5 for CPU cooling?"


    So I think that it is fair to talk about specific Shin Etsu products and specific Arctic Silver products.

    I don't think I should compare the effectiveness of Shin Etsu X23-7783D to AS3, or Alumina .. or counterfeit AS products. And we shouldn't say that CoolerMaster is exactly equivalent to Shin Etsu when we talk about Shin Etsu vs AS5.

    This is a bit too much discussion on a minor point, but you seem to want to blur the distinction between a Coolermaster product that contains some amount of some product that originated from Shin Etsu......and a 100% pure Shin Etsu engineered compound directl from Shin Etsu.

    I know the exact product when I order [ G751, X23-7762, or X23-7783D ] and that it has been Quality Controlled and certified by Shin Etsu.... and approved by AMD.

    I just called Shin Etsu again, and Shin Etsu's engineers don't know which material is in CoolerMaster and they don't what CoolerMaster does to it in processing. CoolerMaster sources from a Japanese group.

    So we don't know if this is an old , and lower performing , product.

    We don't know what percentage of the compound is Shin Etsu, we don't know what other materials and chemicals are added.

    We know CoolerMaster is not the same consistency as the three top performing, and AMD approved compounds from Shin Etsu: G751, X23-7762, or X23-7783D.

    AMD does not list CoolerMaster as an approved compound.

    AMD buys the same Shin Etsu products that I make available. And we both buy directly from Shin Etsu.

    Maybe this explanation will help:

    I bought an Iced Tea. The label said Green Tea with Honey.

    Well, the drink did have some honey in it, but then I read the fine print list of ingredients. Iit had a lot more of High Fructose Corn Syrup and not very much honey. But technically it did have some honey.

    So if I was thinking about health benefits of Honey or health concerns being debated about High Fructose Corn Syrup...did that Green tea with Honey label really tell me what was in the drink?

    That is the distinction I'm trying to make about CoolerMaster, I'm sure it contains some Shin Etsu material. But there is no fine print that say it contains 100% Shin Etsu G765, or 15% Shin Etsu product ?, and 50% something else and 35% of another chemical or oil. If CoolerMaster will supply a statement that says it is 100% or 80% or 30% of some Shin etsu product , then we will know if what it is.


    I'm selling 100% pure Shin Etsu material direct from Shin Etsu.

    You can tell which particular material it is...and that tells us something about particle size and consistency...which helps us to decide if that compound might work for a given application.