Is selling an Intel Engineering Sample (ES) unethical?

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2timer

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Apr 20, 2012
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What do you guys think? I'm wondering because I came into possession of one recently. I bought a quad core PC on Craigslist, paid a pretty sizeable amount for it. In other words, the chip wasn't given to me. I found it strange because the guy selling the computer said he actually works for Intel. Turns out, the CPU was an Engineering Sample. It works and performs just fine, but it says (ES). Now I'm wondering, would selling it be unethical? I paid a price for it, to an Intel employee no less, and I'm just wondering if I have to eat that expense and consider it non-sellable. What do you guys think?

The OP got his answer and doesn't wish to discuss it any further, so this thread is complete.
-ViRGE
 
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Buckeye269

Buckeye269

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Jul 21, 2011
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As far as I know those chips belong to intel,not their employees. The knowing sale of said chip is against the law.
 
ShintaiDK

ShintaiDK

Lifer
Apr 22, 2012
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Unethical? Yes. Illegal? Yes.

They are all stolen and you are currently in possesion of stolen goods.
 
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2timer

Golden Member
Apr 20, 2012
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ShintaiDK said:
Unethical? Yes. Illegal? Yes.

They are all stolen and you are currently in possesion of stolen goods.
Click to expand...

How do you know for certain it was stolen? Who owned it originally?

I'm not saying I know what it is or what it isn't, I'm just trying to understand the legal ramifications here.
 
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2timer

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Apr 20, 2012
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ShintaiDK said:
Intel owns all ES samples.
http://www.intel.com/support/processors/sb/CS-030747.htm
Click to expand...

I see where it says that Intel owns all ES samples. But what I'm confused on is how you jump to the conclusion that it's stolen property.

"Due to the pre-production nature of Intel ES Processors, they are generally only loaned by Intel to Intel's Original Equipment Manufacturers (OEMs), Original Device Manufacturers (ODMs), and Independent Software Vendors (ISVs)."

The webpage states they are generally only loaned, but does the word "generally" eliminate all possibility of transferring ownership to others?

Because somebody owns a piece of property originally, doesn't mean that if someone besides the "original owner" is in possession of said property that it's stolen.

I'm just really skeptical of the stolen property claim. What is the legality of Intel corporation bringing criminal charges against me?
 
D

dmens

Platinum Member
Mar 18, 2005
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^

Keyword is "loan". We get "loaner chips" as an employment perk. Employees don't own the loaner chips. Selling them on the open market is a firing offense.

I doubt Intel will sue you but I'd like the name of the seller to pass onto HR.
 
NTMBK

NTMBK

Lifer
Nov 14, 2011
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Don't give anyone on here the guy's name. Just email him again, tell him you realised that you were sold a PC with an ES chip, and you want to return the PC and would like a refund.

If he refuses to accept your return and give you a refund, then give his name to Intel.
 
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2timer

Golden Member
Apr 20, 2012
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Hmmm. Yeah, turning over someone's contact information on an Internet forum makes me feel uncomfortable. I believe the best course of action at this point is to contact him directly and see if he will offer me a refund.

Thanks guys.
 
jaqie

jaqie

Platinum Member
Apr 6, 2008
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ES chips are never given out, anyone giving or selling one is selling or giving stolen property. Period.

Communicate with seller showing proof that ES chips are not theirs to sell, demand refund. If refund is not given, get ahold of intel corporate.
 
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SPBHM

Diamond Member
Sep 12, 2012
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if people are actually stealing them from intel, which intended a different use, and making a business of that, I have a problem, but if you have a 5 years old ES chip, given to you to do some evaluation and never asked back, I don't see a problem, I actually think these chips should stay away from Intel, to be preserved, I don't see how Intel would do anything other than destroy them

but I never had any ES hardware... although I think is pretty cool as a collector item, ebay is full of them, so probably people in power doesn't takes this as seriously as some posters here.

in your case, I would return the product to the seller, if he didn't inform you it was an ES chip.
 
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ShadowVVL

Senior member
May 1, 2010
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I agree with spbhm!


I think if intel is going after anyone it would be the person who was responsible for the chip in the first place! Someone like employee or the person who got it from intel and never returned it.
 
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SiliconWars

Platinum Member
Dec 29, 2012
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Wow, some people need to be more concerned about Intel stealing from the public over a period of years instead of this. Talk about priorities being out of whack.

Thread crapping will not be tolerated. And note that under our new rules for CPUs, you now have enough infraction points to qualify for a short vacation. See you on Saturday
-ViRGE
 
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inf64

inf64

Diamond Member
Mar 11, 2011
3,698
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Is selling an Intel Engineering Sample (ES) unethical? Yes absolutely it is. It's property of intel corp. and not to be sold.
 
I

Idontcare

Elite Member
Oct 10, 1999
21,118
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It is unethical. Moreover it is illegal.

It is as illegal as the same Intel employee stealing the office color laser printer and selling it to you.

The printer in this example, and the ES CPU in your situation, both belong to Intel (and its shareholders).

There really are no two bones about it here. Case closed.
 
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ShadowVVL

Senior member
May 1, 2010
758
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Illegal yes but I don’t find it unethical and for too many reasons.

Anyhoot since it is an ES I don’t think intel will reward you for turning over the seller or give you a refund or retail chip for their ES back. I would rather use it and keep it as a collectors item if the seller wont refund you.
 
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SPBHM

Diamond Member
Sep 12, 2012
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can anyone say for sure it's always illegal? looks over simplistic

laws are not the same across the globe, people can be given some rights over what they have for an extended period...

anyway, I need a context to say if I think it's ethical or not.

not so black or white kind of thing as I said before.
 
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