Is LCD really all that it's talked up to be?

Bona Fide

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Jun 21, 2005
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I must be missing something. Apart from the issue of desktop space, I can't seem to find a feasible argument supporting buying an LCD over a CRT.

CRT's Pros:
- Resolution scalability
- NO ghosting
- Better color reproduction
- Better refresh rates

LCD's Pros:
- Slimmer, thinner
- Lower power usage (not all that much)
- Easier to read (vs. a non-flatscreen CRT)

So if you have the room, why would you NOT want to get a CRT? Honestly, LCD's don't seem to have much going for them except in the cramped crowd.
 

Eureka

Diamond Member
Sep 6, 2005
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You mean other than the easier to read part?

I can barely read 1280x960 my 19" CRT, but 1280x1024 on a 19" LCD looks crisp and clean. With a good one that has no (or very little) ghosting, I think that could work out.

Norm
 

xtknight

Elite Member
Oct 15, 2004
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-CRTs don't necessarily have better color reproduction. There was an LCD released by NEC that showed more of the NTSC gamut than CRT's did. It was specifically targeted toward graphics professionals who really needed the BEST.
-CRTs do have a little bit of smearing. Hence "Medium-short persistence phosphors". Ghosting is something else, and I wish people would use other terms.
-Refresh rates aren't perfectly applicable to LCDs.
-LCDs have perfect geometry. Perfect for CAD/CAM work.
-LCDs don't flicker, so you don't have to worry about the refresh rate in that regard.
-I love the perfectly flat look of my LCD.
-LCDs can reach higher resolutions in the same amount of space. (only for notebooks at this point)
-LCDs don't give me a head/neckache whereas CRTs do, even at 85 Hz.
-LCDs have very little ELF/VLF emission. Some people said that caused cancer (I'm not saying I believe that). Just pointing that out.
-LCDs are always perfectly in focus. They never go out of focus and you don't have to risk your life to adjust it correctly (on some older CRTs). Thus LCDs reproduce a more detailed image (assuming equivalent source, resolution, and dot pitch of course).

All in all, if my LCD didn't have any motion blur, I'd be perfectly happy with it. The colors aren't that bad to me. I'm not a graphics professional. I think the colors look better more vibrant. They look more real, whereas the CRTs tend to have a red/warm cast over everything, but that's just my opinion, so don't start a flame war over it. My dad says LCDs have a blue cast over them.

With Windows Vista, the resolution scaling issue should be a thing of the past if they go with vector rendering. However, the benefits of settings your game to low resolution will still be gone, I believe (if you want perfect scaling quality).

Personally, I can't wait for FED/SED/NEDs (whatever you want to call them). No deflection yoke so no harmful ELF radiation. One argument gone. Thinner, another issue gone. Less power usage than LCDs. Perfect geometry, poof. Larger color gamut than CRTs, check. I think they're perfectly in focus. They still flicker (I believe) and have a set resolution though.
 

jiffylube1024

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Feb 17, 2002
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I agree with xtknight entirely. Except for the crème of the crème of CRT's, they look like crap to me these days, after having used sharp DVI-equipped LCD's for the past couple of years. Fixing PC's of people with CRT's even a couple of years old, I now, more than ever, notice how CRT's lose focus over their life; in some cases it's become so drastically blurry that I can't believe they still use it!

Again, except for a well calibrated professional CRT, text just looks better on a good LCD, period.

Just the size issue alone makes me favour LCD's - once you get that extra desk space back you will never want to give it up again!

The lack of flicker altogether on LCD is a big plus. For those few who do still get some flicker on their LCD's: switch to DVI, or don't use a DVI cable that's as thick as a pencil! Splurge on that nice fat cable because you shouldn't have any flicker whatsoever!

I'm a fan of lower power consumption and heat output (and radiation) as well.

Finally: thin bezel LCD's are just plain sexy (I'm talking aesthetically here... not in a sick, fetishistic way ;) ). The first generation of LCD's were functional, but the new ones are gorgeous!
 

boobears

Junior Member
Sep 10, 2005
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After switching to a Hyundai L90D+ I'll never buy another CRT again. The new 19" LCDs (the same screen space as most 21" CRTs) have no ghosting and excellent color reproduction. I find the only CRTs I can look at now are are the top of the line super expensive ones. Everything else looks like crap now and hurts my eyes. In the end a good 19" LCD is cheaper than a 21" CRT that doesnt look like crap. I'm looking to upgrade to a 20" LCD now.
 

CP5670

Diamond Member
Jun 24, 2004
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I prefer CRTs for several reasons. The "easier on the eyes" thing is rather subjective. I find well focused CRTs running at 100hz or more to be easier to look at than LCDs, which tend to be too bright and all have that irritating screen door effect to some degree. Also, I personally find the text size on 1280x960 on a 20" screen to be comfortable but want much higher resolutions for games, which can only be done on a CRT.

I have noticed motion blur ("ghosting") to some degree on pretty much every LCD I have seen, but it actually doesn't bother me that much on 12ms and lower panels. The main issue I have with LCDs is actually the contrast and dark colors. They aren't that bad for daytime usage, but a lot of IQ problems that aren't very noticeable in daylight really stand out when using them in pitch dark, which is how I like to do my gaming. The screen door effect is more apparent than usual, dark gradients like shadows in games look terrible and everything has a slightly washed out appearance to it, especially given how most modern FPS games can be pretty dark. The LCDs with the glass coating look significantly better than normal ones (although not quite at CRT level), but they are expensive and only in 19" versions for some reason.

As for the vibrant colors, the CRTs with the superbright/dynamic mode can attain the same level of brightness as most LCDs (this is probably what people mean by vibrant), but without having the bad contrast. Although to be fair, these really look dramatically better in games than CRTs without this feature.

Also, most high resolution LCDs seem to be limited to 60hz when on DVI. I don't know if this is an issue with LCDs in general or just the ones currently out, but 60fps is a little low for some games. The 85hz and 100hz available on CRTs is better not only because it reduces flickering but also gives higher framerates.

There are certainly reasons to get LCDs, but there are compromises involved and a good CRT will still provide the best gaming experience. Of course, these days you almost have to get an LCD, since the top CRTs have all but disappeared from the market and their quality control had gone through the floor near the end anyway.

I agree with xtknight entirely. Except for the crème of the crème of CRT's, they look like crap to me these days, after having used sharp DVI-equipped LCD's for the past couple of years. Fixing PC's of people with CRT's even a couple of years old, I now, more than ever, notice how CRT's lose focus over their life; in some cases it's become so drastically blurry that I can't believe they still use it!

Again, except for a well calibrated professional CRT, text just looks better on a good LCD, period.

I think you're looking at crappy CRTs; there is a lot of variation in CRTs as far as focus goes and bad CRTs are probably worse than bad LCDs in general. My CRT easily looks as sharp at 1600x1200 as any DVI connected LCD.

-LCDs are always perfectly in focus. They never go out of focus and you don't have to risk your life to adjust it correctly (on some older CRTs).

This is an annoying thing with most CRTs. I wish they would make those focus controls more easily accessible, as they can become pretty important over long periods of time. Mine has two holes on the side that let you adjust them, but most require you to take off the casing.
 

hootpie

Senior member
Jun 27, 2005
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The absolute #1 advantage LCD's have over CRT's for me is this: my eyes don't hurt after 5 minutes of using an LCD. I had a CRT for 4 years before I made the switch to LCD's and I wish I would have done it sooner. Using a CRT for that long degraded my vision quite a bit. I've been using LCD's for almost 5 years now and whenever I have to use a CRT, my eyes hurt.
 

stelleg151

Senior member
Sep 2, 2004
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Yeah really people get the impression that LCDs are just for deskspace, but really they are a new and improved technology in my mind. I went and used a crt today at school, and remembered all the headaches I would get after a couple hours of looking at my old CRT. Colors seem much more vibrant to me, the screen is much brighter and crisper, and "ghosting" or mouselag as I see it I dont even notice anymore.
 

VIAN

Diamond Member
Aug 22, 2003
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There are a few reasons why I don't want to go back to the CRT:

-The image quality is clean and crisp compared to that of the CRT. I just dread thinking about the blurry text at the corner of my CRT.

-My eyes feel a bit more relaxed with absolutely no flickering. It also adds to the cleanliness of the image.

-There is no warming up time. The CRT requires warm-up time, where the settings are a little shifted and it doesn't give out the best picture quality until half-an-hour to an hour later. The LCD on the other hand doesn't at all, which helps you get immersed in a game quicker.

-Now that I've experienced the extra space on my desk the LCD has to offer, it's difficult to go back. I would feel cluttered.

-My room has been less hot. The CRT radiates a lot of heat and always made my room much hotter as a result.

These were the big deciders to keeping the display. All the shortcomings of the LCD seemed to be acceptable when I thought of all these really positive things the LCD has going for it.
 
Mar 11, 2004
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Yep, I'm another LCD convert.

The biggest thing I see people having a problem with on LCDs is that they say they're too bright, which is what I love about them (I usually crank the brightness up even further and use DVC if possible).

I can't find a single thing I don't like better than CRTs. I like the colors better, I like not having to screw with 50,000 settings to get the picture right, I like having a much more adjustable screen (try raising and lowering or rotating your CRT), I like having the extra deskspace (which in turn allows for bigger and/or more monitors on the desk), and I like the aesthetics.

Sure they're not perfect, but the advantages far outweigh CRTs in my opinion.
 

Munky

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Feb 5, 2005
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The only LCD's I tried are the laptop ones and the 17-in HP at my work, and I'd say my CRT at home blows them all away, and it's not even an expensive one. I dont care about the space/weight issue because I have plenty of space and I dont move it much. But unless you run the LCD at native res, it looks like crap. And even at native res, the color accuracy is still not there - show me one LCD that produce real black color instead of the muddy crap they try to pass of as black.

Also, CRT's have a temperature adjustment, so you can chose whether you want bright, sharp colors, or softer, warmer colors. Cant do that on a LCD. I run my CRT at 85hz refresh, and I never have any problems like eye/neck strain or what not. And ghosting... dont even get me started on this.

I'm not even gonna bother upgrading my CRT until some newer technology comes along that has just as good IQ without all the issues of an LCD.
 

WhoBeDaPlaya

Diamond Member
Sep 15, 2000
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I'm not going to get into a flamewar, but I'll say this much : I love my Sun CPD-4410 and Samsung 955DF! But then again, I find the 15.4" WS LCD on my eMachines m6805 perfectly capable as well (except for the sucky contrast ratio).
 

cbehnken

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Aug 23, 2004
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Originally posted by: munky
The only LCD's I tried are the laptop ones and the 17-in HP at my work, and I'd say my CRT at home blows them all away, and it's not even an expensive one. I dont care about the space/weight issue because I have plenty of space and I dont move it much. But unless you run the LCD at native res, it looks like crap. And even at native res, the color accuracy is still not there - show me one LCD that produce real black color instead of the muddy crap they try to pass of as black.

Also, CRT's have a temperature adjustment, so you can chose whether you want bright, sharp colors, or softer, warmer colors. Cant do that on a LCD. I run my CRT at 85hz refresh, and I never have any problems like eye/neck strain or what not. And ghosting... dont even get me started on this.

I'm not even gonna bother upgrading my CRT until some newer technology comes along
that has just as good IQ without all the issues of an LCD.

Since when do LCDs not have color temp adjustment?

 

mdchesne

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Feb 27, 2005
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CRTs for me until I can get a LCD with 1600x1200 NATIVE resolution. until then, I need my 19" CRT
 

nitromullet

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Jan 7, 2004
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Originally posted by: mdchesne
CRTs for me until I can get a LCD with 1600x1200 NATIVE resolution. until then, I need my 19" CRT

Ummm... Dell has had the 2001FP out for a few years now with 1600x1200 native resolution, so has Samsung. I think their's is the 213T. I haven't seen the 2001FP in person, but one of the guys in my office runs the Samsung with his mac laptop, and it looks fantastic.

Anandtech did a review on both of them (scroll down the page a bit):

http://www.anandtech.com/displays/
 

CraigRT

Lifer
Jun 16, 2000
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Out of your CRT Pro's, there are a few things that don't bother me or concern me at all....

Out of the LCD Pro's listed, all are reasons I went to the LCD.

The CRT Pro's that don't apply to me are:

refresh rate. The native res is 60hz, and you can't even tell. it looks like 85+ Hz when you are running 60 on an LCD. No problems whatsoever for me, and believe me, I hate 60hz on a CRT.

resolution scalability. depends on the monitor, but my 2005fpw runs 1680x1050, which is absolutely sweet. don't need more, don't need less. I understand that if you WANTED to change the res, that can be a problem, but when you have a great LCD like this, you just don't need to.

The other CRT Pro's are understandable as well, but do not bother me that much either.

The ghosting issue is only mainly on older panels. I play BF2 nightly on my 2005 and I have zero complaints on the 2005fpw in this matter.

And the color reproduction is only better on high end CRT's from what I've seen. my 2005 has excellent color.


Now keep in mind, my views are made mainly from my 2005. I have a 17" Acer LCD at work that works well for what I use it for, but my 2005 is every reason to move to LCD out there.

No noticeable ghosting.
Great native res.
good color FOR AN LCD.
frequency (refresh rate) a non issue.
all the other LCD Pro's.

I'd recommend a monitor like the Dell 2005fpw to anyone....
 

Pabster

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Apr 15, 2001
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Originally posted by: CraigRT
Now keep in mind, my views are made mainly from my 2005. I have a 17" Acer LCD at work that works well for what I use it for, but my 2005 is every reason to move to LCD out there.
I'd recommend a monitor like the Dell 2005fpw to anyone....

:thumbsup:

I'm using a 2405FPW but I've used many a 2005 and they are very nice.

CRT is so yesteryear.
 

ArchAngel777

Diamond Member
Dec 24, 2000
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Originally posted by: Bona Fide
I must be missing something. Apart from the issue of desktop space, I can't seem to find a feasible argument supporting buying an LCD over a CRT.

CRT's Pros:
- Resolution scalability
- NO ghosting
- Better color reproduction
- Better refresh rates

LCD's Pros:
- Slimmer, thinner
- Lower power usage (not all that much)
- Easier to read (vs. a non-flatscreen CRT)

So if you have the room, why would you NOT want to get a CRT? Honestly, LCD's don't seem to have much going for them except in the cramped crowd.


Even though a CRT @ 100hz reduces eye strain, it is still there. I used to go bug eyed after prolonged use on a CRT and would have an extemely difficult time focusing on objects at the end of the day. When I was driving home, my eyes could not figure out if they should focus on the bird sh!t on my windshield or the car in front of me... As a result, double vision! Just like the song.... :D

At first the LCD was so bright that it hurt my eyes just from brightness factor. I got used to it and now I can look at an LCD all day with very little if any eye strain.

It really does come to down to personal preference for the most part.
 
Feb 19, 2001
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Originally posted by: ArchAngel777
Originally posted by: Bona Fide
I must be missing something. Apart from the issue of desktop space, I can't seem to find a feasible argument supporting buying an LCD over a CRT.

CRT's Pros:
- Resolution scalability
- NO ghosting
- Better color reproduction
- Better refresh rates

LCD's Pros:
- Slimmer, thinner
- Lower power usage (not all that much)
- Easier to read (vs. a non-flatscreen CRT)

So if you have the room, why would you NOT want to get a CRT? Honestly, LCD's don't seem to have much going for them except in the cramped crowd.


Even though a CRT @ 100hz reduces eye strain, it is still there. I used to go bug eyed after prolonged use on a CRT and would have an extemely difficult time focusing on objects at the end of the day. When I was driving home, my eyes could not figure out if they should focus on the bird sh!t on my windshield or the car in front of me... As a result, double vision! Just like the song.... :D

At first the LCD was so bright that it hurt my eyes just from brightness factor. I got used to it and now I can look at an LCD all day with very little if any eye strain.

It really does come to down to personal preference for the most part.

Oh CRTs gave me eyestrain no doubt. I have been using 1024x768 @ 120 Hz for a long time, and then only recently moved to 1280x1024@87. When I got my LCD, my work CRT was at 1280x1024x85. Within a week, I would get major eyestrain issues at work which never happened before. Why? I got used to LCDs at home...

LCDs aren't THAT bright. I think if you deal with panels like the Samsung 930B that may be an issue, but I have been happy with my Viewsonic VP191b. I put it against my Samsung 700NF (17" CRT) and my Samsung 930B and realized its a lot less bright so that it soothes my eyes yet provides brilliant contrast and colors.
 

fueledbymetal

Member
Aug 1, 2005
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Originally posted by: boobears
The new 19" LCDs (the same screen space as most 21" CRTs).

Is this true? My 19" CRT (from a 3 year old Dell) is actually almost too big for me because I like to comfortably take in the entire screen at once while gaming.

I was thinking about getting an LCD to free up some space, but if the LCD screen display area is bigger than that of a like sized CRT, I may need to look at 17" LCD's rather than 19" LCD's...

 

CraigRT

Lifer
Jun 16, 2000
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Originally posted by: fueledbymetal
Originally posted by: boobears
The new 19" LCDs (the same screen space as most 21" CRTs).

Is this true? My 19" CRT (from a 3 year old Dell) is actually almost too big for me because I like to comfortably take in the entire screen at once while gaming.

I was thinking about getting an LCD to free up some space, but if the LCD screen display area is bigger than that of a like sized CRT, I may need to look at 17" LCD's rather than 19" LCD's...
A 17" LCD has almost the same VIEWABLE area as a 19" CRT.
I would go with a 17 for sure, since they both use the same native resolution of 1280x1024. I don't like the fact that 19's use 1280 as well. It's just a stretched picture for another $100. :thumbsdown:

 

ArchAngel777

Diamond Member
Dec 24, 2000
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Originally posted by: CraigRT
Originally posted by: fueledbymetal
Originally posted by: boobears
The new 19" LCDs (the same screen space as most 21" CRTs).

Is this true? My 19" CRT (from a 3 year old Dell) is actually almost too big for me because I like to comfortably take in the entire screen at once while gaming.

I was thinking about getting an LCD to free up some space, but if the LCD screen display area is bigger than that of a like sized CRT, I may need to look at 17" LCD's rather than 19" LCD's...
A 17" LCD has almost the same VIEWABLE area as a 19" CRT.
I would go with a 17 for sure, since they both use the same native resolution of 1280x1024. I don't like the fact that 19's use 1280 as well. It's just a stretched picture for another $100. :thumbsdown:

Basically a 19" CRT has the screen area of a mythical 18" LCD.