Is it worth the risk delidding a below avg overclocker?

freinando

Member
Feb 21, 2012
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Hi. My 4770k does 4.5 on 1.32vcore. For 4.6 it would need more than 1.36v and Im not comfortable with that. Doing only fpu test in aida64 the cpu throttles for overheating. All this using a h110 in pull push setup. However in daily applications max is 69C.

Im wondering if taking the risk of delidding will do any good. I would like to run it 4.6 or 4.7 but voltages wont help even if I delidd and temps are fine I wont run the chip at >1.32 24/7. What do u guys think.
 

thilanliyan

Lifer
Jun 21, 2005
11,864
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Anyone know if Bulldozer CPUs are relatively safe to delid? Was thinking of doing it to mine but if the IHS is soldered on then I wouldn't want to risk ripping the CPU off the package.
 

Sheep221

Golden Member
Oct 28, 2012
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Anyone know if Bulldozer CPUs are relatively safe to delid? Was thinking of doing it to mine but if the IHS is soldered on then I wouldn't want to risk ripping the CPU off the package.
The delidding on soldered CPUs is not required, as the solder is transfering heat much better than thermal paste. Yet it is also not recommend to delid such a CPUs at all, because you can break the chip or rip it off from board.
 

Kenmitch

Diamond Member
Oct 10, 1999
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I wouldnt risk it. If your your chip was a good overclocker it might be worth it tho.
 

freinando

Member
Feb 21, 2012
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I wouldnt risk it. If your your chip was a good overclocker it might be worth it tho.

Right. It would run cooler but I wont get any performance increase besides the chance of brick it.

Anyway, is it fine to run it at 1.32v 24/7? What do you think?
 

Kenmitch

Diamond Member
Oct 10, 1999
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Right. It would run cooler but I wont get any performance increase besides the chance of brick it.

Anyway, is it fine to run it at 1.32v 24/7? What do you think?

I'm new to Haswell as I just got my 4670k rig up and running. Running 4.5ghz @ 1.25v's with a H100i fans locked at 1500rpm I peak at 90c during Intel Burn Test. I lost the thermal lotto I guess. If I could safely run bare die I'd consider delidding it.

I think 1.32v's is about the max youd want to run witb decent temps of course.
 

Idontcare

Elite Member
Oct 10, 1999
21,118
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If you are overclocking then temperature is your enemy. As the temperature increases so too must the voltage if you want to remain stable, of course raising voltage then raises the temperature even more...it is a vicious upwards spiral.

Even if you don't intend to OC higher, anything you can do to lower your operating temperatures will dramatically increase the lifetime reliability of the processor. (significantly reduces the rate of degradation)

Here is a real-world example of how much I have to increase the Vcore on my 3770k to keep the CPU stable as its operating temperature increases (a temperature controlled study):

TemperatureversusMinVccandPowerConsumption3770kat46GHz.png


So even if I didn't want to increase the clockspeed, just being able to operate at lower temperatures because I delidded enabled me to further lower the Vcore - all of which lowered my power consumption and significantly increased the expected operating lifetime of my processor (the ability for it to continue operating at 4.6GHz before enough degradation finally accumulates such that it is no longer stable at 4.6GHz).

Here is another example showing how the temperature effected the lowest voltage I could use at any given temperature while keeping the clockspeed the same.

TemperatureversusPowerConsumption3770kat46GHz.png~original


Delidding isn't done just to get higher overclocks, it is also done to lessen the damage to your CPU from overclocking (TJmax is only a safe operating temperature if you are NOT overclocking) as well as to lower power consumption, heat in your room, and noise from your cooling setup.
 

freinando

Member
Feb 21, 2012
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Nice work there man. So The voltage needed for the chip would be less at less temps according to you and one could achieve higher clocks. What method do you recommend vice or razor?
 

PPB

Golden Member
Jul 5, 2013
1,118
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The best overclock is done when it's really needed.


Ask yourself if you are good enough settling down with a notch less on your OC, in order to achieve better temps, less power comsumption and the relief of knowing you wont be facing degradation in the long term.

I just tend to OC my CPUs when suddenly they wont cut it for a desired target of FPS in a game. OCing for production work where no ammounts of cpu power can ever be overkill is always an uphill battle against the perf/watt metric (imo this only becomes relevant on those kind of tasks, specially if you spend a lot of time on doing them).

0.1-0.15 above your stock vcore OC seems to be the safest bet, above that power compsumption and heat starts to go through the roof
 

crashtech

Lifer
Jan 4, 2013
10,523
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Is it worth the risk? Do you have $350 to lose, so that if you fail, another CPU purchase will not hurt your budget? If so, then by all means, yes.
 

blackened23

Diamond Member
Jul 26, 2011
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However in daily applications max is 69C.

So what's the problem? Do you use prime95 on a daily basis or something? It's a well known fact that Prime95 doesn't get along well with Haswell's IVR - even if you use manual voltage, the iVR will sometimes add +.1V which results in abnormally high temps during prime 95 and IBT. But you will never see those temps in real use. So the real question is, do you want to waste your time delidding just to get .15 more points in cinebench? For me the answer is no. Besides which, if your normal temps don't exceed 70C during real world use (ie NOT PRIME95/IBT), I have no idea why you're even thinking about it. Unless you run prime 95 every day for the heck of it?

Whatever floats your boat though.
 
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PliotronX

Diamond Member
Oct 17, 1999
8,883
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The delidding on soldered CPUs is not required, as the solder is transfering heat much better than thermal paste. Yet it is also not recommend to delid such a CPUs at all, because you can break the chip or rip it off from board.
I lapped my Q6600 which reduced temperatures but I took a blowtorch to the IHS and desoldered it. Marked drops on all cores. I've never regretted going topless :cool:

Edit- Despite popular belief, IHS have never improved temperatures over bare die (at least in any of the chips I've performed surgery on). It is merely for liability in user damage.
 
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Concillian

Diamond Member
May 26, 2004
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I'm new to Haswell as I just got my 4670k rig up and running. Running 4.5ghz @ 1.25v's with a H100i fans locked at 1500rpm I peak at 90c during Intel Burn Test. I lost the thermal lotto I guess. If I could safely run bare die I'd consider delidding it.

I think 1.32v's is about the max youd want to run witb decent temps of course.

I think this is an above average result. 1.225v netted me peaking at 88c at ~4.25GHz on mine (prior to de-lidding). That was with a Noctua, but I don't think an H100 will help it that much.

From what I'm seeing, you have a pretty decent chip. Not a top 10% chip, but probably a little above average.
 
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Kenmitch

Diamond Member
Oct 10, 1999
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I think this is an above average result. 1.225v netted me peaking at 88c at ~4.25GHz on mine (prior to de-lidding). That was with a Noctua, but I don't think an H100 will help it that much.

From what I'm seeing, you have a pretty decent chip. Not a top 10% chip, but probably a little above average.

I'm currently testing this overclock out. So far so good. Temps peaked at 80c during Intel Burn Test.

Temps in image are running latest Aida 64 stress test.



Gonna play around for a couple of days and test stability.