Is it worth me getting a HDTV Tuner? (Over the Air)

[deadken]

Ok, here it goes, I will try to keep it short but still include the vital details....

I don't watch TV. I don't. Not unless it is with the kids (mostly cartoons). Rarely I will watch a DVD movie on the TV, but that is not watching TV...

I get a 'Family Package' from my Cable Provider (Cablevision) here in Long Island, New York. If I remember correctly, to get 'HDTV' from my Cable provider I would have to upgrade to the next package ('silver package') which would be about $75 a month (up from the $50 I pay for 'Family'). Another $25 a month for a few 'digital' channels doesn't seem worth it to me.....

I have seen 'set-top' boxes which decode HDTV signals from 'over-the-air'. I looked on the web HERE to see how many channels I would get, and it seems to be about 10 HDTV channels. They seem to be on about 3 different 'vectors' (is that the right word?). I figure that I could get a US Digital HDTV Tuner/Receiver for about $200 and then another $40 for a indoor HDTV antenna. I would want the indoor one so that I can manually set it for the 3 different angles for the 3 different 'vectors' (I could always get a better antenna later). I figure that it would work out to about $240 + tax for both the tuner and the antenna. Does that sound worth it for 10 'HDTV' channels?

 

[xtknight]

Originally posted by: deadken
Ok, here it goes, I will try to keep it short but still include the vital details....

I don't watch TV. I don't. Not unless it is with the kids (mostly cartoons). Rarely I will watch a DVD movie on the TV, but that is not watching TV...

I get a 'Family Package' from my Cable Provider (Cablevision) here in Long Island, New York. If I remember correctly, to get 'HDTV' from my Cable provider I would have to upgrade to the next package ('silver package') which would be about $75 a month (up from the $50 I pay for 'Family'). Another $25 a month for a few 'digital' channels doesn't seem worth it to me.....

I have seen 'set-top' boxes which decode HDTV signals from 'over-the-air'. I looked on the web HERE to see how many channels I would get, and it seems to be about 10 HDTV channels. They seem to be on about 3 different 'vectors' (is that the right word?). I figure that I could get a US Digital HDTV Tuner/Receiver for about $200 and then another $40 for a indoor HDTV antenna. I would want the indoor one so that I can manually set it for the 3 different angles for the 3 different 'vectors' (I could always get a better antenna later). I figure that it would work out to about $240 + tax for both the tuner and the antenna. Does that sound worth it for 10 'HDTV' channels?

By the way, you don't need a special antenna to receive HDTV. Any antenna will work, it's just the channel number that's different (as far as I know). You could always try it with a regular antenna if you already have one, just to see if it works or not. However, some of the HDTV antennas include amplifiers, which enhance the picture a little bit.

Hmm..personally, I would wait until HDTV makes it into mainstream. By then it will all be cheaper anyway, and be 10x as many channels because it's required to be standard by 2006.

If you really want HDTV, I would recommend the HDTV Wonder by ATI, a slightly cheaper TV tuner. Unfortunately you can only use this with your PC, unless you video-out from your video card to the TV. ATI HDTV Wonder with Remote: $175 at newegg.com. The good thing with this is that you can use it to record stuff. It's like a Personal Video Recorder (PVR) for your PC. This only works with over-the-air signals, just like that HDTV tuner you posted. Cable signals are QAM-encrypted and require a special tuner, probably made available by your cable provider. However, some of these things are so expensive I was even tempted to make my own board to do it. I think all it is is MPEG-2 encoded digital video encapsulated into the standard NTSC 6 MHz signal. That could easily be decoded by software...you may see programs to do this soon...maybe on SourceForge.

 

[xtknight]

Sorry, delete this empty post. Please read my edited post above.

 

[Wag]

Originally posted by: xtknight
Sorry, delete this empty post. Please read my edited post above.

The Dvico Fusion HDTV card can receive some QAM broadcasts as well as OTA. QAM is kind of iffy though.

Still, the card can be had for ~$120 at Copperbox

They have a number of other HDTV cards as well.

Personally I wouldn't bother, just spend the extra money to get the HD tuner from the Cable co. Is it really $25/mo more? Comcast here only charges $5 for the HD box+basic cable ($6/mo).

 

[deadken]

Thanks for the help...

I am pretty sure that I can't get it from my Cable provider without spending another $25+ a month. I will call again in the morning (I need to go to bed). How do you guys feel about the ATI HDTV Wonder card? They sell for $175-$200 and include the antenna. That would require me making one of my PC's a HTPC, but I am fine with that (right now the computers outnumber the people in my house). I would just convert one of my folding rigs or move my 'Family Computer' over and make a F@H rig the 'new' 'Family Computer'!

 

[rbV5]

How do you guys feel about the ATI HDTV Wonder card? They sell for $175-$200 and include the antenna.

Provided you have a good signal, they work pretty good. If you match it up with MCE 2005, I'd rate it excellent if you have no installation issues<I've not, and I've used it in both my HTPC's, 1 using a 6800 graphics card and 1 using my AIW 9700pro. I use it almost always in my AIW9700pro rig, since the ATI card works with my RPTV much better>. I've not tried the latest ATI MMC software with mine, but mine does work better in MCE 2005 than it did with the previous ATI software. Football season and the Olympics this past summer was more than worth it.

 

[deadken]

Originally posted by: rbV5

How do you guys feel about the ATI HDTV Wonder card? They sell for $175-$200 and include the antenna.

Provided you have a good signal, they work pretty good. If you match it up with MCE 2005, I'd rate it excellent if you have no installation issues....

Ummm.... What's MCE 2005?

OK, I googled it. Well, now I am looking at another $135 for a 'new' O/S. Hmmm, It won't be just fine under XP Pro SP1?

 

[rbV5]

OK, I googled it. Well, now I am looking at another $135 for a 'new' O/S. Hmmm, It won't be just fine under XP Pro SP1?

I used it with XPSP1 from early August untill MCE 2005 was lanched this fall (Probably would want XPSP2 now) using ATI's MMC software. I had very few issues, but keep in mind I've had an HDTV card (MyHD MDP100) for a couple years prior up and running with a good signal from my antenna, so when I connected my HDTV Wonder up, it was working with a nice picture out of the box. (mine didn't come with the antenna as it was a pre-release sample for testing) It also takes a moderately powerful CPU and a DX9 hardware class graphics card due to its software encoding. With a less powerful rig, I'd recommend the MyHD hardware card...mature/stable product..but a bit more expensive.

 

[deadken]

OK, I just got off the phone with a cable 'sales person'. The basics are this: for another $10 a month I get a 'Digital' signal and then for another $5 a month I get a HDTV box. I'd get about 30 'digital' channels and 9 HDTV channels for $15 a month. Now I know where I stand.

I am still wondering about what the FCC has set to go into effect. Isn't there a couple of things that mandate HDTV? I say couple because I think some went into effect in 2004, some will in 2005 and 2006. I assume that this is why they are broadcasting HDTV over the air for free already. Does anyone know more about that?

Will a 'set-top box' or HDTV Tuner card do MORE channels in the months to come? Or will they become obsolete?

Thanks for all of the help so far. I have learned alot so far.

 

[Wag]

You'll get more from Cable because you'll get channels like INHD and ESPN-HD which you can't get OTA. Also, make sure you ask for a Firewire equipped box so you can archive stuff to your PC and DVHS.

Lastly, you might want to check and see if Cablevision offers a HD PVR. They should. Actually you should just check AVSForum in the Local HDTV section to see what's going on. I'm sure there are plenty of Cablevision LI threads there.

 

[deadken]

Thanks, I will check that when I get home.

 

[deadken]

Ok, so I worked 12.5hrs and get home just before 5am. I sit down and try the avsforum link and...... nothing..... nada.... zip..... Ugh, can anyone else suggest where I should try and look? I am beat right now. I will try googling avsforum after getting a few hours sleep.

Please, keep the suggestions coming. I REALLY want to know what you guys think will happen in 1-3 years. Will the 'free' over-the-air broadcasts stop? Or will they just be ALL HD?

TIA, Deadken.

 

[rbV5]

I sit down and try the avsforum link and...... nothing..... nada.... zip..... Ugh, can anyone else suggest where I should try and look?

Its working for me. You really need to check that place out, it will be worth the time spent. Particularly check the HDTV forum for the broadcast in your area, and the HTPC forums. You don't want to rush into it anyway. There is a lot to consider to get the system that suits you the best.

 

[deadken]

Thanks. It is working now (why it didn't before, I don't know). It seems that I will be spending a bunch of time over there learning about this stuff. I thank you all for your help.

 

[deadken]

I have been having problems with the ATI HDTV Wonder I bought. I figured that I would post an update:


OK, I don't know what it was that I did, but IT WORKS! Sheesh what a hassle. I can't pin-point it, because it came about during a MARATHON DAY of working on it. I had followed the procedure over HERE @ THG which is what they found they needed to do to get thier review model to work. Well, when that didn't work (I kept getting the same error after the ATI driver install), I swapped the 9800SE out for a 9800Pro, still same issue. I think it was when I installed M$'s "Windows Media Encoder" that it started to work. I know that I had done that previously but when you are on your third attempt details of which time I did that get FUZZY.

Anyway after it started working, I had to get my displays corrected (getting it off my monitor and onto my TV was another P.I.T.A., although not that bad). I now have it running on my Panasonic 36" HDTV and use my 19" Monitor to 'tweak'. I just can't get the text to be 'readable' on the HDTV. My resolution is set at 1774x1000. I installed PowerStrip, because someone said that I should be able to set the resolution at a different level (13xx X 1XXX) and that is better for normal viewing. I can't get PowerStrip to offer any other resolutions. Everytime I open it up, it brings me to the standard Windows Display settings 'Window'. There aren't any other resolutions that fit the screen as nicely as 1774 X 1000. I do know that I would like to increase that 1000 because the viewing area has more room to go vertically. Oh well, I'll have to mess with that on another computer where I can read text better. Then I hope to get the resolutions much better.

Thanks for all of the help. I DON'T REALLY appreciate the HDTV yet. I hope that I will change my mind before the end of the month (I bought this on 01/31/05) or else I will send it back. Yes, the images are clear and very nice looking, But, the choices are still very limited. I will have to count the number of channels I get, but I'd guess it's about 5 or 6 (720's + 1080's). If you include the 480's then it'd be about 5 more. I don't know when there will be more channel broadcast OTA, but I think 13 is supposed to be soon. It really has been a learning experience. I honestly don't think that my Wife and kids will use the features that are available with this HTPC. I will see if it 'grows' on them.

**Edited to fix the THG link**

 

[deadken]

I figured that I would mention that I returned the ATI HDTV Wonder to Newegg.com. I just was sick of the BS. Every time I would start the HD program, I would get a warning about DMA not being enabled on my HD. All I can figure that was because of my NF2 Mobo and it's own IDE drivers. I guess the boys at ATI never tested their hardware with and NVidia based Mobo.

Anyway, even when I checked the little box about not warning me again, it will still show up EVERY time I started the program. It was just too much for me to have to show my Wife what to do when she wanted to watch TV. She said that she didn't see any difference between the HD and regular cable TV (she could see the differences when I flipped back and forth between Cable and HDTV inputs, but not when just watching HDTV).

So, the lack of Wife Acceptance Factor helped doom this project. It's too bad that ATI hasn't cleaned up and smoothed out their software. Also it would have been greatly appreciated if they considered that alot of people would be using this hardware/software on HDTV's! There just isn't ANY reason not to include a setting for HUGE icons and letters! I think that I was using resolutions of 1440X960 and 1776x1000 for my 36" Panasonic, the stuff was just WAY too small to read (yes, I increased the icon size).

Thanks for all of the help you guys gave me.