Is it just me or is NASCAR just a lame excuse for a Motorsports series? ;)

[trmiv2]

lupin: I'm not trying to brag about anything, I'm just stating facts. The things I said were my experiences.

My family is far from rich, we're plenty middle class, we just have always valued racing above almost any other way to use our money. The reason I'm not racing now is because I had to make a choice, racing or college because I couldn't afford both, so I picked college for the time being. The only reason I was even racing in the first place was because of an insurance settlement I got from a guy that hit me with a truck while I was crossing the street.

When my dad was racing sprint cars he was never one of the big funded teams, but he did it because he absolutely loved the sport and had been racing since he was 23. It is expensive to start racing now, but when he started racing, racing wasn't really that expensive to do. So he was already established in racing, and had a decent enough reputation to get sponsors when the cost of racing exploded in the 80's. But, he finally had to quit because it was getting to expensive to race.



<< They might not have driven an F1 racecar, but they do know that driving at ~200mph speed on a twisty circuit is harder than on an oval circuit. >>



Tell me how they &quot;know&quot; driving on a road course is more difficult than an oval? I've driven on both and they both present unique challenges. Again, if people have never experienced something they have no business stating how difficult they feel it is. Driving a car on the street is completely different than competitively driving a racecar.

 

[lupin]

<< My family is far from rich, we're plenty middle class, we just have always valued racing above almost any other way to use our money. >>



That second part of the sentence, after the coma IS why you're fortunate. Think about it, then thank God for it.



<< Tell me how they &quot;know&quot; driving on a road course is more difficult than an oval? I've driven on both and they both present unique challenges. >>



C'mon, it's obvious. It's like, &quot;How do you know cancer hurts when you never got one??&quot;




<< Driving a car on the street is completely different than competitively driving a racecar. >>



Yes.. yes.. it's different. Since you are the experienced one, can you tell me HOW it differs??? Do physics apply differently to race cars??? I don't think so.

 

[DABANSHEE]

Ah, Midnight Rambler, they are not production engines in NASCAR. The simple fact is that the Ford Taurus has a tranverse Front wheel drive OHC engine, so unless the NASCAR Ford Taurus also has the same FWD OHC East-West engine, its not the production engine, &amp; we all know it has a North-South RWD Pushrod Big-block.

 

[trmiv]

lupin: Why do you insist on turning this into some kind of pissing contest?



<< That second part of the sentence, after the coma IS why you're fortunate. Think about it, then thank God for it. >>



Where did I say I wasn't fortunate to be able to race? Read it again, I didn't say anything like that. I simply said my family is far from rich. I am glad about the opportunity I got, I love the fact than I missed out on some stuff as a kid because I was with my dad while he was racing, I wouldn't have it any other way. It was an excellent way to grow up, and I hope I can share it with my children.



<< C'mon, it's obvious. It's like, &quot;How do you know cancer hurts when you never got one??&quot; >>



How is it obvious? Since you seem to know, why don't you explain how driving on a road course is more difficult than driving on an oval. Since it's so obvious to you why, why don't you explain the difference.

Here is a quote from former Indy Car Champ Alex Zanardi when asked about his IROC debut on an oval a few years ago.



<< &quot;I'm sure I'm going to have problems,&quot; Zanardi said. &quot;I have a lot to learn, but the last two years I've been watching races, I know these guys [NASCAR drivers] and I have a lot of respect for them.&quot; >>



I spent most of my time driving on road courses, I drove on ovals three times, I found that there were many unique things about ovals that make them just as difficult as a road course. Drafting can be a huge part of racing on a big oval. Knowing how to use the draft is tough, and means the difference between running up front, and running in the back.

Racing on ovals tends to be closer than racing on road courses. I always found myself constantly busy on short, tough ovals because I was constantly dealing with other cars. Lap after lap there is traffic to deal with, lapped traffic to deal with. Most oval tracks are smaller than road courses to the cars get bunched up. Road courses on the other hand (especially the longer ones) tend to give you a bit more time to rest, the racing is more spread out. On a road course a lot of the time, you can get out to a big lead and just cruise. Ovals are also more finesse than road courses. To be really fast on an oval track you need to get into this flow.



And this is just paved ovals, racing on dirt ovals is a completely different beast. Dirt ovals change constantly, lap to lap, race to race. To be really fast in a sprint car, midget, or any other car that races on a dirt oval, you have to really aware of changing track conditions during the race. You need to know what you need to do when, for instance, the bottom of the track isn't fast anymore, but you have the car setup to run the bottom.



<< Yes.. yes.. it's different. Since you are the experienced one, can you tell me HOW it differs??? Do physics apply differently to race cars??? I don't think so. >>



The physics may be the same, but of course in a racecar, everything is accelerated. Your reactions must be extremely quick, and your decision making must be pretty much instinctual. Also, when you are racing you are dealing with 15-20 (sometimes more) other people who are equally as skilled as you, and they want to win just as badly as you do. When I started racing pro classes I realized just how good some of these other drivers were. The level of competition you get from other good racecar drivers is just unreal. Just like the basketball analogy you used, and NBA game is MUCH quicker, and MUCH more physical than some rec league game. I'm a decent basketball player, but I would get eaten alive by a pro.

Plus driving a racecar involves a huge balance between being fast, and being smooth. One of the things I had to learn when I started racing is that just going really fast and turning isn't going to get you any fast times or wins. There are a lot of people that think all you have to do to win in racing is go fast and turn. My dad always told me that I had to learn to slow down before I could learn how to go fast. One of the most important times when driving a race car is the transition from throttle to braking, then the transition from braking to throttling off the corner. Believe it or not, I learned more about race driving in the lower-horsepower classes than I ever did in classes with tons of horsepower. Because I was forced to learn to be smooth, transition on and off the brakes correctly, and use the racecar and my ability to be fast instead of relying on horsepower to get me out of trouble.

 

[NFS4]

Damn, I leave town for a short while and this place explodes. I'll try to read all of this stuff when I get a chance and post a response.

 

[NFS4]

<< Hahahaha.......


NFS4 you are absolutly right.....All the engine builders and chassis tuners are just a bunch of retards doing things that anyone could do.

NASCAR and NHRA drivers, since they just turn left or worse yet just nail the gas and go straight, well who couldn't do that and win such a frivolous driving title?

A real enthusiast would pick a car from Road and Track's top 10 list, go to the appropriate dealer, throw down the cash and quickly proceed to the nearest open road that meetes the requirements of proper amount of right,left, hand turns, hairpins,etc.......


Then and only then could one prove themselvs worthy of NFS4's respect. >>


Damn, the sarcism dripping from that post could fill up a bucket

I never said that there was no skill in NASCAR or NHRA. It's just that I don't see the point. Especially with the hot rods. WTF is the point? Stomp on the gas, hold on for a few seconds and boom. OK, that's it. Hmmmm, yeah that's some good racing, ha ha.

My problem with stock car racing is that it is a SHAM. Besides the overall profile and name of the car, it share's nothing with the real car. That's false advertising if you ask me. What ever happened to &quot;Race on Sunday, sell on Monday.&quot; Times sure have changed and you definitely can't buy the same thing at the dealership.

And like my sig says, that's just my opinion. If you don't agree with it that's fine with me

 

[trmiv]

NFS4: The only reason they are referred to as stock cars is because it's a carry over from a time when they were almost completely stock. When a name is that established, you don't change it. CART Indy cars don't race at Indy anymore (for the moment at least), but they call them Indy cars.

 

[zsir]

trmiv


You're wasting your time. Look at the title of this thread. These guys think NASCAR and NHRA racing is a joke. As if it were as simple as getting into your car, driving down the street and turning left.

When you line up for either of these events there's 50, 100, maybe 500 other guys wanting to race you. They're saying their car is faster than yours, and believe it or not there are actually people who spend 100's of hours to see that it is. The guy driving next to you is going to use every ounce of skill he has to beat you. See they don't just set the cruise control and turn left as necessary. You stay on the gas too long going into a turn and you eat the wall, you brake too soon and you get passed. You get on it too soon coming out of a turn and you spin out. You drive too hard and your car won't finish the race,etc, etc. You also have to have the balls to go out and do this, to push yourself, your skills and your car harder than the next guy cuz you want the win that much more.

Get it? It's called competition...... Well...to NFS4 and his ignorance, it's just called lame.....

The same goes for NHRA....



<< we all know it has a North-South RWD Pushrod Big-block. >>



Actually they use small blocks....

 

[Nick Stone]

NFS4
<< My problem with stock car racing is that it is a SHAM. >>

<< Besides the overall profile and name of the car, it share's nothing with the real car. >>

So -- I see your logic ! -- If you put the &quot;Ford&quot; name on a racecar then it ought to look like a Ford? Hmm -- They put the Ferreri name on F1 race cars -- I guess I see the resemblance to the showroom product. Some of them are both RED. Penske -- I see that name on some race cars. But the only thing I see in their showrooms with that name on it is a big yellow, Square truck -- ???

Maybe you're trying to tell me that you can buy those formula cars off the showroom floor. Naw, that's not right. I'll try again --
Come to think of it I can't really think of a time when I saw any showroom car that actually looked liked like the race cars I see on TV.
In fact, I distintly remember seeing some Porches and Mercedes Benz race cars -- the ones that obviously cruise at 230 mph at Le Mans.
But these cars look like something from the &quot;Jetsons&quot; with bubbles on top. Haven't seen many of those on my way to work. Darn, I guess I just come from such a backward part of the country that they just don't sell the latest stuff here. But they do sell them looking just that way don't they? I mean making them look identical is essential to selling the cars in the showroom - right? I mean it would be deceptive and &quot;misleading the publics trust&quot; if they didn't -- wouldn't it?

<< That's false advertising if you ask me. What ever happened to &quot;Race on Sunday, sell on Monday.&quot; Times sure have changed and you definitely can't buy the same thing at the dealership. >>

Yep, times have changed. You must be reading from &quot;50 years of NASCAR Racing&quot; to come up with that phrase. I think it's been 10 years since I've seen a TV commercial that ends with a popular Nascar driver
driving his &quot;family&quot; car (a T-bird) off into the sunset.
Very few current drivers own a dealership and I will bet you straight up that you won't hear that phrase at the next Nascar race.
There are a few other phrases I do hear that don't make a lot of sense --
such as the &quot;Brickyard&quot; and &quot;carburetion&quot; day. Since were obviously discussing the things of historical significance -- Did those bricks make the cars run faster? Was that &quot;bleeding edge technology&quot; back then?