Is it a crime to attempt to make voting laws that make it difficult for your opponents to vote?

[Jaskalas]

Originally posted by: spidey07
no picture ID = not part of society or my country.

Citizens need picture ID to vote. this is part of being a citizen and taking part in the election process.

Not taking part of this great country? don't have ID? no vote for you.

/thread

They can't afford to lose their illegal voting base. Cut em some slack.

 

[spidey07]

Originally posted by: Jaskalas
They can't afford to lose their illegal voting base. Cut em some slack.

You know that sad part is you are completely correct.

 

[Moonbeam]

Originally posted by: palehorse74

Originally posted by: Moonbeam

Originally posted by: palehorse74
two words: National ID.

I have yet to see a decent argument against having a standardized National ID being made mandatory for all US citizens, especially given our nation's renewed focus on immigration and national security. I would also have no problem seeing and supporting new programs whose sole purpose is to provide free ID's to those who cannot afford to pay for their own. To me, that sounds like an excellent return on domestic investment.

And showing an ID for voting... why the hell not?

Hahaha right, the same national ID card you'd HAVE to present to be employed?

ummm, ya...? why not?

Employment would require one of the following:
1) National ID (proves US citizenship)
2) Green card (legal immigrant)
3) Valid work visa (legal immigrant)

While voting would be limited to those with a National ID.

How is that unreasonable? and dont give me any more of your microchip / tattoo strawman crapola... If you are truly serious about cutting down on voter fraud and the employment of illegals, then this would be one of the effective ways to do both.

Fine by me, but it will never get a Republican vote. They want to scream about Democrats getting illegal votes and scream only, but there's no way in hell they will hold employers legally responsible for whom they hire.

 

[palehorse]

Originally posted by: Moonbeam

Originally posted by: palehorse74

Originally posted by: Moonbeam

Originally posted by: palehorse74
two words: National ID.

I have yet to see a decent argument against having a standardized National ID being made mandatory for all US citizens, especially given our nation's renewed focus on immigration and national security. I would also have no problem seeing and supporting new programs whose sole purpose is to provide free ID's to those who cannot afford to pay for their own. To me, that sounds like an excellent return on domestic investment.

And showing an ID for voting... why the hell not?

Hahaha right, the same national ID card you'd HAVE to present to be employed?

ummm, ya...? why not?

Employment would require one of the following:
1) National ID (proves US citizenship)
2) Green card (legal immigrant)
3) Valid work visa (legal immigrant)

While voting would be limited to those with a National ID.

How is that unreasonable? and dont give me any more of your microchip / tattoo strawman crapola... If you are truly serious about cutting down on voter fraud and the employment of illegals, then this would be one of the effective ways to do both.

Fine by me, but it will never get a Republican vote. They want to scream about Democrats getting illegal votes and scream only, but there's no way in hell they will hold employers legally responsible for whom they hire.

They will if/when the American people make it known that nothing else is acceptable.

I am VERY suprised that GW has finished 6 years without instituting a National ID system... it boggles my mind, especially given the fact that his entire platform is focused upon national security.

A National ID would solve so many damn problems. I would highly recommend it as an issue that the candidates should focus on during the '08 Presidential elections... the damn card doesnt need a microhip either. A simple photo ID that is very difficult to forge will suffice.

 

[Moonbeam]

Originally posted by: palehorse74

Originally posted by: Moonbeam

Originally posted by: palehorse74

Originally posted by: Moonbeam

Originally posted by: palehorse74
two words: National ID.

I have yet to see a decent argument against having a standardized National ID being made mandatory for all US citizens, especially given our nation's renewed focus on immigration and national security. I would also have no problem seeing and supporting new programs whose sole purpose is to provide free ID's to those who cannot afford to pay for their own. To me, that sounds like an excellent return on domestic investment.

And showing an ID for voting... why the hell not?

Hahaha right, the same national ID card you'd HAVE to present to be employed?

ummm, ya...? why not?

Employment would require one of the following:
1) National ID (proves US citizenship)
2) Green card (legal immigrant)
3) Valid work visa (legal immigrant)

While voting would be limited to those with a National ID.

How is that unreasonable? and dont give me any more of your microchip / tattoo strawman crapola... If you are truly serious about cutting down on voter fraud and the employment of illegals, then this would be one of the effective ways to do both.

Fine by me, but it will never get a Republican vote. They want to scream about Democrats getting illegal votes and scream only, but there's no way in hell they will hold employers legally responsible for whom they hire.

They will if/when the American people make it known that nothing else is acceptable.

I am VERY suprised that GW has finished 6 years without instituting a National ID system... it boggles my mind, especially given the fact that his entire platform is focused upon national security.

A National ID would solve so many damn problems. I would highly recommend it as an issue that the candidates should focus on during the '08 Presidential elections... the damn card doesnt need a microhip either. A simple photo ID that is very difficult to forge will suffice.

Might surprise you but not me. It is the Mark of the Beast and Georgie don't wanna be tagged as him. You can thank the Bible, I think, for no national ID. Remember too that a real National ID that tracks your every move, even if only on computer until you might fall under some sort of suspicion, would be the end of crime. Try to picture the criminal element of the Republican party not having a majority to block that vote.

And think of the abuse to which such a system could be put. We may be better off with the crime we have.

 

[palehorse]

Originally posted by: Moonbeam

Originally posted by: palehorse74

Originally posted by: Moonbeam

Originally posted by: palehorse74

Originally posted by: Moonbeam

Originally posted by: palehorse74
two words: National ID.

I have yet to see a decent argument against having a standardized National ID being made mandatory for all US citizens, especially given our nation's renewed focus on immigration and national security. I would also have no problem seeing and supporting new programs whose sole purpose is to provide free ID's to those who cannot afford to pay for their own. To me, that sounds like an excellent return on domestic investment.

And showing an ID for voting... why the hell not?

Hahaha right, the same national ID card you'd HAVE to present to be employed?

ummm, ya...? why not?

Employment would require one of the following:
1) National ID (proves US citizenship)
2) Green card (legal immigrant)
3) Valid work visa (legal immigrant)

While voting would be limited to those with a National ID.

How is that unreasonable? and dont give me any more of your microchip / tattoo strawman crapola... If you are truly serious about cutting down on voter fraud and the employment of illegals, then this would be one of the effective ways to do both.

Fine by me, but it will never get a Republican vote. They want to scream about Democrats getting illegal votes and scream only, but there's no way in hell they will hold employers legally responsible for whom they hire.

They will if/when the American people make it known that nothing else is acceptable.

I am VERY suprised that GW has finished 6 years without instituting a National ID system... it boggles my mind, especially given the fact that his entire platform is focused upon national security.

A National ID would solve so many damn problems. I would highly recommend it as an issue that the candidates should focus on during the '08 Presidential elections... the damn card doesnt need a microhip either. A simple photo ID that is very difficult to forge will suffice.

Might surprise you but not me. It is the Mark of the Beast and Georgie don't wanna be tagged as him. You can thank the Bible, I think, for no national ID. Remember too that a real National ID that tracks your every move, even if only on computer until you might fall under some sort of suspicion, would be the end of crime. Try to picture the criminal element of the Republican party not having a majority to block that vote.

And think of the abuse to which such a system could be put. We may be better off with the crime we have.

All of that "Big-brother" crap is null and void if you leave RF tech off of the ID. A magnetic strip that only contains your bio data, name, and SSN would be fine too... as long as they dont start making it mandatory to enter buildings, buy certain items, etc.

As long as they limit the ID's use (through legilation) to employment, immigration, voting, etc, then I do not see the problems that you see in terms of potential abuse.

 

[Fern]

Originally posted by: techs
The post is about whether it is or should be a criminal offence to willingly use a voting law to attempt to deny your political opposition votes.

In South FL, Foley resigned so late that his name is on the ballot even though he is not running.

There was an effort by the Repubs to have (informational) signs placed at the precincts informing voters that Foley is no longer running and that a vote for Foley is really is a vote for Negron.

The Democrats are willingly using a voting law to try to prevent this information from being given to voters in hopes less people will vote Repub (as Foley is certainly not a popular person anymore).

Do YOU think this is criminal?

Fern

 

[fskimospy]

Someone earlier got to the root of this discussion really well. It is very much a solution in search of a problem. There are ZERO reliable studies that have shown a meaningful fraud problem in this respect... and people have looked. With so many real problems with voting, why focus on ones that appear to have no impact?

It's pretty likely that the reason Republicans are pushing this so much is because they believe it will depress voter turnout in poorer areas, and thus help them. I don't blame them for this, I'm sure the democrats do similar things. The gerrymandering of districts is a far larger threat to democracy then any ID system is, and again both parties are to blame.

I seriously doubt that this would pass muster for a 14th amendment violation though. It is mostly a violation of the spirit of public service as opposed to the letter of it.