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Is College Worth the Investment if You are a Liberal Arts Major?

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Is College Worth the Investment if You are a Liberal Arts Major?

  • Yes

  • No


Results are only viewable after voting.

IGBT

Lifer
Jul 16, 2001
17,699
47
91
science/math/physics/chemistry. If you are not studying those subjects you are not learning anything employable. All the rest is a jobs/welfare program for pseudo teachers.
 

Capt Caveman

Lifer
Jan 30, 2005
34,548
649
126
science/math/physics/chemistry. If you are not studying those subjects you are not learning anything employable. All the rest is a jobs/welfare program for pseudo teachers.
:biggrin: You're always good for a laugh.
 
May 16, 2000
13,529
0
0
If by 'investment' you mean ONLY financial/economics as it directly pertains to immediate employment, then maybe, maybe not. Depends where you go, how long it takes you, and how you pay for it. If you include ANYTHING other than money in the equation then the answer becomes YES, it's worth it.
 
May 16, 2000
13,529
0
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I think people who believe that the purpose of higher education is a job shouldn't go. That doesn't mean that is should be a main goal, but I witness stupidity and ignorance on a daily basis and right here by people who haven't a clue outside what they read on the internet or that's not job related. They never learned how to think, they regurgitate.
This times eleventy-billion.
 
Oct 30, 2004
11,449
20
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It should be noted that if everyone majored in health care, engineering, computers, business, and other "useful" fields that we would simply end up having an even larger oversupply of college graduates in those fields.

For example, if X-Million college students currently major in the liberal arts fields and decided to major in a "useful" field instead, the end result would be that we would still end up having X-Million unemployed and underemployed-involuntarily-out-of-field college graduates. The number of available jobs at currently-prevailing wage rates would not magically increase by X-Million. Instead you'd just end up with an additonal X-Million unemployed/underemployed graduates who have degrees in "useful fields".

The problem is not merely that too many people are majoring in the liberal arts, but that our nation is investing far too many resources in excess and unneeded college education to begin with. 50% or more of the colleges should probably be closed.
 
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rchiu

Diamond Member
Jun 8, 2002
3,850
0
0
It should be noted that if everyone majored in health care, engineering, computers, business, and other "useful" fields that we would simply end up having an even larger oversupply of college graduates in those fields.

For example, if X-Million college students currently major in the liberal arts fields and decided to major in a "useful" field instead, the end result would be that we would still end up having X-Million unemployed and underemployed-involuntarily-out-of-field college graduates. The number of available jobs at currently-prevailing wage rates would not magically increase by X-Million. Instead you'd just end up with an additonal X-Million unemployed/underemployed graduates who have degrees in "useful fields".

The problem is not merely that too many people are majoring in the liberal arts, but that our nation is investing far too many resources in excess and unneeded college education to begin with. 50% or more of the colleges should probably be closed.
Dude, here we are with Chinese and Indian and their army of engineers taking all US jobs and you are saying the US needs less education?

If anything, US needs more schools, more students. The only problem is, why the hell is US education that expensive. Really each text book gotta cost 100+ USD? You need each and every professor writing their own interpretation of econ 101 so they can charge their students to use their text books? ridiculous. Back when I was in college, in state tuition was like $3k per sem (and that's damn good State engineering school), what's the reason for the tuition to double, triple when US income hasn't double, triple and quality of education hasn't double or triple. In fact, school probably uses more Chinese/Indian TA's for free and get more research funding from big corps.

And no we don't have over supply of talents. We have over supply of expensive talents. Why are talented people so expensive? Because the cost to become talented is so damn expensive.
 

Doppel

Lifer
Feb 5, 2011
13,313
2
0
It should be noted that if everyone majored in health care, engineering, computers, business, and other "useful" fields that we would simply end up having an even larger oversupply of college graduates in those fields.
How is this at all relevant to the decision an individual should make on his career? It's like me saying I won't vote because one vote doesn't matter to which the response is if everybody did that democracy wouldn't work. Well, yeah, but not everybody is doing it. Should we aspire to working at mcdonalds because if we didn't and nobody else did there would be no more big macs? There are always lazy people looking to breeze through college and so there is not a likely chance of us being short on people with these degrees.
The 40% of fortune 500 CEO's have liberal arts degrees.
Meaningless fringe statistics. 100% of the founders of the top two tech companies MS and appl didn't have degrees, is that what you would tell your son thinking about college? Better numbers within:

http://www.payscale.com/best-colleges/degrees.asp

Again, people need to drop this insane notion that an arts degree somehow benefits the student in major ways that a real degree wouldn't. One can learn these intangible skills while also getting a degree that doesn't look like a comedy routine on their resume; they are not mutually exclusive conditions.
 

Doppel

Lifer
Feb 5, 2011
13,313
2
0

shira

Diamond Member
Jan 12, 2005
9,574
5
81
The short-sighted assumption of this thread is that the only consideration involved in deciding whether to go to college is whether it makes economic sense.

Becoming an educated person is its own reward.
 

QuantumPion

Diamond Member
Jun 27, 2005
6,017
1
76
science/math/physics/chemistry. If you are not studying those subjects you are not learning anything employable. All the rest is a jobs/welfare program for pseudo teachers.
Why are you racist against engineers? :colbert:
 

nehalem256

Lifer
Apr 13, 2012
15,670
6
0
The short-sighted assumption of this thread is that the only consideration involved in deciding whether to go to college is whether it makes economic sense.

Becoming an educated person is its own reward.
I doubt you will find many people with $50,000 in student loans working at starbucks who agree with you. :colbert:
 

Exterous

Super Moderator
Jun 20, 2006
19,130
1,994
126
If you are interested in liberal arts subjects, buy some books and indulge those interests that way. It's way less expensive than a degree that won't get you a good job. It's not like you're really gaining anything from professors at liberal arts universities that focus 90% of their effort on their own research and 10% of their effort on teaching, or the snotty teacher assistants that have very little to no understanding of the subject, yet have to pick up all of the slack for the professor.
Yes - but that little piece of paper you get at the end of it all means you have a notable higher change of getting a job (Unless you picked architecture)

How is this at all relevant to the decision an individual should make on his career? It's like me saying I won't vote because one vote doesn't matter to which the response is if everybody did that democracy wouldn't work. Well, yeah, but not everybody is doing it.
Supply and demand does work in degree areas. Look at the MBAs. It used to pretty much guarantee a job with employment rates between 94-98% from 2005-2008. Then a glut of MBA grads entered the market and the rate has dropped to around 75%. Obviously some of this will be due to the recession but according to Georgetown a 'recent grade' with a degree in business is 'only' about average when it comes to employment. A far cry from their near ubiquitous employment just a a few years earlier.

You can see it with entry level IT jobs as well. During the recession everyone went and got their A+ or CCNA and now entry level IT workers are a dime a dozen

It looks like the health - nursing in particular - might experience the same issues. The reports of difficulty getting a nursing job, esp for recent grads, seems to be increasing. Not to mention the glut of new employees tempted by the online offerings and constantly stated low unemployment rate

http://www.workingnurse.com/articles/why-nursing-school-grads-have-trouble-finding-jobs
http://www.stanforddaily.com/2010/01/14/mba-grads-facing-low-employment-rate/
http://www9.georgetown.edu/grad/gppi/hpi/cew/pdfs/Unemployment.Final.update1.pdf
 

Exterous

Super Moderator
Jun 20, 2006
19,130
1,994
126
http://economix.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/05/14/regrets-about-college/


Retards, but this is also their parents' fault, but this is why so many kids are getting anthropology degrees:
That doesn't appear to separate out why they wish they had gotten different degree or what majors that applies to. It could conceivably be job satisfaction

From: The college students you don't know

"A study by the Harvard Graduate School of Education estimated that only a third of new jobs created between 2008 and 2018 will require a bachelor's or higher degree."
Interesting - Georgetown did a similar study in 2010 and came up with a nearly identical number. They also found that we would fall short of the required number of degrees by about 3 million people:

Companies will seek 22 million new postsecondary degree-holders, but just 19 million or so will have earned an associate’s degree or higher by then, according to the report
http://cew.georgetown.edu/jobs2018/
(Decent summary: )
http://blogs.wsj.com/economics/2010/06/15/demand-for-educated-workers-may-outstrip-supply-by-2018/
 

Throckmorton

Lifer
Aug 23, 2007
16,833
1
0
No, it's not worth the investment unless you get a job with your degree, including teaching, being a military officer, etc. Some degrees are employable. I studied liberal arts and I've always been able to get a job with my degree, because it was something useful- geography.
 
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Darwin333

Lifer
Dec 11, 2006
19,947
2,324
126
College has gotten so absurdly expensive due to, imo, unintended consequences from otherwise good intentioned government intervention. Give 18 year olds access to virtually unlimited supplies of money to borrow which can't be discharged in bankruptcy and a fuckload of bad decisions are going to made. The fact that they have access to virtually unlimited funds has allowed universities to raise the costs as high and as fast as they have.

Remove the "can't be discharged via bankruptcy" part and the cost of going to college will drastically decrease because lenders won't be willing to loan you $250K for a degree with an earning potential of $35K a year.
 

Darwin333

Lifer
Dec 11, 2006
19,947
2,324
126
Liberal arts majors tend to gravitate towards jobs like teaching, which still pay better than jobs that require no degrees. The only exception would be waiter/waitress who tend to make as much as many college graduates due to tips.
It doesn't matter if it just pays more than a job with no degree. Does it pay more than a job with no degree AFTER you pay back the loan + interest. Then there is the "time value" thing.
 

nehalem256

Lifer
Apr 13, 2012
15,670
6
0
It doesn't matter if it just pays more than a job with no degree. Does it pay more than a job with no degree AFTER you pay back the loan + interest. Then there is the "time value" thing.
This is only correct if you believe the sole purpose of your degree is to maximize your earnings.

It is reasonable to get a degree in a subject you enjoy assuming that you can make enough to pay off any loans.
 

shira

Diamond Member
Jan 12, 2005
9,574
5
81
I doubt you will find many people with $50,000 in student loans working at starbucks who agree with you. :colbert:
Fortunately for humankind, "not many" does not mean "none." And what might be the opinion of many currently-in-student-debt, under-employed young people right now will probably change over time.

But I'm sure you believe that what makes sense to you right now must be a universal truth forever.
 

1prophet

Diamond Member
Aug 17, 2005
5,237
472
126
The short-sighted assumption of this thread is that the only consideration involved in deciding whether to go to college is whether it makes economic sense.

Becoming an educated person is its own reward.

Tell these colleges to reduce their costs even if it means giving their liberal arts professors pay cuts, if they complain tell them creating an educated person is its own reward.
 

Capt Caveman

Lifer
Jan 30, 2005
34,548
649
126
How is this at all relevant to the decision an individual should make on his career? It's like me saying I won't vote because one vote doesn't matter to which the response is if everybody did that democracy wouldn't work. Well, yeah, but not everybody is doing it. Should we aspire to working at mcdonalds because if we didn't and nobody else did there would be no more big macs? There are always lazy people looking to breeze through college and so there is not a likely chance of us being short on people with these degrees.Meaningless fringe statistics. 100% of the founders of the top two tech companies MS and appl didn't have degrees, is that what you would tell your son thinking about college? Better numbers within:

http://www.payscale.com/best-colleges/degrees.asp

Again, people need to drop this insane notion that an arts degree somehow benefits the student in major ways that a real degree wouldn't. One can learn these intangible skills while also getting a degree that doesn't look like a comedy routine on their resume; they are not mutually exclusive conditions.
More BS by you. Your link proves what? Everyone should be an engineer? Not everyone wants to be an engineer or has the acumen to be one. So, please shut-up with your nonsense. I know several English majors that make more money than you. From sales, editors, creative directors, marketing and again, CEOs, managers, leaders.

I deal with engineers every day, the majority of them don't have the interpersonal skills to ever be decision makers, managers or leaders. I've found that more folks with so called liberal arts degrees to have better interpersonal skills and with the motivation, can do most anything they desire.

I value a good teacher with their liberal arts degree over an engineer any day of the week.
 

DCal430

Diamond Member
Feb 12, 2011
6,021
9
81
science/math/physics/chemistry. If you are not studying those subjects you are not learning anything employable. All the rest is a jobs/welfare program for pseudo teachers.
Those are part of the Liberal Arts.
 

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