Is an upgrade from AMD x2 3800+ to x2 4800+ worth it?

[Sandan]

Here is my situation...I have Asrock 939 Dual sata 2 board with x2 3800+. No matter what I do (and I have been trying everything I know and suggestions from posts) I can't get a stable overclock with the board. I really don't need suggestions about the overclock believe me that horse has been beaten to death. What I wonder is if I will see much performance boost by moving up from the x2 3800+ 2.0Ghz to the x2 4800+ 2.4Ghz CPU. It is on sale for 119 at Newegg which is tempting and I don't want to upgrade a whole system i.e. Board, RAM to get the AM2 cpu.....Thanks in advance for your thoughts.

Other components of system are: 480W Antec NewPower PSU, 2Gigs of GSkill PC3200 performance Ram, Couple of hard drives one is IDE other is SATA2, DVD Reader, DVD R/W, PCIE ATI X850 video card.

 

[MarcVenice]

nah, tough it out with that x2 3800+ untill you get a new PC. That's 119$ saved, which means you can buy a new rig sooner ...

 

[Pederv]

I did it last year. You'll notice an increase in processing performance, but it won't be mind blowing.

EDIT - I know my time is too valuable to be performing a major system overhaul every 6 months. If you feel your time is too valuable then I would suggest doing the 4800, since it is more affordable than an Opteron 185 and it puts your system (except for the video card) as fast as it can go. My next upgrade will be when the instructions per second double what my system can currently do.

 

[secretanchitman]

no way...just overclock to the limit, as you can, then just wait for a full system upgrade.

 

[myocardia]

The reason you aren't able to overclock your system is because of the power supply you're using. It's already maxed, since you have a dual-core cpu, plus an X850XT. It's got 22A max on the 12v rail (which is the same as Antec's newer 350 watt SL350 has), which equates to ~18A continuous output capability.

Do yourself a favor, and buy this psu instead: Corsair 520HX. It will not only allow you to overclock your X2 3800, it has enough power to be able to power your next system, even if it happens to be a Q6600, plus an 8800GTX.

 

[thegimp03]

Keep the 3800+. The performance increase would be barely noticeable and thus is not worth the money.

 

[SynthDude2001]

Originally posted by: MarcVenice
nah, tough it out with that x2 3800+ untill you get a new PC. That's 119$ saved, which means you can buy a new rig sooner ...

I'd echo this advice. If you can't overclock at all (I seem to remember trying to help you before in my giant ASRock 939Dual thread), it still wouldn't be worth it. The 4800+ is only 20% faster than the 3800+ (by clockspeed, maybe 25% when you consider the doubled cache but that's pushing it). IMO a 25% upgrade is not worth anywhere near $100+. I think you would be seriously disappointed. I just spent ~$60 on an X2 3800+ (coming from a single core 3200+), and I wouldn't really want to dump much more than that into a 939 system at this point.

Hell, you could get a nice video card upgrade for not a whole lot more than $119 (I've seen X1900XT's go for $150 in FS/T regularly lately) - that would be a much better use of that money...

Edit: But at that point the PSU might be questionable, as mentioned above. (Even though I'm [just barely] making it with my 330W Antec, 9700 Pro, and overclocked X2)

 

[Sandan]

Myocardia...What you said about the PSU being a problem makes sense. I never considered that...I thought 480W would be good enough. I have a spare Thermaltake Purepower 500W max load rated at +3.3v-22A...+5V-32A...+12V-14A...+12V-15A...-12V-0.3A..and +5VSV...2A Think this one would be better than the Antec...If I understand +12V issues the thermaltake one has less power?

 

[bryanW1995]

Originally posted by: myocardia
The reason you aren't able to overclock your system is because of the power supply you're using. It's already maxed, since you have a dual-core cpu, plus an X850XT. It's got 22A max on the 12v rail (which is the same as Antec's newer 350 watt SL350 has), which equates to ~18A continuous output capability.

Do yourself a favor, and buy this psu instead: Corsair 520HX. It will not only allow you to overclock your X2 3800, it has enough power to be able to power your next system, even if it happens to be a Q6600, plus an 8800GTX.

great psu choice, but it's cheaper here; http://www.clubit.com/search.cfm?keyword=hx+520&cat=all

 

[bryanW1995]

oops, didn't see the TT post. Try that psu first before buying anything else, you can always upgrade to the hx 520 or another quality psu later.

 

[myocardia]

Originally posted by: Sandan
Think this one would be better than the Antec...If I understand +12V issues the thermaltake one has less power?

No, the Thermaltake has more power where you need it, on the 12v rail(s). It should have ~23-24A continous output capability @ 12v, instead of ~18A. It will work just fine for your system, as well as for an X2 4800. I'd personally install that sucker first, then see how high you can overclock your 3800, though. Most people were able to overclock Manchester X2 3800's to around 2.4 Ghz with that board, since it only lets you give the cpu +.05v. Just make sure to lower your RAM speed to 166 Mhz, and also lower your HT multiplier to 4x, and you should be good to go.

 

[taltamir]

Don't waste your money... You should expect insignificant improvements...
Speaking of which, it is NEVER worth it to upgrade in this manner... wait for the next gen and get a CPU + RAM + Mobo + video card... any other "upgrade" is usually a waste of money.

Keep that 120$ towards buying your next machine...

PS... overclocking an ASRock? HAHAHAHAHA! (I am not laughing at you... just at the idea)

 

[SynthDude2001]

Originally posted by: taltamir
PS... overclocking an ASRock? HAHAHAHAHA! (I am not laughing at you... just at the idea)

I must be just imagining my X2 3800+ running at 2.72GHz then...

It's true that they're not the best boards for overclocking, but that was never the big draw in the first place. I'm pretty sure that everyone who bought one of these was most interested in the (real) AGP/PCI-E support on the same board. Overclocking was just a bonus if you felt like doing a quick mod (or could live with whatever you'd get on near-stock volts).

For having paid only $65 two years ago, I'm certainly not complaining.

 

[Sandan]

I too bought the board due to the AGP/PCI-E support. Initially I had an AGP card until I could afford an upgrade. Overall the board has been good....After I change the PSU and if I get an overclock like SynthDude2001 I would consider the board to be outstanding.

 

[dehemke]

Originally posted by: taltamir
Don't waste your money... You should expect insignificant improvements...
Speaking of which, it is NEVER worth it to upgrade in this manner... wait for the next gen and get a CPU + RAM + Mobo + video card... any other "upgrade" is usually a waste of money.

Keep that 120$ towards buying your next machine...

PS... overclocking an ASRock? HAHAHAHAHA! (I am not laughing at you... just at the idea)

Well, hate to break it to you, Chuckles, but my home server (DXtreme's old rig) is an overclocked X2 3800 on an Asrock 939 Dual sata 2 board.

AMD X2 3800+ (939) w/ heatpipe cooler
Asrock 939dual-sata2
Geil DDR (400 CAS2) 512x2
Corsair TwinX LL DDR (400 CAS2) 256 x 2

Using CorsairHX520 PSU in an Antec P180B case.

 

[Sandan]

Originally posted by: myocardia

Originally posted by: Sandan
Think this one would be better than the Antec...If I understand +12V issues the thermaltake one has less power?

No, the Thermaltake has more power where you need it, on the 12v rail(s). It should have ~23-24A continous output capability @ 12v, instead of ~18A. It will work just fine for your system, as well as for an X2 4800. I'd personally install that sucker first, then see how high you can overclock your 3800, though. Most people were able to overclock Manchester X2 3800's to around 2.4 Ghz with that board, since it only lets you give the cpu +.05v. Just make sure to lower your RAM speed to 166 Mhz, and also lower your HT multiplier to 4x, and you should be good to go.

I did some research on my PSU's and it appears there are 2 Thermaltake Purepower 500W models. I have the 500NP which is less powerful than the 500RX...Again, I am not really versed on PSU's so let me list the stats for each one I have and please let me know which is more powerful.

Antec NeoPower 480W
+5v@ 38A...+12V@18A...+12V@18A...+3.3V@30A...-12V@1.0A...+5Vsb@2.0A
Thermaltake 500w model NP
+5V@32A...+12V@14A...+12V@15A...+3.3V@22a...-12V@0.3A...+5Vsb@2.0A

 

[s44]

Originally posted by: Sandan

I did some research on my PSU's and it appears there are 2 Thermaltake Purepower 500W models. I have the 500NP which is less powerful than the 500RX...Again, I am not really versed on PSU's so let me list the stats for each one I have and please let me know which is more powerful.

Antec NeoPower 480W
+5v@ 8A...+12V@18A...+12V@18A...+3.3V@30A...-12V@1.0A...+5Vsb@2.0A
Thermaltake 500w model NP
+5V@32A...+12V@14A...+12V@15A...+3.3V@22a...-12V@0.3A...+5Vsb@2.0A

Sorry, this isn't enough information on either PSU. The question is, what's the max total +12V output?

 

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[Sandan]

Originally posted by: s44

Originally posted by: Sandan

I did some research on my PSU's and it appears there are 2 Thermaltake Purepower 500W models. I have the 500NP which is less powerful than the 500RX...Again, I am not really versed on PSU's so let me list the stats for each one I have and please let me know which is more powerful.

Antec NeoPower 480W
+5v@ 8A...+12V@18A...+12V@18A...+3.3V@30A...-12V@1.0A...+5Vsb@2.0A
Thermaltake 500w model NP
+5V@32A...+12V@14A...+12V@15A...+3.3V@22a...-12V@0.3A...+5Vsb@2.0A

Sorry, this isn't enough information on either PSU. The question is, what's the max total +12V output?

Well....Like I said I don't know a lot about PSU stats. Iin the box that lists all the stats I took the above information from the line identified as Max Voltage. No where on either box does it identify the max total +12V output separate from these stats.

 

[bryanW1995]

you need to take this to the psu forum.

 

[myocardia]

Originally posted by: Sandan
I did some research on my PSU's and it appears there are 2 Thermaltake Purepower 500W models. I have the 500NP which is less powerful than the 500RX...Again, I am not really versed on PSU's so let me list the stats for each one I have and please let me know which is more powerful.

Antec NeoPower 480W
+5v@ 8A...+12V@18A...+12V@18A...+3.3V@30A...-12V@1.0A...+5Vsb@2.0A
Thermaltake 500w model NP
+5V@32A...+12V@14A...+12V@15A...+3.3V@22a...-12V@0.3A...+5Vsb@2.0A

The Thermaltake is definitely better, it has less power on the 3.3v and 5v rails, where you need less power, and more power on the 12v rail(s). It's got a minimum of 5A extra power on the 12v rail (and probably more like 6-7A), and that's where you need more power.

 

[Sandan]

Thanks much myocardia. I appreciate your help.

 

[duragezic]

Not worth it at all IMO. For less than $100, I went from a single core @ 2.5ghz to a dual core @ 2.7ghz. That is a much better use of $100. Yet even then, outside of games that take good advantage of both cores and DVD encoding that takes advantage of both cores, I really don't notice much of a difference with most use. I don't like to upgrade unless I'm really gonna see a performance improvement. Now you could argue both ways with my upgrade to dual core, but really I just wanted to get a dual core Opteron when they were still available as I knew that future games will take good advantage of dual core (UT3 is a good example).

I'd try and overclock the 3800+ still.

Could be the motherboard is finnicky with overclocking or as mentioned, the PSU.

And I'm seeing the TT 500w has less amps on the 12 volt than the Antec. I would've thought either was more than adequate. My Fortron AX450 has 15.5 A on each 12 volt rail, and there is absolutely no problem running a Opteron 165 @ 2.7ghz, 4x512mb DDR, 3 7200rpm hard drives, 1 optical, overclocked 7800GT, etc. You're Antec has higher overall wattage and higher amps on the 12 volt rails than my PSU. Your system configuration is quite similar to mine, except my CPU is much higher clocked. So I'm not really sure your PSU is the problem.

Still, probably is worth it to put the TT in and try overclocking again. Or better yet, if you have an old video card to put in do that, or unplug everything not essential and try overclocking again. Surely a bare minimal system (CPU, RAM, one hard drive) would be a walk in the park for that Antec or TT... hell you could overclock the hell outta it on a decent 350 W probably. Removing all but the essential components will tell you if it is the PSU or the mobo just sucks for overclocking.

 

[Sandan]

As an update to my problem with overclocking...Myocardia you were right that my PSU was the problem. It was an antec 480W NeoPower. I upgraded to a Corsair 550vx several weeks ago and have had no problems overclocking. My x2 3800 is running rock solid at 2.4g with 4 sticks of dual channel RAM. I will probably try a higher overclock..........But in the mean time thanks much for your help.

 

[Rhoxed]

I had a TT 430W in a 3800 X2 system, 7800GT, 2GB ram, 2HD, 2 DVD drives, and a few fans. After adding the 3rd HDD my system became completely unstable. I then upgraded to a Antec TP3 650W, added 2HDD with 3 more case fans, and my stable overclock raised 300Mghz (2.5 to 2.8)