Iran deal reached

[CADsortaGUY]

Your whining about it is pretty worthless. No weapons grade materials, no bombs. It's tough to hide an enrichment facility, even tougher to hide production of HEU after the fact.

Right wing demagoguery requires enemies, however, so the purveyors of it will be a bit bereft.

whining? Try reality. This doesn't allow for surprise inspections and yet you think they will just stop even though we can't check(without notice). talk about naive. sheesh.

 

[Jhhnn]

whining? Try reality. This doesn't allow for surprise inspections and yet you think they will just stop even though we can't check(without notice). talk about naive. sheesh.

Yeh, nuclear weapons production facilities can just be folded up like circus tents, right?

Fear is a contagious disease, like the flu. It overwhelms reason, so you're here to spread it around, right?

 

[Jhhnn]

14 days prior notice for inspection.
Do nuclear watchdogs think that's credible?

I really am just picturing them being lead around on a leash with zero authority and no real access. I am extremely skeptical after North Korea, Iran's buddy. They might as well be using the same playbook to achieve the same goal.

And it's going to work because we are more afraid of stopping nuclear proliferation - than we are of nuclear proliferation.

The American playbook seems to be to greenlight Iran's nuclear weapons program and trying to appease them beforehand. Make them happy, make them less hostile. Lift sanctions, restore their economy. Give them wealth and power... and when the inevitable nuclear weapons are finally revealed - maybe they won't be so nutter crazy against us, or hell bent on using them in a suicide pact for their 12th Imam.

Maybe we'll bribe them out of being martyrs... it's only nuclear war hanging in the balance. No big deal...

Every smear in the book, huh?

Nuclear watchdogs apparently think that 14 days is adequate, given that facilities are continuously monitored with cameras & particle sniffers. You kinda glossed over that in your eagerness to spread the FUD.

 

[michal1980]

Yeh, nuclear weapons production facilities can just be folded up like circus tents, right?

Fear is a contagious disease, like the flu. It overwhelms reason, so you're here to spread it around, right?

So why not allow snap inspections?

Inspections of military facilities need prior approval.


Libs are so gullible.

 

[Blackjack200]

So why not allow snap inspections?

Inspections of military facilities need prior approval.


Libs are so gullible.

Yeah? Who believed the last WMD lies?

 

[trenchfoot]

I picture every single Repub legislator or Repub Pres. hopeful that want to hammer this deal to pander to the base will be claiming a worse scenario than the next guy to get more media face time and an upper hand on the others.

I can see that in their fervor to accomplish that, some will paint themselves into a corner they can't talk themselves out of but will try anyway and simply make jackasses of themselves in the process.

I see all of this happening because it's happened over and over again without fail.

 

[WelshBloke]

Wonder what the vegas odds are on Iran keeping their end of the deal?

Probably better than the odds of the US keeping their end.

 

[Blackjack200]

I picture every single Repub legislator or Repub Pres. hopeful that want to hammer this deal to pander to the base will be claiming a worse scenario than the next guy to get more media face time and an upper hand on the others.

I can see that in their fervor to accomplish that, some will paint themselves into a corner they can't talk themselves out of but will try anyway and simply make jackasses of themselves in the process.

I see all of this happening because it's happened over and over again without fail.

Anybody top Lindsey Graham's "akin to declaring war on Israel" yet?

 

[Brainonska511]

Anybody top Lindsey Graham's "akin to declaring war on Israel" yet?

We should play Chicken Little bingo.

 

[K1052]

Hillary has backed the deal so now in the political calculus a sizable number of senate Democrats would need to openly oppose both her, their own party leadership, and repudiate the foreign policy of their president to prevent the deal from being implemented...going into an election year.

Not going to happen.

 

[Subyman]

Time to start construction on those false walls.

 

[Moonbeam]

I for one am excited to see various conservative politicians and outlets that haven't even read the deal fall over each other in their race to denounce it as the second coming of Neville Chamberlain.

The American CBD is a threat to the entire world. Psychopaths always fear the other. There's monsters in them there hills of Iran projected there by the trauma of childhood. Put two paranoids in a room and they will kill each other to end the fear. And it only takes one paranoid to create another. "

Please go out in the world and kill everybody so I can feel safe. What do I care about the children of others."

 

[Jhhnn]

So why not allow snap inspections?

Inspections of military facilities need prior approval.


Libs are so gullible.

What part of "no weapons grade materials = no weapons" do you fail to comprehend?

If you can counter that, you might have a half-assed point, because the rest of it is fearmongering by suspicion. What sort of "OMFG nuclear program!" can Iran create w/o weapons grade materials? Do you really think that they could dismantle a nuclear weapons production facility in 2 weeks? WTF planet is this, anyway?

Gullible? Such individuals are easily swayed by irrational fear. Here's your sign- wear it proudly.

 

[Pneumothorax]

Iran deal=North Korea deal from 1990's version 2.0

 

[cabri]

If the deal is so good, then why is Obama threatening Congress on it?

 

[Brainonska511]

If the deal is so good, then why is Obama threatening Congress on it?

Because if Obama is for it, Republicans in Congress are against it. There seem to be a contingent in Congress that seem to think that the US has never met a problem that couldn't be solved by bombing some country.

 

[CZroe]

Well its either this deal, or Iran with a bomb.
And if as John McCain thinks, we can just bomb bomb bomb Iran willy nilly, you can say a big goodbye to the existence of Israel.
It's interesting Netanyahu believes no deal will save their ass.
In all reality, just the opposite is true.
But Netanyahu will never realize that until its much too late.
I think [Israel's] Netanyahu actually hoped for no deal simply because he can then drag the US into the conflict between Iran and Israel once that day comes when Iran indeed builds a bomb.
And put our very existence in jeopardy defending Israel from obliteration.

By your logic, Israel wants to be wiped out of existence.

 

[cabri]

If the deal is so good, then why is Obama threatening Congress on it?

Because if Obama is for it, Republicans in Congress are against it. There seem to be a contingent in Congress that seem to think that the US has never met a problem that couldn't be solved by bombing some country.

The Republicans in congress do not have enough votes to override any veto.

So why does Obama need to put forth the challenge/threat - to provide cover for the Democrats and/or threaten them?

 

[Oyeve]

By your logic, Israel wants to be wiped out of existence.

That would solve a lot of problems. Not only with Iran.


Please watch your rhetoric. This is too close to openly advocating the annihilation of an entire country to be acceptable here.

Perknose
Forum Director

 

[Subyman]

The American CBD is a threat to the entire world. Psychopaths always fear the other. There's monsters in them there hills of Iran projected there by the trauma of childhood. Put two paranoids in a room and they will kill each other to end the fear. And it only takes one paranoid to create another. "

Please go out in the world and kill everybody so I can feel safe. What do I care about the children of others."

There is reason for a healthy respect of knowing violence is real within the world. Paranoia can be detrimental, certainly, but ignorantly living in the world without acknowledging its dangers is just as harmful. Nuclear non-proliferation is important and doesn't only include the super powers reducing their stockpile.

 

[Jaskalas]

Its wonderful watching Bill "I have been wrong about everything" Kristol head explode. It's very hard for some to come to terms with the idea that the US "cannot bludgeon Iran into submission" -- that any military action or even increased sanctions is likely to increase Iran's resolve to acquire a nuclear weapon rather than the opposite. Lifting of sanctions and some economic recovery in Iran, chances are that it will strengthen the position of the pro-western part of society. It's very encouraging to see an administration realizing that we need to talk to our adversaries, rather than declare them to be part of some "axis of evil" nonsense.

To that end, it's good that Obama is taking a "proper" course of action. Besides my fear that it won't work, my biggest gripe is the lies surrounding it. We will act surprised when they go nuclear even though we're now the ones facilitating it.

We're basically having our government go behind our backs with all this subterfuge... all the lies about stopping their program, when this is more about burying the hatchet and making peace. This is about turning the page with Iran and welcoming them to the nuclear club with a standard game of hide and seek. We're playing this game to appease our citizens who would demand blood over peace. Who want war to stop nuclear proliferation. Instead of being upfront about peace - our "leaders" are flat out lying about their stated goals and the purpose behind this game.

The "deal" isn't about stopping Iran. Its about stopping us from going to war. It's about shutting up the American people by slowly building up Iran instead of coming out and publicly announcing it all at once. Instead of giving us the truth, we are showered in lies.

 

[Moonbeam]

There is reason for a healthy respect of knowing violence is real within the world. Paranoia can be detrimental, certainly, but ignorantly living in the world without acknowledging its dangers is just as harmful. Nuclear non-proliferation is important and doesn't only include the super powers reducing their stockpile.

Indeed, and that what sane conservative brains should excel at and what liberals ought to respect. Demonstrate for me where todays Republican conservatives are sane.

A liberal conservative balance is trust but verify. If the starting gate is suspect and verify conformational bias will work its wonders.

 

[hal2kilo]

Its wonderful watching Bill "I have been wrong about everything" Kristol head explode. It's very hard for some to come to terms with the idea that the US "cannot bludgeon Iran into submission" -- that any military action or even increased sanctions is likely to increase Iran's resolve to acquire a nuclear weapon rather than the opposite. Lifting of sanctions and some economic recovery in Iran, chances are that it will strengthen the position of the pro-western part of society. It's very encouraging to see an administration realizing that we need to talk to our adversaries, rather than declare them to be part of some "axis of evil" nonsense.

Billy Krystal, the blinded by Israel genius, who's never been right about the Middle East yet.

And they still insist on bringing him out as an expert on the Middle East.

 

[hal2kilo]

Hillary has backed the deal so now in the political calculus a sizable number of senate Democrats would need to openly oppose both her, their own party leadership, and repudiate the foreign policy of their president to prevent the deal from being implemented...going into an election year.

Not going to happen.

Well, we already know Schumer will cave.

 

[Indus]

From PBS:

Here are the key terms of the deal:

1. The agreement places limits on Iran’s uranium enrichment and enrichment-related activities for eight years, followed by allowable enrichment activities for peaceful energy purposes.
2. Iran must store excess centrifuges under continuous International Atomic Energy Agency monitoring.
3. For 15 years, Iran will keep its uranium stockpile to under 300 kg of up to 3.67 percent enriched uranium.
4. Iran will end uranium enrichment at the Fordow facility and turn it into nuclear, physics and technology center.
5. Iran will redesign and rebuild the heavy water research reactor in Arak to support peaceful nuclear research and radioisotope production for medical and industrial purposes.
6. Iran will ship to another country all spent fuel for all future and present power and research nuclear reactors.
7. International Atomic Energy Agency inspectors will have 24/7 access to Iran’s nuclear facilities, including monitoring uranium ore concentrate produced by Iran for 25 years, and containing and monitoring centrifuge rotors for 20 years.
8. Iran will not engage in activities, including research and development, that could lead to the development of a nuclear explosive device.
9. The deal relieves some sanctions if Iran shows it is following the agreement. The United States is not removing its trade embargo on Iran or sanctions related to its support of terrorist networks, senior administration officials said in a conference call with reporters.
10. If Iran violates terms of the accord, sanctions will “snap back".

Its not terrible, I like #9 and #10, but I'm apprehensive of #1 "eight years". Should have gotten fifteen years.