Interesting poll

[nick1985]

"60% Say Capitalism Better Than Socialism"

http://www.rasmussenreports.com/pub..._2010/60_say_capitalism_better_than_socialism

"Adults under 30 are closely divided on the question."

Lets you know how the younger crowd is trending I guess.

 

[Genx87]

Younger people are idealistic. When they start working and paying all the taxes so the slob on the corner and the wall street executive can live a comfortable life they seem to change their tune.

 

[Sinsear]

Younger people are idealistic.

This.

 

[ShawnD1]

Lets you know how the younger crowd is trending I guess.

Unemployment rate: quickly approaching 40% :awe:

A more likely reason is because humans look at trends and draw conclusions based on the trend. Example: suppose you had absolutely no idea what socialism or capitalism were because this was not your native language, but someone showed you a table like I've shown below.

5 most socialist countries:
-Denmark
-Japan
-Sweden
-Czech Republic
-Norway

5 least socialist countries:
-Namibia
-Lesotho
-Sierra Leone
-Central African Republic
-Botswana

Right away you notice a trend emerging. The 5 most socialist countries are reasonably ok while the 5 least socialist countries are piles of shit.
data source: list of countries by income equality (sort them by UN Gini)

 

[Genx87]

I'd say NK and Cuba are more socialist than any of the top five. Socialism being state controlled and owned industry. Also lump in Vietnam.

 

[Atreus21]

Unemployment rate: quickly approaching 40% :awe:

A more likely reason is because humans look at trends and draw conclusions based on the trend. Example: suppose you had absolutely no idea what socialism or capitalism were because this was not your native language, but someone showed you a table like I've shown below.

5 most socialist countries:
-Denmark
-Japan
-Sweden
-Czech Republic
-Norway

5 least socialist countries:
-Namibia
-Lesotho
-Sierra Leone
-Central African Republic
-Botswana

Right away you notice a trend emerging. The 5 most socialist countries are reasonably ok while the 5 least socialist countries are piles of shit.
data source: list of countries by income equality (sort them by UN Gini)

Uh, Hong Kong maybe? The freest economy in the world?

 

[Atreus21]

I'd say NK and Cuba are more socialist than any of the top five. Socialism being state controlled and owned industry. Also lump in Vietnam.

Well, you can only call Vietnam socialist if you call China socialist.

 

[nick1985]

Uh, Hong Kong maybe? The freest economy in the world?

Isnt Hong Kong part of China now?

 

[piasabird]

When you get around 40 you realize that your retirement is based on how well the stock market is doing. You dont think about it as evil or good, but just a way to increase your retirement. The largest threat to capitalism and democracy is over taxation and over regulation that prohibits growth and investment inside the USA. With no growth or investment in the USA, you can kiss all the good jobs goodbye.

 

[Atreus21]

Isnt Hong Kong part of China now?

Yeah it is.

 

[SamurAchzar]

Unemployment rate: quickly approaching 40% :awe:

A more likely reason is because humans look at trends and draw conclusions based on the trend. Example: suppose you had absolutely no idea what socialism or capitalism were because this was not your native language, but someone showed you a table like I've shown below.

5 most socialist countries:
-Denmark
-Japan
-Sweden
-Czech Republic
-Norway

5 least socialist countries:
-Namibia
-Lesotho
-Sierra Leone
-Central African Republic
-Botswana

Right away you notice a trend emerging. The 5 most socialist countries are reasonably ok while the 5 least socialist countries are piles of shit.
data source: list of countries by income equality (sort them by UN Gini)

That's very misleading in the context of this thread, as "less socialistic" doesn't mean "capitalistic". These countries just have chaos and corruption, and not any kind of a structured economy.

Also, before people start idolizing the Nordic countries, the usual indicators living standards don't really mean much. Of course, as an average, a person there might enjoy a higher standard of living than in the USA, but if you're young and aspirational, USA will be a much better place for you.
Also, Nordic countries have the advantage of being relatively homogeneous, so welfare abuse is much less common than other countries. \
Most people share the same values and ethics.

 

[cubeless]

did they have an essay question asking if the polled had any clue what those words really mean?

 

[ShawnD1]

That's very misleading in the context of this thread, as "less socialistic" doesn't mean "capitalistic". These countries just have chaos and corruption, and not any kind of a structured economy.

Fine we'll do it your way. Here is a list of countries in order of how free their economy is.

Definitions
Freedom = LOWER number means more economic freedom
Gini Index = LOWER means more socialism
Development Index = HIGHER means better


Freedom - Country Name - Gini Index (socialism) - Development Index (quality of life)
1 - Hong Kong - 43.4 - 0.944
2 - Singapore - 42.5 - 0.944
3 - Australia - 35.2 - 0.970
4 - New Zealand - 36.2 - 0.950
5 - Ireland - 34.3 - 0.965
6 - Switzerland - 33.7 - 0.960
7 - Canada - 32.6 - 0.966
8 - United States - 40.8 - 0.956
9 - Denmark - 24.7 - 0.955
10 - Chile - 54.9 - 0.878

It's really hard to make a table on this forum.

Most free = Hong Kong
Most socialist = Denmark
Most developed = Australia

Forgot to include sources
freedom
development
socialism

 

[Moonbeam]

Younger people are idealistic. When they start working and paying all the taxes so the slob on the corner and the wall street executive can live a comfortable life they seem to change their tune.

Yup, once life fucks you over enough and all connection with truth and goodness is lost people settle in for a long partnership with self hate. They see that life is really shit. They just give up and give in to hate. Conservatives are the party of death because conservatives are emotionally dead.

 

[nick1985]

Conservatives are the party of death because conservatives are emotionally dead.

What are liberals?

 

[ShawnD1]

Here are some graphs to simplify the above table, using the 10 most economically free countries.

Here is how capitalism and development are related. Not a very good correlation, even when using a quadratic.

Here is how socialism and development are related.

:hmm:

 

[Danube]

In another recent poll 61% of libs were positive about Socialism (despite freeking out when conservatives say they are)

Socialism Viewed Positively by 36% of Americans
http://www.gallup.com/poll/125645/socialism-viewed-positively-americans.aspx

 

[CycloWizard]

Here are some graphs to simplify the above table, using the 10 most economically free countries.

Here is how capitalism and development are related. Not a very good correlation, even when using a quadratic.

Here is how socialism and development are related.

:hmm:

Those charts show absolutely nothing and I would bet that the trends wouldn't be significant. The concavity of the polynomial is downward in both cases as well. Maybe you should try a t-test to see if there is any difference between the development index of the two - I again doubt significance.

 

[xj0hnx]

Yup, once life fucks you over enough and all connection with truth and goodness is lost people settle in for a long partnership with self hate. They see that life is really shit. They just give up and give in to hate. Conservatives are the party of death because conservatives are emotionally dead.

Your projection of self hate is noted.

 

[SamurAchzar]

AFAIK Gini Index isn't a measure of Socialism, it's a measure of social inequality. Socialism affects the Gini score, but it's not a measure of economic policy.

 

[SamurAchzar]

Yup, once life fucks you over enough and all connection with truth and goodness is lost people settle in for a long partnership with self hate. They see that life is really shit. They just give up and give in to hate. Conservatives are the party of death because conservatives are emotionally dead.

Do you sometimes have positive thoughts, too?

 

[Daedalus685]

did they have an essay question asking if the polled had any clue what those words really mean?

Duh, socialism means "evil", capitalism means "I love USA". Invert as required depending on the moron being polled.

Though given the propaganda of the day, I'm really surprised to see any measurable number of people not hating socialism just by the sound it makes coming out of one's mouth.

We need new words for this stuff... and folks that understand that a country can have aspects of both.. But who am I kidding, the world is black and white.

 

[Genx87]

What does socialism have to do with the Gini?

 

[Daedalus685]

What does socialism have to do with the Gini?

Well, nothing... someone was just stating that they believe the two are related.. whether they are or are not.

 

[thegimp03]

Younger people are idealistic. When they start working and paying all the taxes so the slob on the corner and the wall street executive can live a comfortable life they seem to change their tune.

+1. Interesting to see the political beliefs of my friends change as they've moved on from college and are several years along in their careers. Of course, the ones who are still in school and have never worked a day in their life haven't changed much but I've seen change in the ones who've been working their ways up the corporate ladder.