Interesting Autocross story...

slugg

Diamond Member
Feb 17, 2002
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So I went to a Corvette club "test & tune" autocross day yesterday. Two other Miatas and I (for a total of 3) crashed the party. We had one of each generation of Miata: a 1990 NA, my 1999 NB, and a 2006 NC.

There were two ride groups. Somehow, for some unknown reason, they didn't have us work the course, so we hung out and BSed with all the Corvette owners. All really nice people; it was a very welcoming environment.

So the course was on a runway and was set up for Corvettes. Basically, it was a lot of straight-aways, long mild turns, two extremely mild slaloms, and one 180 degree turn-around. If you have a car with a lot of power/acceleration, then there's a giant margin for error and you'll be okay ;)

The average C5 and C6 Z06 was running times of about 45 or 46 seconds. The rest were a bit slower, and a few guys ran a high 43 (one was in a Mustang). I rode with a guy in his Z06 and he ran a 46 something. As an aside, I must say that a Z06 is a HELL OF A RIDE, even if the driving isn't so precise. The sheer power makes it kind of crazy!

So the Miatas were in the second ride group. The guy driving the 1990 is very experience and is a former professional driver. It took him 2 runs to set his best time of the day: 44.6 seconds. He was running with autocross tires (Dunlop Direzza Z1 Star Spec). The 2006 NC was on normal street tires: 45.1 seconds; pretty amazing for having 400 tread-wear tires, haha. As for me... oh boy.

I've never been on that fast of a course. I actually got scared to push it! I was hitting 46-something times, but I knew I could do better. I was just freaking out from the speed. Miatas hardly have to slow down to turn, and I was bouncing off the rev limiter in third gear! I'm not sure exactly how fast that is, but it's something like 75-80 mph. I'm kinda new, so that freaks me out. This isn't highway driving; it's high-RPM adrenaline crazy stuff at 75 mph. I took the second slalom at wide open throttle in 3rd gear and hit the rev limiter at the last cone, barely sliding side to side through the whole thing!

Finally, after sucking it up and not being a wuss, I figured out a line through the course that allowed me to put it in third and just slam my foot to the floor and not lift. I had to downshift into second for the turn-around at the end of the runway, but then it was business as usual. I ran a 44.3 and just about had a heart attack.

The guys in the Z06's that knew what they were doing ran high 43's; like 43.8, 43.9 ish. To be that close to them in my little chick car made me feel pretty good. As for the rest of the Corvette club, they had a hard time acknowledging the Miata drivers ;)

I am in no way making fun of those people, though. They were very good people. I honestly didn't expect them to be so nice. Not *everyone* with a nice car is trying to compensate for something ;)
 

jlee

Lifer
Sep 12, 2001
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Star Specs are pretty nice, aren't they ;) I love 'em. That sounds like a blast...I'd like to find a higher speed autox to let my car stretch its legs. I have very little power before 4k rpm.

A third of the cost for the cars, trailing by a few seconds. Not bad.

Not bad at all, especially considering that if it was a tighter course, you'd probably see the Corvettes start trailing - power would be much less important.
 

Throckmorton

Lifer
Aug 23, 2007
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How did you get so close to the fastest Corvette times and even beat some of them? Were those guys just afraid to pull a lot of Gs?
 

j&j

Senior member
Oct 10, 2011
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it just depends on drivers, the thing he isn't mentioning is that most of those vette's were on their stock runflats. if they were to switch to something like a toyo R888 it would take 10% or more off their times
 

jlee

Lifer
Sep 12, 2001
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it just depends on drivers, the thing he isn't mentioning is that most of those vette's were on their stock runflats. if they were to switch to something like a toyo R888 it would take 10% or more off their times

Of course it depends on drivers...that's kind of the point. However, given the course:
Basically, it was a lot of straight-aways, long mild turns, two extremely mild slaloms, and one 180 degree turn-around.
I have a hard time believing that the stock (summer) tires are going to be 4 - 5 seconds slower than R888's, RA1's, RS3's, Star Specs, etc.

I have seen a (my) Forester on stock all seasons beat WRX's and an STi on Star Specs at an autocross. Driver > all (credit goes to black2na for incredible driving).
 
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Black2na

Senior member
Nov 25, 2010
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i didnt make people mad or anything with that :p stock forester stock suspension and this was before you did all the mods.
 

thedarkwolf

Diamond Member
Oct 13, 1999
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A lot of the coarse designers for our region are vette owners so we get lots of the high HP coarse setups but nothing like that. Haven't done one of the vette club events though, they charge to much. The SCCA events have or are at least suppose to have a lot lower speeds. It is nice showing up at events and beating things like SRT-10 vipers with a miata.
 

j&j

Senior member
Oct 10, 2011
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Of course it depends on drivers...that's kind of the point. However, given the course:

I have a hard time believing that the stock (summer) tires are going to be 4 - 5 seconds slower than R888's, RA1's, RS3's, Star Specs, etc.

I have seen a (my) Forester on stock all seasons beat WRX's and an STi on Star Specs at an autocross. Driver > all (credit goes to black2na for incredible driving).

the runflats on the corvette aren't meant for racing of any kind.

they're nicknamed runcraps for reason. i have an 08 vette, so trust me on this one.

i corvette with a stock 19" goodyear runflat out back is gonna handle like SHIT on any track.

a proper setup with 18's all the way around with a decent tire will absolutely shave 10% or even more around a road course.
 

jlee

Lifer
Sep 12, 2001
48,518
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the runflats on the corvette aren't meant for racing of any kind.

they're nicknamed runcraps for reason. i have an 08 vette, so trust me on this one.

i corvette with a stock 19" goodyear runflat out back is gonna handle like SHIT on any track.

a proper setup with 18's all the way around with a decent tire will absolutely shave 10% or even more around a road course.

I'm not saying that the stock tires are great, but I do have a hard time believing the 10% figure. That's a lot of time on a 44 second autocross course.
 

overst33r

Diamond Member
Oct 3, 2004
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Seems like the Corvette drivers weren't as skilled as the Miata drivers. Having been to a few AutoXs of each, there's no way a Miata will keep up with a Vette on a high speed AutoX.

Glad you had fun!
 

kevman

Diamond Member
Apr 20, 2001
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I have an 08 c6 myself, and you simply cannot argue the fact that the miata is a serious autocrosser. I think corvettes are more suited for the drag strip the autocross.

J&J you are 100% correct about the run craps, I'm getting Michelins or firestones for my next set.
 
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Puddle Jumper

Platinum Member
Nov 4, 2009
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How did you get so close to the fastest Corvette times and even beat some of them? Were those guys just afraid to pull a lot of Gs?

It's not uncommon in autox. I missed the last local event but from what I have heard someone in a lingenfelter corvette was completely outclassed by an AE86.
 

Throckmorton

Lifer
Aug 23, 2007
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It's not uncommon in autox. I missed the last local event but from what I have heard someone in a lingenfelter corvette was completely outclassed by an AE86.

How? It's a sports car, not some musclecar that can't handle. I'd consider the Z06 a supercar.

Under what circumstances can a Miata take a corner faster than a Corvette? Maybe if you're limited by the width of the car...
 

JulesMaximus

No Lifer
Jul 3, 2003
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How? It's a sports car, not some musclecar that can't handle. I'd consider the Z06 a supercar.

Under what circumstances can a Miata take a corner faster than a Corvette? Maybe if you're limited by the width of the car...

Or the ability of the driver?
 

JulesMaximus

No Lifer
Jul 3, 2003
74,583
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Just because you have money doesn't mean you can drive.

This. Youtube is full of videos of guys with more money than brains wrecking very powerful cars.

Traction control off? Check
Stupid engaged? Check
Tree/curb/other car hit? Check
Car(s) written off? Check
Insurance cancelled? Double Check!
 

JCH13

Diamond Member
Sep 14, 2010
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Sounds like a ton of fun!

I bet the Miata drivers could make up for the power deficit by tossing their Miatas into the turns with lots of throttle, late-apexing everything, and carrying as much speed as possible out of every turn.
 

j&j

Senior member
Oct 10, 2011
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the fact is the miata is easier to drive hard, while the vette, if you're skilled would smoke the miata with a set of tires clearly. however, the vette is flat out unforgiving if you don't know what you're doing
 

slugg

Diamond Member
Feb 17, 2002
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Well our Miatas were slightly thinner vehicles. Some cones were merely threading the needle for us, while the Vettes had to actually turn. The only way to keep up was to make really wide lines and just keep speed. There's no way in hell we could make up time with acceleration.

In my opinion, a Corvette is more of a track car than an autocrosser.

Sounds like a ton of fun!

I bet the Miata drivers could make up for the power deficit by tossing their Miatas into the turns with lots of throttle, late-apexing everything, and carrying as much speed as possible out of every turn.

Exactly! Foot to the floor and DON'T LIFT. The rest was just the driving line and getting 1 inch from the cones.


... Now that being said, yea the Vette guys there weren't exactly the best drivers in the world. A couple guys knew what they were doing, namely the ones who beat us. I don't recall them being on run-flats, but I don't recall autocross specific tires, either.
 

JCH13

Diamond Member
Sep 14, 2010
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I would have been really interested to see what a turbo Miata could have done on a faster, open course like that. There is a group local to me that runs on an old AFB... might have to make the trip one of these days.