- Mar 13, 2006
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Intel's response to FTC
- Thread starter Phynaz
- Start date
formulav8
Diamond Member
- Sep 18, 2000
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You can be sure Intel is going to try every little thing they can.
The fact of the matter is they still did major anti-competitive practices to stiffle AMD.
I hope they get fried to the core. I hate it when money is put before principals. I also could care less if my Intel stocks goes down if they get punished for doing that trash.
Just my penny
Jason
The fact of the matter is they still did major anti-competitive practices to stiffle AMD.
I hope they get fried to the core. I hate it when money is put before principals. I also could care less if my Intel stocks goes down if they get punished for doing that trash.
Just my penny
Jason
exar333
Diamond Member
- Feb 7, 2004
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I am sure I will get flamed for this, but Intel is an American company that invests in this country. They manufacture here, they design here, and are still a "global" company with design and manufacture overseas as well. While I don't support all their actions, it's tough to run a successful company (we need) from profitability.
In ten years, AMD will probably fab 80% overseas and continue to be owned by foreign entities. I support Intel.
In ten years, AMD will probably fab 80% overseas and continue to be owned by foreign entities. I support Intel.
- Mar 13, 2006
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Hacp
Lifer
- Jun 8, 2005
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AMD owns 49% global foundries, so they own 49% of the GF fab, and GF is building a fab in NY so they own 49% of that.
exar333
Diamond Member
- Feb 7, 2004
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Sorry, it's only 34% because of those pesky investors that kept AMD propped-up. That was part of the reason Intel brought a suit against them last year, which was withdrawn IIRC as part of the payment they made to AMD toward the end of the year.
AMD owned 49%, then it became 34%, see a trend?
http://www.eweek.com/c/a/IT-Infrastructure/AMDSpinoff-GlobalFoundries-Inks-STMicroelectronics-663107/
Edit: FYI - the Government of the Emirate of Abu Dhabi owns ~20% of AMD and this has more than doubled since 2007. Again, see a trend here? I am not knocking AMD tech (I love my 5870) but I probably will not be buying anything AMD in 5-10 years when it is no longer an American company. I want to help support the tech industry here in the US and those who work in fabs and design new chips.
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her209
No Lifer
- Oct 11, 2000
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Maybe I'm wrong, but all the CPU chips I've seen have the words "Malay" printed on them which I assume stands for Malaysia.
- Mar 13, 2006
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http://www.intel.com/pressroom/kits/manufacturing/manufacturing_qa.htm
How many factories do you have worldwide, where are they located and what percentage of your workforce do they employ?
Intel has 15 wafer fabs in production worldwide at nine locations. Fab production sites within the United States are located in Chandler, Ariz.; Santa Clara, Calif.; Colorado Springs, Colo.; Hudson, Mass.; Rio Rancho, N.M.; and Hillsboro, Ore.; and outside the United States in Leixlip, Ireland; Jerusalem, Israel; and Kiryal Gat, Israel. Two new fabs are under construction at existing sites in Arizona and Israel.
The company has six assembly and test sites worldwide and is building a seventh, all of them outside the U.S. Assembly and test sites outside the United States are located in Shanghai, China; Chengdu, China; San Jose, Costa Rica; Kulim, Malaysia; Penang, Malaysia; and Cavite, Philippines. An assembly and testing site in Ho Chi Minh City, Vietnam, is under construction. There is one testing facility and one assembly development facility inside the U.S.
- Sep 28, 2005
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ROFLROFL
Well, he's partially correct.
But its not because of mainly marketing.
The i7's are just flat out superior then the PH II's in every aspect you look at.
They can downvolt lower, then can overclock higher, they have more workable threads..
But they just cost a lot more.
Nah theres costa rica also, and a few other places too.
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The quote was from 2004, not modern times. You'd have to be extremely uninformed to buy an Intel based machine over an AMD one in 2004.
- Sep 28, 2005
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Oh... back in the C2D circa..
Wait 2004 was AMD's timeline... you'd have to be an idiot to buy an Pent-D vs a X2.
Anyhow i reciently got a ph II 955 for a friend... so im in the gray zone between this intel vs amd war.
Both have there strong points, and both dominate where the other doesn't.
Honestly, with the whole "Supporting America" bit I think some of you a a tad to liberal with your justifications. By buying higher priced tech made here in America you are supporting part of our problem in all reality by helping US employees try to justify thier high salaries even in a time of economical decline for us. I'm sorry but I do not support someone that refuses to take a paycut and uses a Union to try to back them making $50 - $100/hr when people are losing jobs left and right. I believe they should have to take paycuts to help thr greater good by allowing companies to keep jobs and hire more people or find a new job themselves.
I'm all for helping america but honestly when a company has to get government bailouts ( not in this case I know ) because they can't afford to stay in business here its always due in part to overly high US salaries for jobs that pay way more than they do in other countries because we believe our sweat is worth more here.
I've had the privileage of working with Vietnamese people here in the US that were 2ndd and 3rd generation Vietnamese and I'm sorry, they have a better work ethic for thier pay than many of us self brain washed, egotistical "Americans".
As far as this topic, I hope Intel gets hit and hit hard but not out of fanyboyism or my economical views but because they are wrong and when you fuck up you deserver to get raped to the full extent of the law. I made my mistakes and paid for and am still paying for them and will for the rest of my life and I believe all people and companies should just suck it up, stop crying and fighting and just pay your dues.
My $0.02999
I'm all for helping america but honestly when a company has to get government bailouts ( not in this case I know ) because they can't afford to stay in business here its always due in part to overly high US salaries for jobs that pay way more than they do in other countries because we believe our sweat is worth more here.
I've had the privileage of working with Vietnamese people here in the US that were 2ndd and 3rd generation Vietnamese and I'm sorry, they have a better work ethic for thier pay than many of us self brain washed, egotistical "Americans".
As far as this topic, I hope Intel gets hit and hit hard but not out of fanyboyism or my economical views but because they are wrong and when you fuck up you deserver to get raped to the full extent of the law. I made my mistakes and paid for and am still paying for them and will for the rest of my life and I believe all people and companies should just suck it up, stop crying and fighting and just pay your dues.
My $0.02999
konakona
Diamond Member
- May 6, 2004
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Just curious, where do ph II's dominate? I did notice in some (few, but still) of gaming benches PhII were ahead of i7 and c2d/c2q in min frames.
Well I assume the "As long as it's good for me they can do whatever they want" viewpoint is rather widespread not only in the US, but all in all that's rather shortsighted.. just patching up the symptoms won't help in the long run. Also the north-american market will only lose weight in the next years in favor of more or less everyone else, so concentrating on that market isn't the best idea you could have..
Other than that, I think everyone agrees that these practices are extremly harmful for the competition and therefore for the consumers, so if they're guilty they should be prosecuted accordingly, independent if it's an american, chinese, european or whatever company..
frostedflakes
Diamond Member
- Mar 1, 2005
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Maybe you're too young to remember. Back in 2004, AMD actually had the superior architecture. It wasn't just better for some stuff, it beat the Pentium 4 in nearly every metric: Performance, power efficiency, bang for the buck, etc. Of course eventually Intel got their shit together and released the Core architecture, but for a few years there, AMD was killing them. The netburst architecture just didn't scale nearly as well as Intel expected.
lopri
Elite Member
- Jul 27, 2002
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I don't even know where to begin to 'flame' you, but your 'opinion' is clearly nothing but a red-herring so I will try to address.
First of all, this suit isn't AMD v. Intel. They have settled, and from what I read from the settlement AMD won't face whatever 'unfair' tactics Intel employed in the past for the foreseeable futre. Whether it will survive, will be on its own. (and frankly, I don't care)
Second, the suit was brought by the U.S. government. The consensus among many here being that Intel is an organization which exists to maximize profit for its shareholders, wouldn't it be logical to presume that U.S. government will better represent the interest of the people, than a corporation? Do you think Intel will protect the U.S. citizens from thick and through? Or do you believe U.S. government is against itself and its people?
Third, the implication of the end result of this suit will be enormous for the entire tech industry in the long run, but the first corporation that will live or die to the verdict is likely NVIDIA. (read the FTC's complaint as well as Intel's response if you haven't already) In your opinion, is NVIDIA American company?
Fourth, whether you support Intel or not is irrelevant before the law of the land. A criminal won't go free just because you 'support' him/her. I do not know whether Intel will be proven guilty or not, but I point it out because you said you didn't support "some" actions taken by Intel yet you supported Intel. (Frankly I didn't quite understand what that meant, so if I misunderstood feel free to correct me.)
Fifth, is it fair to judge you to be 'un-American', from the fact that you own a Honda and a Nissan? Or is it 'un-American' to not support the government's effort to bail out American auto industry?
I don't like the government's actions on private sectors as much as anyone, but I don't want to live in a jungle, either. What I dislike even more is fascist red-herring that has been so effective throughout our history. Intel is apparently planning a prolonged court battle (judging from the released document), and I hope the debates will center around logic and principles instead of fear, uncertainty, and doubt.
- Sep 28, 2005
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they dominate in gaming builds, and builds where u dont have the luxury to dish out 200+ on a mother board.
Also if your not after high end e penis OC's the PH II are most excellent chips.
In RL application's you'll be hard press to notice a difference between the two platforms.
His comment in 2004 would of made no sense.
The Athlons were wiping the floor off the pentiums that circa.
Yonah was introduced around 2005, with C2D following 2006.
Before those cpu's you'd be called stupid to buy intel.
Well the original pentium's werent so bad...
And ive been ocing a lot longer then you think.
I was watercooling since 1999-2000.
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So, what American-made motherboard are you going to plug the processor into?
I would bet that 80%+ of the components inside a computer are not made in the US.
In reality, we all live in a global economy. If you expect to sell your products around the world, then you have to expect to base your business around the world.
We could all put up fences and live in a world of "my country only", but once you saturate your own country, where do you go from there? It's a global economy, we all need to embrace it.
I would bet that 80%+ of the components inside a computer are not made in the US.
In reality, we all live in a global economy. If you expect to sell your products around the world, then you have to expect to base your business around the world.
We could all put up fences and live in a world of "my country only", but once you saturate your own country, where do you go from there? It's a global economy, we all need to embrace it.
They also sat on their heels during A64/made mistakes with their CPUs after Core 2 came out. Also, I'll blame Hector Ruiz the anti-Midas too.
Actually no. Running fabs is an extremely expensive proposition. The GF deal would have happened regrdless of the financials of the company. By spinning off the fabs you get to let someone else worry about building out the next technology node instead of investing all of your capital into that process.
The idea that you "have control over your destiny" by owning fabs is greatly offset by the financial responsibility that comes along with it.
With this latest economic meltdown, I am glad that someone else was investing in 22nm for the past few quarters. GF has a vision for where they want to be and the capital to make it happen. Ultimately, not having a fab gives AMD more flexibility. Fabs only work to your benefit when you have full capacity all the time. When the fab is not running at 100% capacity, the cost of capital can work against you. It's a vicious cycle, and I am personally glad that we don't need to feed the beast.
After all, foundry relationships are nothing new in this business. Intel makes chips through foundries as well.
And as processor prices continue to fall and the process changes speed up, the wisdom of sinking all of your capital into fabs starts to become a liability and less of an asset.
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