News Intel GPUs - Will they actually launch in the West?

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moinmoin

Diamond Member
Jun 1, 2017
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Apple managed to make a fairly confident GPU for their M1 chips.
That's not Apple's first GPU though. While Apple did use Imagination's PowerVR tech initially, the design deviated more and more over time to the point that Apple thought it could just stop paying Imagination license fees for it (2017 was when Imagination was warned the payment of fees would stop within two years, so the graphics tech in new silicon was likely independent already at that point). Metal (starting in 2014) on the software side ensured Apple has the same control over graphics as it already had in all other hardware areas. In the end M1 is little more than scaling up the hardware already proven in mobile hardware across the previous years. The actual big deal about Apple Silicon was the smooth transition of macOS and its software to ARM making good use of the new hardware.
 

IntelUser2000

Elite Member
Oct 14, 2003
8,276
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I don't even get why they've struggled so badly. A GPU is by no means trivial to design, but Apple managed to make a fairly confident GPU for their M1 chips. It doesn't run DX12 so it's difficult to compare it directly against AMD and NVidia, but it does show that it's possible for another company to design a product that can compete well enough.
Pretty sure this is like watching a skilled artisan at his work and say "Hey that looks easy, anyone can do this!"

Apple is competent enough in SoC design that it beats all it's competitors to a pulp in both CPU and GPU. Also while it may not have top performance it's an INTEGRATED GPU scaled enough to perform that well and at super low power.

that's not remotely an accurate reflection.
Funny how AMD and NV GPU's became far more like TBDR's as pixel complexity increased.

Sometimes its about the right technology at the right time , TBDR local storage cost was to high back in the day. Now large data movement is way to expensive.
PowerVR's failure in the desktop market showed that it's not easy at all to penetrate a new market.

As I remember it was fairly competitive back in the day and if they were to continue they might have become that third player. The difficult part of TBDR was having it work with how games worked. Anandtech article talked about this. AMD/Intel/Nvidia uses what should be called TBIR.

This means that a newcomer had to be able to influence developers to start making it work with their hardware. I swear, the consumer GPU market is one of the hardest to enter.

@igor_kavinski I think I read somewhere that Raja got promoted because he created the Intel dGPU lineup. Previous to him sources have said all they wanted was to scale media accelerators like Arctic Sound-M: https://www.anandtech.com/show/17266/intels-arctic-soundm-server-accelerator-to-land-mid2022-with-hardware-av1-encoding

He convinced that they should scale their lineup and enter the dGPU market.
 
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igor_kavinski

Diamond Member
Jul 27, 2020
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@igor_kavinski I think I read somewhere that Raja got promoted because he created the Intel dGPU lineup. He convinced that they should scale their lineup and enter the dGPU market.
His actual contributions are shrouded in mystery. Do you have some source on what he has actually done for Intel? He honestly seems more like a PR person than a technical person. He keeps uttering buzzwords without going into anything too technical. Right now, he's all about the metaverse and he's gonna keep harping on it until the hype dies and then he will start on the next big thing.
 

igor_kavinski

Diamond Member
Jul 27, 2020
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The countless hours of playing 3Dmark, ah the memories...
I feel sad that the 3Dmark easter egg game was just a vehicle that could be driven around without anything else to do. Don't know why they don't add some gameplay to their demos so they escape the definition of being simply a synthetic 3D workload.
 
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aigomorla

Cases and Cooling Mod PC Gaming Mod Elite Member
Super Moderator
Sep 28, 2005
19,622
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You know if intel could hire Chris Roberts from Cloud Gaming, they could milk the vaporware GPU card for another 5 yrs i bet.
They could sell virtual videocards even, on limited basis. You wouldn't have the real thing, but you could be proud you owned a virtual one for the price of a real videocard.

Raja / Bali / Whatever he wants to go by, should hire him to promote the videocard.

Imagine the crowd funding they could get, and not release a product on any real time frame.
 
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igor_kavinski

Diamond Member
Jul 27, 2020
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I did say before that Intel should put empty but very attractive boxes on store shelves with the promise "Coming Soon!". Inside each box you find a coupon for the card model you bought which you enter on Intel's site and they give you a choice of retailers who will ship the card to your address whenever it is released. Then you forget all about it and one day a surprise delivery shows up at your doorstep. It's another empty box with the awesome news that you have automatically been upgraded to the next generation GPU at no extra charge!
 

biostud

Lifer
Feb 27, 2003
16,378
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You know if intel could hire Chris Roberts from Cloud Gaming, they could milk the vaporware GPU card for another 5 yrs i bet.
They could sell virtual videocards even, on limited basis. You wouldn't have the real thing, but you could be proud you owned a virtual one for the price of a real videocard.

Raja / Bali / Whatever he wants to go by, should hire him to promote the videocard.

Imagine the crowd funding they could get, and not release a product on any real time frame.
Video cards as NFTs bought for Ethereum.
 

DrMrLordX

Lifer
Apr 27, 2000
19,679
8,528
136
You know if intel could hire Chris Roberts from Cloud Gaming, they could milk the vaporware GPU card for another 5 yrs i bet.
They could sell virtual videocards even, on limited basis. You wouldn't have the real thing, but you could be proud you owned a virtual one for the price of a real videocard.

Raja / Bali / Whatever he wants to go by, should hire him to promote the videocard.

Imagine the crowd funding they could get, and not release a product on any real time frame.
The best Star Citizen experience is on Arc GPUs!!!!
 

NTMBK

Diamond Member
Nov 14, 2011
9,855
4,002
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Here's an idea, maybe Intel is "optimizing" their Arc Alchemist card's drivers for "professional" applications, and that's easier than getting a multitude of poorly-written games working.
Hah, good luck with that. "Professional" apps have a much higher standard for working. If you get a few vertices in the wrong place in a game, then you can get away with it. If you screw that up in a professional CAD program then you can cost billions.

There's a reason why people pay a lot of money for validated Quadro GPUs.
 

mikk

Diamond Member
May 15, 2012
3,585
1,410
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In this test there is a power test using the Intel Fan Tuning Tool. It's 65W package power and 65C in Furmark, so I guess this is more accurate than the GPUz numbers.



Found one more power test:


I recommend to enable english subtitles. Arc Control panel, Intel Fan Tuning Utility and latest HWinfo all say it's 65W in Furmark. I guess this is GPU only power without VRAM and fan power, right?

Interestingly Arc Control panel allows a GPU power budget increase from 65.5W to 97.5W, although it's useless because of the 2450 Mhz limit. Maybe with GPU clock speed overclocking it can be useful. In timespy it's 60W and some games like Dota2 consume 45W or 50W with drops to 30W sometimes. But mostly about 50W in games.
 
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Tup3x

Senior member
Dec 31, 2016
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Considering how long it took AMD to fix their OpenGL driver... I just hope it doesn't take Intel as long. :p
 
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reb0rn

Member
Dec 31, 2009
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This will take some time, software still not finished.

I could not watch this, this guy gone over the top with his hate, is he insane, blaming intel for microsoft update downloading older driver over the new one from intel and blaming it on intel???????? and he talk 5min about that
Pure hyped hater is he now
 
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DrMrLordX

Lifer
Apr 27, 2000
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I could not watch this, this guy gone over the top with his hate, is he insane, blaming intel for microsoft update downloading older driver over the new one from intel and blaming it on intel???????? and he talk 5min about that
Pure hyped hater is he now
On the contrary, he seems to be bending over backwards to be nice. And yes Intel is to blame for MS not having the correct drivers scheduled for download, whom do you think submits drivers to MS in the first place?
 

KompuKare

Senior member
Jul 28, 2009
796
397
136
I could not watch this, this guy gone over the top with his hate, is he insane, blaming intel for microsoft update downloading older driver over the new one from intel and blaming it on intel???????? and he talk 5min about that
Pure hyped hater is he now
However, as DrMrLordX pointed out Intel are the ones who submitted the drivers to Intel in the first place. If the drivers are in such a mess and in so much flux that Microsoft Update cannot keep up, who is entirely to blame for this?

Then Intel's GPU division is run by that hype-things-up Koduri and he's been hyping it for ages already - but recently has been trying to deflect blame to the driver team in typical CYA-style!

Since he supposedly went to Intel go have a big budget to work on, the driver fiasco is almost 100% on him. Speculation, but since ARC has had multiple hardware revision this obviously hasn't helped the driver team at all.

Speaking of hype, Ryan Shrout has started hyping the China only A380 too now. Won't dignify his PR waffle by linking to the Twitts, but apparently it is "the build quality is exceptional. Mainstream 1080pMed gaming, DX12 Ultimate, AV1 HW encode, solid value!".
Solid value? We all though it was poor value but maybe that's because we don't appreciate that you are getting Genuine Intel™©® for that price?
AV1 encode might be the only good thing in that list. Build quality, well without good drivers that is only useful if planning to use it as a door stop!
 

mikk

Diamond Member
May 15, 2012
3,585
1,410
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On the contrary, he seems to be bending over backwards to be nice. And yes Intel is to blame for MS not having the correct drivers scheduled for download, whom do you think submits drivers to MS in the first place?

This old driver install issue is very old. I have this old driver downloading nonsense also on my old 7700k and newer i7-1165G7. Intel submits new drivers but for some reason Windows likes to revert to very old iGPU drivers sometimes. Microsoft has all the drivers including the newest ones and sometimes they are newer than Intels official, why do you think Intel is to blame?
 
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