Info: Outdoor Excursions of Cat5 / UTP - Some answers

[ScottMac]

I finally got a chance to talk to some of the Anixter Lab guys about using UTP (i.e., Cat 5) outdoors.

The one situation that was still fuzzy (to me anyway) was having a run of Cat5 with some portion of the span being outside of the building: Like from the basement to the second floor on the outside of a house.

The first thing to remember is that ANY external run of UTP is undesirable. It should only be used in circumstances where there is no other available option. That means that UTP externally should be ALWAYS the LAST option on the list.

That being said....

The UTP should be in metal conduit, the conduit should be grounded, the run should be as short as possible. PVC is not a good choice for conduit, expecially in dry, cold, windy, and/or snowy areas. PVC will accumulate static and transmit the static charge (by itself and into/through the UTP). For the two people on the planet that don't know; static electricity is very bad for semiconductors (like your memory and processors).

Some sort of "entrance protection" should be used as well, at both ends. The need for entrance protection is reduced somewhat if the conduit is properly run and grounded according to the NEC and local code, but it is still recommended. Entrance protection provides a static drain and a discharge path for "environmental events" (like lightening). Lightning does not have to directly strike the UTP or conduit to cause damage. A near strike can take your system(s) out just as easily (and maybe take you out too.....).

Avaya is the only company (that I've been able to find) that makes an "outdoor-grade" UTP. It is meant for DATA use only (no telephones). Avaya also make the one line entrance protection products, other companies have entrance protection products, but thay (apparently) are NOT CATEGORY RATED...the Avaya product is. Each run of UTP is rated by the level of it's lowest rated component. If you put an unrated Jack, plug, panel, "protection" device or punchdown on a run, then the run is not rated, it's no different than silver satin-modem-cord-crap, and good luck getting it over 10Meg.

The Avaya product ID for "Outside Plant Cable, Category 5" is: CA 3-NCA4158 4/24 R1000. The Material ID is 108257643. It's sold in 1000 foot reels.

The Avaya product ID for a "Category 5 OSP Protector" is: C5P4T-16. The Material ID is 108224874.


Another point that came out in the discussion is the "choke" effect of metal conduit on UTP. Any UTP in conduit should use the largest possible conduit diameter. If you put four runs of UTP in a 3/4 Inch conduit, it's like putting a bunch of ferrite beads on the cable itself....the choke effect will diminish the effective distance, and reduce the frequency scope/capability of the UTP to some extent.

Who'd a thunk it?


Anyway, that's the story. I hope someone finds it helpful.

FWIW

Scott

 

[CoolTech]

good information, good job.

 

[ScottMac]

One-time bump to keep it alive for another day.

 

[Mucman]

For some reason I love reading about cabling standards

I talked to Anixter today too! Bought some BIX patch-panels as well as the tool . I would have said "ScottMac says high" but I was talking to the local office in Vancouver...

It sounds to me that cabling outside with UTP doesn't seem worth it. How are you supposed to know that you covered every detail perfectly, there isn't any real way to test it is there? I would rather bore a hole in the floor than risk UTP cabling outside...

 

[Garion]

Sure, you can certainly test that. Unplug your dryer and connect the hot to the conduit and the ground to the Cat5 jack inside. If it smokes and your house catches on fire, you didn't do it right. *grin*

- G

 

[Mucman]

LOL Garion!!!

 

[ScottMac]

A standard HiPot would do it too....a little less chance of burning the house down.

Still sounds like a good case for wireless.

Whatever.

Scott

 

[new2AMD]

would a plenum cable be a better solution?

 

[Mucman]

AFAIK plenum is meant for in doors, specifically in air ducts. The plenum keeps toxic gasses inside the cable so in case of a fire the gasses don't spread throughout the building.

 

[Tallgeese]

Muc:

I think that the plenum jacket is made of material that is both fire-resistant and formulated NOT to give off clouds of the toxic smoke that non-plenum will when it eventually DOES catch fire.

 

[Mucman]

Ahh, thanks for the correction... That makes more sense than what I said, I am not sure where I got my explanation from (my arse?)

Anyways, plenum would not simplify outdoor wiring anyways. It just means that if the cable got struck by lightning the fire
department won't have to worry about the toxic gas fumes when they haul your crispy corpse out of the building.

 

[Garion]

This is great info, and shames me that I ran a cable outside my house a few years back, before I was edumicated on this by you guys. Anyhow, I've got one question for you, Scott. From an electrical/danger perspective, how much does regular telephone cable differ from UTP? It seems that every house has got a few miles of phone wire strung across it. Same risks?

- G

 

[sml]

FWIW: I've run a piece of CAT5 out a window, up the side of the house, along the roof, into another window and then into a switch upstairs to connect a PC in a den downstairs without having to run anything through the walls. no high speed networking, just wanted internet access [this was before wireless hit the market en masse] and it works ok, i went out there to inspect the cable this weekend and there were no signs of damage, however I live in one of the most climate-friendly areas in the US [San Diego] - I don't think I would've done it if I lived in MN or some such cold place

 

[nightowl]

Good post ScottMac. With the number of people asking about running cable outside, I think that the Information in this thread should be put in the FAQ. It will be easier to reference and it just might cut down on the number of posts on running CAT5 outside.

 

[SpongeBob]

Wow, this is surprinsing. Granted I have limited knowledge of networking, but at my house at school I had run CAT5 to everyone's rooms out the windows and on the sides of the house. This is in Michigan too. Never had a problem through 3 cold and snowy winters. Guess I was just lucky.

 

[spidey07]

Garion,

I'm pretty sure all phone wires have entrance protection or some other sort of lightning arrest.

Then again maybe not, my aunt was popped on the chin twice in two years from her phone/lightning. Lesson learned - use a cordless if you must use a phone during a lightning storm.

 

[Mucman]

Yeah, I had always heard that you should not talk on the phone during a lightning storm...

 

[ScottMac]

Sorry for not posting earlier, I was in the Hospital for a couple days (some tests. DIagnoses: extreme goofiness (not really, but turns out not to be very serious).

Plemun cable rots outdoors about the same as UTP, depending on the quality of materials, just like UTP. Plenum will give off toxic gasses, just fewer of 'em, and it takes a higher temp to catch & burn (and give off toxic gasses).

All telephone lines shold have entrance protection. The Old system is two black sticks about ~4" long, or a couple dime-diameter gas poppers. Newer systems are gas poppers in the grey/black box mounted on the side of your house (where you'd plug in a POTS phone to see if your phone problem was outside your house or the inside cabling). IF you have a box oon the side of your house, you may still have the old system in-place, but disconnected...just foillow the phone line from where it comes into the house....there'll be some kind of device.

For the folks that did it/are doing it (cabling out of the house), I didn't say it wouldn't work, it just imposes a certain amount of danger. IF it's done, it should be done properly and with the right materials. For the Northerners and desert-dwellers...the first time you get a static blast that knocks you halfway to Kansas, you'll immediately understand the problems. When you get back from Kansas, plan on buying new stuff, static is a very bad thing in large quantities. By the time you see a spark (like from shuffling your feet on a rug), you're already at ~35,000-50,000 volts DC (depending on things like ambient humidity & such). Dry wind across an outdoor conductor will cause static. Snow amplifies the effect somewhat. Lightning (the ultimate static charge) is the main bad mama, but if you can prevent or reduce the ionic ground-charge, you greatly reduce the chance of a lightning hit.

Enough. I just got home, gotta go clean up & sleep.

FWIW

Scott

 

[jageshshah]

Sorry to revive an old post but I haven't been able to get any information on this... I have already made a mistake of running UTP cable in an PVC conduit. I have spent a lot of money already and now have static charges. The length of the conduit is 900FT and runs between two building.

Question: what are my options ? Can I fix this ? Any help is greatly appreciated.

 

[Eug]

Revived after 9 years. Is that a record for a zombie thread?

BTW, when I was looking a couple of years ago, it seemed outdoor rated but non-flooded cable was not uncommon. This cable's jacket is more resistant to UV damage and may be thicker too. Even some hardware stores sometimes carry it now. However, I ran flooded / gel-filled cable instead, since where I ran it was not too far above the ground, and would be covered in snow several months of the year.

I'm considering running gel-filled cable all the way to the back of my yard, but it's only for the deer cam so I'm not sure I will bother. I already have powerline networking there and it works OK. Usually much less than 10 Mbps, but at least it's stable.

 

[imagoon]

Sorry to revive an old post but I haven't been able to get any information on this... I have already made a mistake of running UTP cable in an PVC conduit. I have spent a lot of money already and now have static charges. The length of the conduit is 900FT and runs between two building.

Question: what are my options ? Can I fix this ? Any help is greatly appreciated.

Spend $200 and use fiber transceivers. Can't have static issues with light.

 

[ScottMac]

Geez ... when I saw this post I thought someone had hacked in as me ... it took a while before I remembered doing it.

I agree with imagoon, fiber, if you can swing it.

IF the issue you're having is primarily static (probably on the PVC), then put several static drains on the PVC ... something like a pipe clamp with a ground wire in several locations along the span would probably work OK (guessing, it's not something I've ever had to deal with).

Entrance protection on the cable inside the PVC is needed too, Cat5 rated protection was ~US$100.00 a side last time I looked.

For examples, go to Anixter.com and search their online catalog for "Cat5 entrance protection" it'll bring up a three-page list of 25pr and 4pr units, from Cat5 to Cat6/6a/6e.

Cat5 appears to be ~US$75.00 each, Cat5e look to be about US$80.00 each (per Google search, ITW Linx). The protectors also appear to be using a 110-style punch-down for the gozinta and gozoutta, so you may need to buy or borrow a tool.

Good Luck! Re-post if you have more questions ...

 

[Specop 007]

Revived after 9 years. Is that a record for a zombie thread?

BTW, when I was looking a couple of years ago, it seemed outdoor rated but non-flooded cable was not uncommon. This cable's jacket is more resistant to UV damage and may be thicker too. Even some hardware stores sometimes carry it now. However, I ran flooded / gel-filled cable instead, since where I ran it was not too far above the ground, and would be covered in snow several months of the year.

I'm considering running gel-filled cable all the way to the back of my yard, but it's only for the deer cam so I'm not sure I will bother. I already have powerline networking there and it works OK. Usually much less than 10 Mbps, but at least it's stable.

I have a run thats right around 275 feet outdoors thats just UTP cable. Its for my home network so I went the cheap route and just hung it from the roof line through a tree up to a telephone pole, wrapped around the pole a few times to get a good coil effect going on then off to another roof where an antenna is. Been holding up fine in the sun, wind and rain. That said, a great redneck conduit is garden hose.

I've been thinking of running garden hose aerially because that'd really make the neighbors wonder WTF but havent been sufficiently motivated as of yet. Probably wait till the existing run fails.

Specop_007....Putting the IT in Redneck since 2009.

 

[Eug]

Actually one of my GigE ports is installed off a pre-existing CAT5 (not 5e) cable that runs outside for about 8 feet on the side of the house.

It was there for several years before I moved in, which probably means it's about 7 or so years old. Unfortunately, the jacket is starting to crack.

The gel-filled stuff I installed 3 years ago looks brand new, despite the fact that it's been under snow for 3 winters now.

I haven't installed entrance protection there mainly because I was lazy but the good news is that they're fairly short in obscure spots and much of it is low to the ground. However, if I were to install that 200 foot cable it most definitely would have to have surge protection.

Having a 275 ft. cable wrapped around a telephone pole seems like you're asking for a lightning strike...

 

[Eug]

Revived after 9 years. Is that a record for a zombie thread?

BTW, when I was looking a couple of years ago, it seemed outdoor rated but non-flooded cable was not uncommon. This cable's jacket is more resistant to UV damage and may be thicker too. Even some hardware stores sometimes carry it now. However, I ran flooded / gel-filled cable instead, since where I ran it was not too far above the ground, and would be covered in snow several months of the year.

I'm considering running gel-filled cable all the way to the back of my yard, but it's only for the deer cam so I'm not sure I will bother. I already have powerline networking there and it works OK. Usually much less than 10 Mbps, but at least it's stable.

I ended up getting some more outdoor CAT6 cabling, since I just got an HD deer cam, and powerline networking for this run is only borderline for streaming HD. This time I just got non-gel-filled outdoor stuff. Much cheaper and available locally. The most obvious difference vs. just the regular indoor stuff is that it has two plastic coats. I'm not sure if the outer sheath is UV-rated, since the description is in Chinese.

I guess the other bonus is that I could theoretically use the leftover stuff inside too. You can't use the gel-filled stuff inside because the gel is very flammable. Plus it's very gooey and can leak out.