India's rape culture

[justoh]

I feel ill after reading (wading) through this thread.

I can't think of a good reason for allowing it as a topic i nthe first place.

Was it ever NOT going to end up as a flame war ... Indian users vs the rest?

At least you aren't wading through the ganges. amirite?

 

[nanna]

Your evidence is shit. I mean, when you have an intelligence officer looking into the showing of a film, then you have to wonder where their priorities lies. It's truly disgusting that they would go that far to investigate the showing of an anti-rape film as if it was a threat to national security. This is why many say India has a rape culture and you and your compatriots need to do some introspection before mouthing off about outsiders criticizing your country.

I at least provided evidence to what i am saying unlike you who only have opinions without any evidence supporting it. As my supporting link showed, the foreign documentary maker is a fraud who misled the authorities. Considering that the documentary is based on a high profile rape which brought people onto the streets and the accused is given a death sentence, the very fact that she wanted to interview the accused by misleading the authorities would legitimately raise concerns in law enforcement agencies including intelligence agencies. American agencies won’t be any different either in similar situations.

Its kind of funny, India is the one country/nationality you can make fun of on this forum with impunity and not get banned. If this thread was about a country in Africa, half the forum would be banned by now.

Roger that ! And i never understood why.

Bassaha or whatever her name is brings it on herself, the posts lately seem to be more of a reaction to the over the top BS and shitting on everyone else by that member.

Thats just finger pointing. "Lately" the posts may be a reaction to his posts (no way to prove it either) but that does not answer why a thread specifically targeting India is created in the first place. Not that its against the rules or anything like that but i am curious why India especially on a subject like rape on which no country can claim moral superiority.

Ah yes, the people of this thread (starting with the OP) in a nutshell: people with nothing in their lives to be actually proud of, whose sole avenue to feel better about their pathetic existences is by attempting to slander an entire country and culture based on the actions of a few. Insecurity just run rampant.

THIS :thumbsup:

There's no "rape culture" in India as such. Where there is a culture of is a pervasive patriarchy and misogyny, which isn't unique to India - it's a South Asian thing. Throw that in with a general sense of lawlessness, and lack of a strong police force, and naturally it's a crime that's prominent.

Before talking about "pervasive patriarchy and misogyny" etc etc , can anyone prove it that India has more rapes than the West in the first place in a statistically and scholarly way. I haven't seen that yet. The whole western narrative (except few) about rape in India is based on assumptions and preconceived notions.

 

[nanna]

Why to blacken India on rape do they have to omit the facts ?

A huge row has erupted in India over India’s Daughter, a film made by the BBC on the gang-rape and murder of a young medical student on a Delhi bus in November 2012. What aroused particular anger was how the film, designed to be shown in seven countries to mark International Women’s Day, seemed to want to portray India as the rape capital of the world, with its headline claim that the country has “a rape every 22 minutes”.

But what has also come to light is that when the film was privately previewed in Delhi, its original version included evidence that in many countries in the West the incidence of rape is actually much greater. In Britain, the official Crime Survey for England and Wales 2014 estimated that there are 85,000 rapes every year, or one every six minutes. Equivalent US figures suggest that 1 per cent of all women are sexually assaulted each year, one every 25 seconds.

Those who saw the preview of India’s Daughter in Delhi have testified that the original version did make comparisons with the rest of the world. One, Anna Vetticad, praised it as a “balanced documentary”, because it ended with “worldwide statistics highlighting violence against women from Australia to the US”. But when the final version emerged, all this had been cut out. India was shown standing alone, as a country where rape is an exceptional problem.

What also led the Indian courts to ban showing the film was its portrayal of a country where violence towards women is part of its national culture. Particularly controversial was its prison cell interview with the bus driver, waiting on death row for the outcome of his appeal to India’s Supreme Court. He showed no remorse for the woman he had helped to rape and murder. He suggested that she had brought this on herself by travelling on a bus late at night. But again this picture of India as having a peculiar cultural problem over its acceptance of gang-rape is belied by the statistics. According to UK and US figures, 14 per cent of rapes are by strangers. In India the figure is less than 1 per cent.

Back in 2012, when that Delhi crime first attracted worldwide coverage, I looked into many horrific stories of gang-rape reported in Britain. According to the Metropolitan Police, more than 15 per cent of rapes reported in London each year involve three or more attackers. In one Essex case, the rapists of a 16-year-old girl poured acid over her in an attempt to destroy the evidence of their crime. We scarcely need reminding of recent revelations about what was going on in Rotherham, Rochdale, Oxford and elsewhere.

If there is a cultural problem here, it is the longstanding desire of the Western media to stereotype Indian males as somehow, to a special degree, sexual predators. Back in 1984, Western screens showed the TV series Jewel in the Crown and the film A Passage to India, both featuring rapes by Indian men of white women (although one was imaginary). More recently no films about India have been more popular in the West than Slumdog Millionaire and Monsoon Wedding, again featuring rapes, although this time by Indian men of Indian women.

As for the BBC’s latest effort at reinforcing this stereotype, there is already evidence that it has done damage to the image of India in the West, such as the much-publicised case of the Leipzig professor who barred an Indian student from an internship on the grounds that “we hear a lot about the rape problem in India, which I cannot support”. Female professors in Germany are reported as refusing to teach Indian male students for similar reasons. But the question the BBC has to answer is why did it so deliberately omit the evidence from the final version of that film, which might have given its worldwide audience such a different picture? It seems that, across the board, it now takes its right to distort evidence so much for granted that it no longer has the ability to recognise what damage this is doing.

 

[LevelSea]

https://m.imgur.com/gallery/PKf7l

 

[Ns1]

https://m.imgur.com/gallery/PKf7l

thank god there are no americans with that attitude.

 

[LevelSea]

thank god there are no americans with that attitude.

Hanging a rape victim? I hope not.

 

[nanna]

thank god there are no americans with that attitude.

Are you sure ?

http://www.ranker.com/list/the-8-most-horribly-insensitive-republican-rape-comments/molly-mahan

 

[Ns1]

Are you sure ?

http://www.ranker.com/list/the-8-most-horribly-insensitive-republican-rape-comments/molly-mahan

 

[nanna]

 

[Dari]

I at least provided evidence to what i am saying unlike you who only have opinions without any evidence supporting it. As my supporting link showed, the foreign documentary maker is a fraud who misled the authorities. Considering that the documentary is based on a high profile rape which brought people onto the streets and the accused is given a death sentence, the very fact that she wanted to interview the accused by misleading the authorities would legitimately raise concerns in law enforcement agencies including intelligence agencies. American agencies won’t be any different either in similar situations.



Roger that ! And i never understood why.




Thats just finger pointing. "Lately" the posts may be a reaction to his posts (no way to prove it either) but that does not answer why a thread specifically targeting India is created in the first place. Not that its against the rules or anything like that but i am curious why India especially on a subject like rape on which no country can claim moral superiority.



THIS :thumbsup:



Before talking about "pervasive patriarchy and misogyny" etc etc , can anyone prove it that India has more rapes than the West in the first place in a statistically and scholarly way. I haven't seen that yet. The whole western narrative (except few) about rape in India is based on assumptions and preconceived notions.

Ample evidence has been provided by me and others. Instead of acknowledging the rape culture within your country, you and your ilk deny and deflect, insisting that India is a paragon of human civilization. It's as if your feelings are so brittle that an acknowledgment of simple facts causes y'all to go into a tailspin. It's sad and entertaining at the same time.

 

[Baasha]

Such incredible bias against a country that has done no harm to others. It baffles the mind as to how people can be so vicious in their hatred of India.

The main problem here is the use of the term 'rape culture.' Although it is commonly used in feminist literature, the layman's definition would be tantamount to painting an entire culture with a broad brush.

The documentary, and the overall overemphasis on rapes in India for the past few years is an attack on India and Indian men. A rape is equated to patriarchy, Indian "culture" and subliminally, Hinduism.

This common tactic, otherwise known as atrocity literature, is used as a tool to enable and embolden the evangelical mafia.

This piece by Sankrant Sanu gives FACTS on rape as well as the ulterior motive behind the loud howling by anti-Indians world-over: Rape in India - Why it becomes a worldwide story

It is ultimately to shame the head of the household, mainly men in India, and to break the strong family system that has proved to be the bedrock of Indian society for millenia.

Once women who mistake 'rights' to mean unbridled recklessness - ie going partying and being promiscuous - the family system will start to wither and weaken like it has in much of the West.

What is much more ridiculous is the hypocrisy of the West in lecturing India about women's safety, women's freedom etc.

The rape culture in the West is FAR WORSE than it is in India. Their singling out India on rape cases is akin to Nazi Germany finding fault with racism among Jews.

Further, India, unequivocally, has the best culture in the world - specifically, Hindu culture.

30 Famous Quotes about India

Some great ones here:

Will Durant, American historian: "India was the motherland of our race, and Sanskrit the mother of Europe's languages: she was the mother of our philosophy; mother, through the Arabs, of much of our mathematics; mother, through the Buddha, of the ideals embodied in Christianity; mother, through the village community, of self-government and democracy. Mother India is in many ways the mother of us all".

Dr Arnold Toynbee, British Historian: "It is already becoming clear that a chapter which had a Western beginning will have to have an Indian ending if it is not to end in the self-destruction of the human race. At this supremely dangerous moment in history, the only way of salvation for mankind is the Indian way."

W. Heisenberg, German Physicist: "After the conversations about Indian philosophy, some of the ideas of Quantum Physics that had seemed so crazy suddenly made much more sense."

 

[Moonbeam]

Baasha: Such incredible bias against a country that has done no harm to others. It baffles the mind as to how people can be so vicious in their hatred of India.

M: What does it matter? You can never be harmed by what people think of India. You are not an Indian, you are a human being who has attached his ego to India. Some of the great teachers of India taught me non attachment to things. I am not an American in ego even though I was born here and lived here all my life and love my country for its land and its people. When you slander the West as you have in defense of India, it doesn't bother me. You can't touch my love for my country by disrespecting it. I know probably better than you do, the faults we have. You are a fanatic and a believer in a culture that have fast beauty and infinite imperfections like other place. And it is because you have no real internal self respect. You are Indian so anything that criticizes India criticizes you. You are attached to the wheel of Karma.

B: The main problem here is the use of the term 'rape culture.' Although it is commonly used in feminist literature, the layman's definition would be tantamount to painting an entire culture with a broad brush.

M: What do you care that people pick up such brushes. You are not a culture, you are a person. You either defend rape or you do not. You look at your culture and see if there is an excessive amount of rape going on and whether the culture is reacting defensively and trying to deny it, or worse, justify it. What difference does it make what culture you live in. Evil is evil and one does not hide from it because of ones ego.

B: The documentary, and the overall overemphasis on rapes in India for the past few years is an attack on India and Indian men. A rape is equated to patriarchy, Indian "culture" and subliminally, Hinduism.

M: What do you care what it is equated to? The only question is whether the equation is correct. If Hinduism supports rape than Hinduism isn't a good thing. Raping people is wrong. If you defend your culture and it defends the practice of rape than you support evil. Documentaries are a good way for a culture to begin to address evil.

B: This common tactic, otherwise known as atrocity literature, is used as a tool to enable and embolden the evangelical mafia.

M: That is also exactly how a bigot would see it, somebody who has their ego attached to their culture, such that any criticism of the culture is an attack on them. You are not a culture. You can't be harmed by any attack on it.

B: This piece by Sankrant Sanu gives FACTS on rape as well as the ulterior motive behind the loud howling by anti-Indians world-over: Rape in India - Why it becomes a worldwide story

M: The Germans had many people supporting Hitler. There are bigots everywhere justifying every ego identification under the sun. The ego is a delusion, a false self created to bask in the glory of some external delusion that purports to fill its believers with some sort of special glory. But you are only just another human being who thinks he or she needs a crutch to lean on.

B: It is ultimately to shame the head of the household, mainly men in India, and to break the strong family system that has proved to be the bedrock of Indian society for millenia.

M: Who cares. My ancestors used to go deep into caves paint horses and things. Nobody now even knows what it was about. What you call bedrock is quicksand. Whatever it is will pass. What has always been and will remain is the human self, the infinite capacity to be anything. You just confused yourself with the thing you adapted to. In America, had you grown up in the South, you would likely be one of the fools here bashing India.

B: Once women who mistake 'rights' to mean unbridled recklessness - ie going partying and being promiscuous - the family system will start to wither and weaken like it has in much of the West.

M: Every culture is infected with self hate and every new freedom releases all that the suppression of that freedom has bottled up. India is in upheaval over rape because patriarchal cultures suppress women and the whole world is coming to see that's evil. All the ego attachment men have to their royal station in a patriarchal society will leak out as violence toward change as the bonds that bind women weaken. But a better world is coming for women everywhere. Patriarchy is a disease.

B: What is much more ridiculous is the hypocrisy of the West in lecturing India about women's safety, women's freedom etc.

M: We are at a different place on the curve. You are just beginning. Your hell is still largely repressed, but ours has been exposed.

B: The rape culture in the West is FAR WORSE than it is in India. Their singling out India on rape cases is akin to Nazi Germany finding fault with racism among Jews.

M: What do you care? You are not an Indian, you are a person. You can't be touched by criticism of a culture. We in the West have a lot of work to do. We have a patriarchal culture too. We have a lot of bigoted assholes here, just like in India. I can see it because I don't need to defend my culture. My culture is my culture and my job in it is to make it the best culture I can. Your opinion of my culture doesn't bother me.

B: Furthermore India, unequivocally, has the best culture in the world - specifically, Hindu culture.

30 Famous Quotes about India

Some great ones here:

M: I find it interesting that the people who think one culture is superior to others are usually always of the culture. This need to feel like you're the best, if you but knew it, comes from feeling inferior and needing that kind of crutch. You should be asking yourself why you actually feel inferior. If you knew your culture wouldn't matter so much and you wouldn't find yourself in these kinds of debates making a gigantic bigot of yourself. Every culture has its richness and its shit and everyone of them will pass away to be replaced and it's happening day by day. But if you want to board the train that goes nowhere, you'll have to fight our conservative brain defectives here in America for a seat.

 

[nanna]

Ample evidence has been provided by me and others. Instead of acknowledging the rape culture within your country, you and your ilk deny and deflect, insisting that India is a paragon of human civilization. It's as if your feelings are so brittle that an acknowledgment of simple facts causes y'all to go into a tailspin. It's sad and entertaining at the same time.

Which evidence ? I keep on challenging people who are vilifying India and Indian culture using rape as a weapon to prove that India has more rapes than western countries first . I am yet to see the evidence. On the contrary, I have provided evidence that there are more incidence of rapes in the West than in India. (refer to post #78).

No one is insisting India "is a paragon of civilization". India like other countries has good and bad things. What is being said is that India or Indian culture is not a "rape culture" either or India has no more or less rapes than other countries including western countries (i am being generous here ignoring the figures which point to western countries having more rapes than India). What is happening is that Indian people and media have become more sensitive to rape which brings people onto the streets and in turn attracts media. So the awareness of rape is inviting media attraction which in turn sensationalizes and puts India on the spot every time a rape occurs. There are people in India (including some politicians) who give pro-rape statements here and there. But they are as much representative of Indian society and culture as some western politicians and priests giving pro-rape and pro-pedophilia statements are of western soceity and culture. With respect to the documentary, as i said before it was banned for different and legitimate reasons and that is a separate issue from the issue of rape.

 

[Reynod]

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Any of the mods care to comment?

 

[Dari]

Which evidence ? I keep on challenging people who are vilifying India and Indian culture using rape as a weapon to prove that India has more rapes than western countries first . I am yet to see the evidence. On the contrary, I have provided evidence that there are more incidence of rapes in the West than in India. (refer to post #78).

No one is insisting India "is a paragon of civilization". India like other countries has good and bad things. What is being said is that India or Indian culture is not a "rape culture" either or India has no more or less rapes than other countries including western countries (i am being generous here ignoring the figures which point to western countries having more rapes than India). What is happening is that Indian people and media have become more sensitive to rape which brings people onto the streets and in turn attracts media. So the awareness of rape is inviting media attraction which in turn sensationalizes and puts India on the spot every time a rape occurs. There are people in India (including some politicians) who give pro-rape statements here and there. But they are as much representative of Indian society and culture as some western politicians and priests giving pro-rape and pro-pedophilia statements are of western soceity and culture. With respect to the documentary, as i said before it was banned for different and legitimate reasons and that is a separate issue from the issue of rape.

Again, you keep missing the point. To you (and others), it isn't rape if it isn't reported. Worse, there have been many voices in India over the past couple of years (which have come to our attention) that are either nonchalant about the rape culture in that country or, in some disgusting misogynistic way, support it as a method of control. The article in the OP was about the attackers using rape as retaliation against the nuns who were protesting about being persecuted in India. Others have provided countless quotes of respectable men in India that defend the raping of women in that country and justify it by leaning on their tradition. So, when you have that kind of mindset, it isn't a surprise to see rapes under-reported.

 

[cirrrocco]

Dari

Can you answer this one question. do you agree that US women are per capita more likely to be raped than a woman in India

Once you answer that question, you will understand where the real rape culture is

Until then all comments you post , they are just brain farts.

You again talk about under reporting of rapes. I showed you and other stats that 68% of rapes in US are not reported. That is a whole 2/3 of Rapes in the US not reported and yet I am surprised that you keep pointing at rapes under reported in India.
why?

 

[Ns1]

care to comment?

O_O

Reynod
Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 7

 

[radhak]

Hanging a rape victim? I hope not.

No, it doesn't take a crazy coot to mouth off here; here the law follows thru to convict:
An 11-year-old reported being raped twice, wound up with a conviction

 

[Perknose]

Too many posts in this thread have crossed the line.

Perknose
Forum Director