India - U.S. jobs to India thread: 10-20-2003 India revitalized by booming economy (at expense of U.S. workers)

[dmcowen674]

Thread list of Companies that have sent Tech jobs to India:

Microsoft Corporation
DELL (Don't get a DELL DUDE!)
Gateway
General Electric
AOL
Amazon.com
HPS
EDS
Hewlett Packard
AMD
Intel
Sprint
IBM
CSC
United Technologies Corp.
TelVista
Bank of America (Bank of India?)
Perot Systems (Now apart of that giant sucking sound!)
Netgear
NORTEL
Kulicke & Soffa Industries
Verizon (Can you hear them now?)
Chase JP Morgan Bank (Just hit our radar screen!)
Tyson Foods
American Express
IBM
Cisco
Sun
Oracle
PeopleSoft
SMC
Accenture
Ernst and Young
Walmart
Gap
Capital One
Adobe
Electronic Arts
AT&T
Citigroup
Cypress
Ciber
Hartford Life
Fidelity Investments
Lucent
Goldman Sachs
Reebok
BMC Software
Yahoo!
Silicon Graphics
Sears
BellSouth


I will add to this list as people post the names and hopefully with Boycotting and Voicing opionions Companies may re-think their decisions and be able to take names off this list.

List updated is updated more often at:

Corey Goode Website on Companies & Politician sending Jobs overseas


Wow, right here in my own backyard I didn't realize the Baby Bell here has been and looking to ship every job it possibly can to a new facility they have built in India. It just even sounds so wrong to say that phone and Internet service for little ol Georgia in the U.S. is supported by India.

From

BellSouth "Project Horizon" ships IT jobs to India

Bellsouth Outsourced :

"Jobs on the Horizon: While Indian workers here are fighting to keep their H-1Bs (see Workers Oppose H-1B Bill ), BellSouth Corp. (NYSE: BLS - message board) is at work on something called "Project Horizon," through which it will outsource IT work to a facility run by business partner Accenture in Bangalore, India. BellSouth says it chose India because of the "high quality and low cost of technical resources... and the country's pro-U.S. business environment."

"Our current business case suggests moving one-third to one-half of our IT application work offshore. This equates to 600-900 positions over the next four years," says BellSouth in a memo about Project Horizon. The plan is supposed to save BellSouth $275 million over five years."-lightreading Aug 6/2003
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
10-20-2003 India revitalized by Booming Economy (at expense of U.S.)

GURGAON, India Tarun Narula, a 25-year-old computer instructor, celebrated Mohandas K. Gandhi's birthday on Oct. 2 by going to the Metropolitan Mall. So did so many thousands of others that the parking lot was full, as were those of the other two malls across and down the street. Indian-made sport utility vehicles, cars and motorcycles fought for space, choking the roads of this satellite city south of Delhi.

Foreign institutional investors have poured nearly $5 billion into the Indian market this year, already more than six times last year's total. The Bombay Stock Exchange's benchmark Sensitive Index has risen by more than 50 percent since April, hitting a three-year high. Foreign exchange reserves are at a record $90 billion.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
American Companies becoming Indian Companies while retaining American Corporation status.

 

[xxxxxJohnGaltxxxxx]

...talk about irony; I was just presented a project to study the economic impact of moving 'call-centers' to India has on direct investment abroad...when we finish our study, and if I remember, I'll post some of our findings.

 

[gistech1978]

thats not irony
its a coincidence
and if its in line with some of your previous posts it will devolve into "we shouldnt help india if pakistan drops a bomb since they took all our jobs. we will let the pakistanis march through new delhi then burn down the taj mahal to the ground. that'll show em."

 

[burnedout]

Dave: Believe it or not, I get so pissed off about such jobs moving overseas that I thought of creating a website along the lines of "greedybastards.com" or something. The site would contain similar content found in this thread.

Anyway, add SMC to the list. We had trouble with an SMC router here at work. So I called SMC and was switched to India. The support was horrible. Also add HP to the list as our company president had a problem with an HP inkjet cartridge one weekend. He called HP printer support and was promptly transfered overseas (not sure if it was India). Needless to say, he was extremely frustrated about the whole thing.

greedybastards.com, I tell you.

 

[xxxxxJohnGaltxxxxx]

Originally posted by: gistech1978
thats not irony
its a coincidence
and if its in line with some of your previous posts it will devolve into "we shouldnt help india if pakistan drops a bomb since they took all our jobs. we will let the pakistanis march through new delhi then burn down the taj mahal to the ground. that'll show em."

You must have me mistaken; I respect a country's ability to, as most would put it, usurp American jobs in the spirit of competition. Please cut and paste a single post where I have complained about jobs going overseas. Perhaps you should cut that hippie hair and you would think more clearly.

 

[gistech1978]

Quote

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by: xxxxxJohnGaltxxxxx
How is that sick? The selfish people of France enjoy the liberty to bash America because we gave them that liberty by overthrowing a brutal dictator; when it comes time to overthrow another dictator and give the Iraqi people the very same liberty the French enjoy, France objects...how easily they forget. Honestly, I wish another country would goose-step through the Arc and we just say, "Sorry, French, but you do not let America fly over your country with military planes any more; sorry, but you are on your own...for once."
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

im so sorry!
did you not post this?
i forgot how enlightened you were for a minute there. i guess it was wrong of me to accuse you having of a flawed opinion on other countries.

 

[xxxxxJohnGaltxxxxx]

What does that have to do with what you presuppose I would say: "we shouldnt help india if pakistan drops a bomb since they took all our jobs."

You should really cut that hair and lay off the oversized 4-way window pane blotter hits.

 

[athithi]

Originally posted by: burnedout
Dave: Believe it or not, I get so pissed off about such jobs moving overseas that I thought of creating a website along the lines of "greedybastards.com" or something. The site would contain similar content found in this thread.

Anyway, add SMC to the list. We had trouble with an SMC router here at work. So I called SMC and was switched to India. The support was horrible. Also add HP to the list as our company president had a problem with an HP inkjet cartridge one weekend. He called HP printer support and was promptly transfered overseas (not sure if it was India). Needless to say, he was extremely frustrated about the whole thing.

greedybastards.com, I tell you.

Yeah, bring the jobs back to the genius Americans with 150+ IQs who man the phones at domestic Call Centers

Look, first identify what your REAL problem with the situation is. People have been whining about customer support ever since the invention of the concept of customer support. Your problem is with jobs moving out of the U.S. If you keep going after the call center guys in India, your problem is never going to be solved. They might just shift it to some other contractor in India or some other country, perhaps (Does China sound good to you?). Even if they bring it back to the U.S, they might end up charging you an arm and foot for support. Would that make them less of a "greedy bastard"?

 

[Nitemare]

Not sure if it is big enough to make your list, but wmconnect (Wal-mart's ISP) is all in India. If I did not speak with Indians daily, which the majority of the users of this ISP will not, I could not have understood them. I was able to understand them fine but for some reason they could not understand me even when I articulated my words even more than I already do.

"Big Blue" imports alot of workers from India, but as far as I know, at least in my group, they don't have a major presence there.

 

[Ferocious]

These lists and boycotts NEVER work.

Americans generally would buy stuff made by prisoners and children before doing the correct thing.

 

[burnedout]

Originally posted by: athithi

Yeah, bring the jobs back to the genius Americans with 150+ IQs who man the phones at domestic Call Centers

Look, first identify what your REAL problem with the situation is. People have been whining about customer support ever since the invention of the concept of customer support. Your problem is with jobs moving out of the U.S. If you keep going after the call center guys in India, your problem is never going to be solved. They might just shift it to some other contractor in India or some other country, perhaps (Does China sound good to you?). Even if they bring it back to the U.S, they might end up charging you an arm and foot for support. Would that make them less of a "greedy bastard"?

The problem is not with those in India. All they do is provide a service for less money. The problem is that within the next few years over $100 billion annually will be shipped overseas.

The service sector was formerly an area which was off limits to export. Now, this is no longer the case.

The "greedybastards" are those corporations which ship the jobs offshore, not the Indians. Yes, you can argue Hazlet's theories of economic interdependence all day long if you so desire. However, that does not change the fact that potential wealth is being exported along with a tax base. There are not jobs materializing quickly enough to replace those lost.

Additionally, this is not confined to the tech sector. Accounting, research and analysis and even some medical fields are also being exported.

 

[dexvx]

It decreases the cost of consumers. Thats a good thing. Hell if I want to pay an inflated cost for support I will never use. If people want to pay a premium for support, than let them; I'm sure there are companies who hire good support teams here for a price premium and some people who need it will pay for it. Its capitalism at work.

 

[dmcowen674]

Originally posted by: Nitemare
Not sure if it is big enough to make your list, but wmconnect (Wal-mart's ISP) is all in India. If I did not speak with Indians daily, which the majority of the users of this ISP will not, I could not have understood them. I was able to understand them fine but for some reason they could not understand me even when I articulated my words even more than I already do.

"Big Blue" imports alot of workers from India, but as far as I know, at least in my group, they don't have a major presence there.

From what I've read in reports recently that Microsoft and IBM have bought land in these areas in India where these Call Centers have been built but they haven't gone and done it yet. It would appear that they are waiting to see if there is any public fallout for the other Companies that do it before them which is why the list here could help. Companies do not like Negative publicity, especially investors.

 

[LocutusX]

You are in error if you think that it's only piddly "call centres" which are getting moved to India. What should be potentially more worrisome is the fact that high-level software development operations are also being moved there - often at the expense of naturalized American citizens of Indian descent, who (may) lose their jobs in America and who obviously have no desire to return to India.

 

[athithi]

Hilarious

...not finished reading the article yet, but found this really funny...

Yet such companies as Citibank, McDonald's and Motorola are hustling to tap India's burgeoning number of young big spenders. Brands like Reebok and Nokia are making deeper inroads than ever before


Since December, three mammoth, glitzy malls have opened their doors there, crammed with a collection of stores airlifted straight from America's suburbs ? Nike, Benetton, Pizza Hut, Subway sandwiches, even a showroom for Bose audio systems. Two multiplex theaters show such Hollywood hits as The Matrix Reloaded. Five more malls nearby are in the works.

Gurgaon has become the official stomping ground of Swati Jain and Yamini Kandari, both 22, roommates and co-workers at a nearby call center, where they field phone traffic for a U.S. computer maker. Every weekend they stroll the malls shopping for Levi's jeans, watch movies and make the obligatory stop at McDonald's. Though they both have big dreams (Kandari wants a Ferrari; Jain prefers a Mercedes), they spend half their annual salaries ? about $2,000--on shopping, eating out and other living expenses. "I'm living life for the day," says Kandari

One set of U.S corporations farms out the jobs making Indians richer but, another set of U.S corporations reaps it back through consumers?

 

[Ticks]

I've been seeing a lot about this just recently. Check out this site
Check out the site in my sig, it has TONS of info on this subject.

 

[dmcowen674]

Originally posted by: Ticks
I've been seeing a lot about this just recently. Check out this site
Check out the site in my sig, it has TONS of info on this subject.

Excellent find Ticks. Check this out from this website

Microsoft says reason for shipping jobs to India is that not enough qualified technicians were available in the U.S.

"Your job is going to India, just ask Corey Goode. Earlier this year, Corey was working as an internal support technician at Microsoft?s call routing center in Las Colinas, Texas. His contract was terminated early as the entire support function was ?offshored? to one of Microsoft?s Indian support centers. A total of 1,300 employees are slated to be laid-off as the jobs migrate overseas. One of Corey?s last tasks on the job was to setup the accounts of the individuals who would be replacing him."

What was the reason (for the outsourcing) that was given to you?

"I was told Microsoft had to Off-Shore to stay competitive (Even though their company is over $46 Billion in the Black. I was also told that not enough qualified technicians were available in the U.S. (I have since come to the conclusion that ?qualified? means cheap labor!)"

 

[BOBDN]

That's quite a list. And from the title it is only the Tech jobs sent to India?

I wonder what a complete list of all Tech jobs sent overseas would look like?

Unvelievable. It might actually be easier to make a list of companies who haven't sent jobs overseas.:|

 

[BOBDN]

You know, I'm probably going to start a world of sh!t here but I just have to say this.

It's become acceptable to criticize the French in our country lately, but I'll tell you one thing. If this BS was attempted in France the labor movement there would shut the country down until the greedy corporate bastards brought the jobs back.

If anyone disagrees just think back to the strikes brought on by the mere attempt of government and corporations to decrease medical and retirement benefits in France. Workers shut down the country. If only we could emulate their strength and resolve.

 

[dmcowen674]

Wow, right here in my own backyard I didn't realize the Baby Bell here has been and looking to ship every job it possibly can to India. It just even sounds so wrong to say that phone and Internet service for little ol Georgia in the U.S. is supported by India.

From

BellSouth "Project Horizon" ships IT jobs to India

Bellsouth Outsourced :

"Jobs on the Horizon: While Indian workers here are fighting to keep their H-1Bs (see Workers Oppose H-1B Bill ), BellSouth Corp. (NYSE: BLS - message board) is at work on something called "Project Horizon," through which it will outsource IT work to a facility run by business partner Accenture in Bangalore, India. BellSouth says it chose India because of the "high quality and low cost of technical resources... and the country's pro-U.S. business environment."

"Our current business case suggests moving one-third to one-half of our IT application work offshore. This equates to 600-900 positions over the next four years," says BellSouth in a memo about Project Horizon. The plan is supposed to save BellSouth $275 million over five years."-lightreading Aug 6/2003

 

[OS]

The irony with dell is that way back (talking 10+ years), dell got a foothold and captured customers because their service was the best in the industry. I have no clue where it's at today, but sounds like it's bad.

That seems to be the deal a lot of companies, they start small by offering very good service/quality but the more marketshare they get, the more things go downhill.

 

[BOBDN]

Originally posted by: OS
The irony with dell is that way back (talking 10+ years), dell got a foothold and captured customers because their service was the best in the industry. I have no clue where it's at today, but sounds like it's bad.

That seems to be the deal a lot of companies, they start small by offering very good service/quality but the more marketshare they get, the more things go downhill.

I've dealt with Dell over the past three years. Their service and support was excellent in the beginning. The last time I called them was to have my monitor replaced, which they did without hassle. But prior to that the last time I called them for any support was over two years ago. Within one year their service went from excellent to abysmal. I stopped calling them for support and went to forums where I got much better advice and learned much more than I could from customer service people who I coudn't understand. This is not a knock on the language or accent of the people Dell is using in India but I've always found the Indian accent very difficult to understand.

As far as offering good service/quality then going downhill after winning market share I agree totally. This is the model followed my many companies now. From Home Depot to WalMart to Verizon, you name the company. They work for a time to win customers then once their market share is high they use sales techniques to keep people focused on their previous performance while their current performance drops through the basement. They are cashing in on their image while they destroy their image.

 

[charrison]

Originally posted by: athithi
Hilarious

...not finished reading the article yet, but found this really funny...

Yet such companies as Citibank, McDonald's and Motorola are hustling to tap India's burgeoning number of young big spenders. Brands like Reebok and Nokia are making deeper inroads than ever before


Since December, three mammoth, glitzy malls have opened their doors there, crammed with a collection of stores airlifted straight from America's suburbs ? Nike, Benetton, Pizza Hut, Subway sandwiches, even a showroom for Bose audio systems. Two multiplex theaters show such Hollywood hits as The Matrix Reloaded. Five more malls nearby are in the works.

Gurgaon has become the official stomping ground of Swati Jain and Yamini Kandari, both 22, roommates and co-workers at a nearby call center, where they field phone traffic for a U.S. computer maker. Every weekend they stroll the malls shopping for Levi's jeans, watch movies and make the obligatory stop at McDonald's. Though they both have big dreams (Kandari wants a Ferrari; Jain prefers a Mercedes), they spend half their annual salaries ? about $2,000--on shopping, eating out and other living expenses. "I'm living life for the day," says Kandari

One set of U.S corporations farms out the jobs making Indians richer but, another set of U.S corporations reaps it back through consumers?

Funny how global trade works.

 

[LunarRay]

Originally posted by: BOBDN
You know, I'm probably going to start a world of sh!t here but I just have to say this.

It's become acceptable to criticize the French in our country lately, but I'll tell you one thing. If this BS was attempted in France the labor movement there would shut the country down until the greedy corporate bastards brought the jobs back.

If anyone disagrees just think back to the strikes brought on by the mere attempt of government and corporations to decrease medical and retirement benefits in France. Workers shut down the country. If only we could emulate their strength and resolve.

Do you recall the VCR and TV issue regarding American made units being held in France's customs yards for months and undergoing every check imaginable. Some units (containers) actually were rejected and returned to the US. ('80 or 81) This was the result of French protesting job losses in their homeland, as I remember.

 

[BOBDN]

Originally posted by: LunarRay

Originally posted by: BOBDN
You know, I'm probably going to start a world of sh!t here but I just have to say this.

It's become acceptable to criticize the French in our country lately, but I'll tell you one thing. If this BS was attempted in France the labor movement there would shut the country down until the greedy corporate bastards brought the jobs back.

If anyone disagrees just think back to the strikes brought on by the mere attempt of government and corporations to decrease medical and retirement benefits in France. Workers shut down the country. If only we could emulate their strength and resolve.

Do you recall the VCR and TV issue regarding American made units being held in France's customs yards for months and undergoing every check imaginable. Some units (containers) actually were rejected and returned to the US. ('80 or 81) This was the result of French protesting job losses in their homeland, as I remember.

That was quite some time ago, LR, but I do seem to remember a looming trade war based on loss of European jobs from American imports.

We should have like courage in insisting our nation protect jobs here at home. We can only benefit from the similar ideas you've been posting. To do otherwise is to engage in VERY short term thinking.

We can also look to the Japanese and their very closed economic system for the same type of example of supporting your own nation's workers over cheaper foreign labor as well as the greed of our own corporate leaders.