• We’re currently investigating an issue related to the forum theme and styling that is impacting page layout and visual formatting. The problem has been identified, and we are actively working on a resolution. There is no impact to user data or functionality, this is strictly a front-end display issue. We’ll post an update once the fix has been deployed. Thanks for your patience while we get this sorted.

IMPORTANT INFO ABOUT TWINVIEW (GF2MX)

D

DesignDawg

Diamond Member
Guys and gals,

It seems that there is WIDESPREAD misunderstanding of the Twinview architecture of the GF2 MX chips. Everyone thinks it is "flaky" and the limitations are driver issues, etc.... THIS IS NOT TRUE. There is a HUUUGE difference between Twinview and Matrox's Dualhead. If you are considering buying a twinview card for these features, it is ABSOULTELY CRITICAL that you know and understand the difference between the two architectures. In short, the limitations we have seen so far in the Twinview (such as not being able to do things with the second display like play games, play movies, etc...) are NOT the fault of the drivers. They don't work now, and they never will. This is an issue with Windows, NOT the card. The G400 does dualhead in a MUCH different fashion than the GF2 MX. If you want to know more, I have written a DETAILED response to the Asus V7100T article.
As of right now, it seems that SUOrangeman and I are the only two people speaking the truth on this matter, and we need to get it heard. SO, I invite you all to read my post on
http://forums.anandtech.com/messageview.cfm?catid=44&threadid=228954

It is detailed, but still in layman's terms.

Hope this is helping someone.

Ricky
DesignDawg
 
Wow, I almost started thinking I was smart! 🙂

I forgot where I posted my retort on these matters. The basic story is the Matrox does NOT work in the "normal" scheme for multiple displays in Windows. Is it better? Is it worse? Depends on who you ask. But, nVidia is letting Windows act in it's normal state in terms of multiple displays, instead of tricking Windows into thinking there's only one display (Matrox DH).

Lemme look for my original post. BRB, hopefully.

-SUO
 
"Wow, I almost started thinking I was smart!"

heh happens to all of us! hehe..

well I'll check it out..

EDIT saw it, now I've got questions!

here's my post at the other thread:

"just to clear some things up..

"You CAN turn off the CRT and watch a movie on the TV if you want, because, again, you are ONLY USING ONE DISPLAY when you do it that way. Starting to get it?"

are you talking about the Matrox G400? it would make sense if that's what you were talking about.

so the Matrox G400 is really only one video image split in two for different monitors? why is it that one monitor can go at higher res then? does the G450 change that?

also, what do you mean yuo can't run hardware openGL when running dual cards? are you saying it won't spread accross the monitors? or are you saying that yuo can't have it on 2 monitors with 2 video cards, NO MATTER WHAT?

"You can not view anything that requires overlay on the secondary monitor (TV, DVD)
In most cases, you can not PROPERLY use Direct3D with both monitors open."

what exactly does this mean? with a hardware decoder card, yuo can't run it on the 2nd monitor? does that direct3D thing mean that I can't run winamp visualizations across 2 windows with 2 seperate cards (which I can, so either they're not OpenGL, or Direct3D, or I'm screwed up).
 
I think I need to go back and do a lil research myself. But, this is what I understant thus far, ...

With Win98/98SE/and ME, I am under the impression that, in a multiple video card setup, all non-primary displays cannot properly show programs related to DirectX or that use any kind of non-standard windows or video media (like DVDs). These displays can only have standard windows like Explorer, Word, etc. So, typically, full-screen games coan be played on your primary display. You can have other programs running on the other displays, but you won't be able to interact with them. All of your input is directed at the primary display (game). In addition, no Windows automatically spanned all of the displays (ie, if I maximize a window, it will only maximize to one of the displays).

I am not sure if this case still exists for Win2K. In any event, it is not as significant in Win2K, because you can change your primary display on the fly. Still, no apps "naturally" spanned both displays.

NOW, Matrox came along with DH technology. I do not own nor have I ever used a Matrox DH card, so my facts may be skewed. To my knowledge, the Matrox card (G400, the first one) handled the multiple displays independently of Windows. All Windows sees is a single display adapter. Any spanning, cloning, multimedia capabilites performed by this card are solely done by Matrox's circuitry and drivers ... not Windows. This allows for such things as games spread over two screens and running apps like a DVD player, etc. on the second display. At one time, I thought I had read that Matrox DH may have been limited to having both displays of the same color depth, resolution, and refresh rate. Obviously, this isn't ideal unless both of your monitors are of the same size. From what I have been reading lately, those "limits" may no longer exist if they ever did. I dunno, and I really don't care.

Now, on to the MX. I understand that the MX TwinView cards have *two* RAMDACs (I think Matrox DH only has one). So, it is in essence two distinct video controllers as far as Windows is concerned. As thus, the card allows Windows to handle most/all of the multiple display processing. This may appear to be less ideal than Matrox's DH solution, but nVidia probably didn't have to put in as much effort to implement multiple displays. So, you just can't compare Matrox DH and TwinView without understanding what's really going on underneath. Who knows, nVidia could be ramping up TwinView drivers that meet and exceed Matrox DH's current capabilities. Just realize that these are two separate approaches.

-SUO
 
"As thus, the card allows Windows to handle most/all of the multiple display processing."

similar to what normal Dual card solutions do.

personally, I never had MS Flight Sim 2K (which runs on dual displays) to test out when I had my dual cards working (not on right now, becuase I tried installing a beta driver, and it screwed the whole thing up! stupid windows..)

BTW, I'm running Windows 98. all of my Winamp Visualizations CAN (rather COULD) spread accross my 2 monitors, one at 800X600 (primary, yeah I know it sucks), and the other at 640X480 (secondary, I think both at 60hz refresh rate).

Dual cards work fine I think with MS Flight Sim 2K (still I never tested it, because my array was down when I borrowed it from a friend), becuase it's not ONE 3D display spread across 2 displays, it's 2 different displays, each on 1 monitor. at least, that's how I took it.

maybe Anand should compare different Dual displays..

BTW, I was running a Voodoo 3 AGP, and Maxi Gamer Phoenix (with 3dfx Voodoo Banshee referrence drivers) as my primary and secondary video cards.
 
I hope you are proven wrong. NVIDIA and its customers have been touting DVD playback on a TV independent of the monitor. This requires overlay. There will be a crap load of returns if it turns out it cannot be done. Perhaps DirectX 8 is the fix if it is a limitation of the current Windows OS's.
 
BTW, my current multiple display configs are i810 AGP primary + Matrox Millennium PCI secondary and S3 Savage4 PCI primary + ATi Xpert 128 AGP secondary. The i810 system previous had an S3 ViRGE PCI card that had to be primary.

And yes, it appears that the MX TwinView acts more like a two-card solution than Matrox.

I don't know a thing about the TV-out side of the barn. I'm just not interested in that ... yet. 🙂

-SUO
 
Here's a quote from NVIDIA on its geforce2 mx Twinview page.

"Enthusiasts can watch DVDs on their televisions while working on their PCs"

It better only be a driver issue or I will be RMAing mine. That statement is why I bought that card. I am able to play Nocturne (game) on my TV while using my monitor just fine. I am NOT YET able to watch a DVD simultaneously while surfing the web or any monitor based tasks.... The DVD window shows up on the TV but it is blank.

 
Here's a quote from NVIDIA on its geforce2 mx Twinview page.

"Enthusiasts can watch DVDs on their televisions while working on their PCs"

It better only be a driver issue or I will be RMAing mine. That statement is why I bought that card. I am able to play Nocturne (game) on my TV while using my monitor just fine just no DVD simultaneously.

Gee Prodigy booted me offline AGAIN!!!!! That makes it 4 times now in the last hour. Can't wait for cable... sorry for the double.
 
Without having a morning cup of coffee, I would have to say that nVidia's statement is still correct. You can play a DVD on the TV and still *use* your computer at the same time.

How?

Well, if the TV is the *primary* display, it can do all of the nifty overall/DirectX special stuff. The secondary display can do all of the normal stuff with standard Windows (word processing, etc.). nVidia seems to claim that you can *use* your computer, but I don't know if they claimed that you can play games in conuntion with TV-out DVD or whatever. So, their claims may *exclude* playing a DVD on one display and a full-screen game on the other display. See the subtle difference there (using computer with DVD TV-out vs. playing game full-screen with TV-out DVD)?

Then again, I don't know how/why anyone would want to play a full-screen game AND watch a DVD at the same time. You humans must have far more advanced processors than my 1975 model.

Again, I haven't touched the TV-out side of the world, so I may be full of crap.

-SUO
 
you're not full of crap, yuo've posed a valid question that appears that none of us can answer properly. at least you're throwing up hypothesis for us to ponder!
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

TRENDING THREADS

Back
Top