Illegal immigrates and people who play by the rules

[ArizonaSteve]

I'm personally in favor of forced labor camps for illegal immigrants.

 

[Oyeve]

i guess i'm a dreamer... i believe in a world with open borders, and governed by natural law, and i refuse to "move backwards" in my thinking..

I guess im a dreamer too.

 

[Texashiker]

i guess i'm a dreamer... i believe in a world with open borders, and governed by natural law, and i refuse to "move backwards" in my thinking..

Ok dreamer, how do you feel about gangs beheading people and dumping the bodies in public?

How do you feel about drug gangs killing police and government officials?

Lets just open the borders and let all the drug lords and gangs in.

What about radical islam? Lets allow as many muslims in your area as are needed to get sharia law enforced.

 

[michal1980]

This whole mess is only because our immigration policy has been a complete failure for decades. It should had been fixed in the 80s when Reagan granted amnesty to millions. But instead we kept up the broken system and now we have another 12-16 million that need to be granted amnesty.

I say need because it is simply unrealistic to deport a population the size of 3 minnesotas. They need to fix the path to citizenship so it is easier to attain. Why are educated people waiting years to become a citizen? If it takes them that long why would an uneducated person wait at all? It makes more economic sense to live underground and not even try to become a citizen.

Amnesty is the side effect of a disasterous policy.

But the current bill doubles down on disastrous policy.

 

[boomerang]

The Democrats, progressives, and unions don't care.

Dont care? Maybe. More likely is that they don't understand. They're never concerned about the unintended consequences of their actions. What matters is the intention.

 

[Lithium381]

I don't care if they're here illegally. Let them apply for citizenship and wait in line like everyone else. I went through the the proccess with my wife. We're still in the process.... It's difficult and expensive to do and we're both college educated with no criminal history other than a few traffic violations between us. . .

They're here to better their lives and care for their familes. I don't fault them for that so long as they're keeping their heads down and working honestly. I'm in favor of work permits for them... at least get them to pay taxes.. Fck the guys here doing crime though....

 

[Genx87]

But the current bill doubles down on disastrous policy.

I havent read the bill. Can you let me know what parts it is doubling down on?

 

[DominionSeraph]

If the government hands out citizenship to everyone who can sneak across the border, of what value is it?

Do we put huge nets in the air to stop birds and flying insects from crossing the border? Nets across rivers to stop fish? Huge walls to stop plants from ejaculating over the border and impregnating our plant wimminz? Fences to stop other land animals?

Political geographical boundaries are not moral ones. You know that the Earth doesn't actually look like this, right?

Take away the cloud cover this is North/Central America:

Ooh, look at all those criminal lines!

Immigration is just the migration of a land animal. That administrators like to have some control over movements across national boundaries doesn't make migration outside this some great act against nature.
I live in Connecticut. I get along fine here. I've lived in Illinois. I got along fine there. I visited Wisconsin. Ok, so I was banned from driving there for three years after getting caught doing 90 down a back road by only the light of the full moon. I lived in Sicily. I got along fine there. I've visited the Italian mainland, France, and England. Got along fine there. Lived in Virginia. Got along fine there. Lived in Florida. Got along fine there. Visited Kentucky, Tennessee, and Indiana one Memorial Day weekend. (Caught the Indy 500 on a lark) Got along fine there. I visit Arizona a couple times a year. I get along fine there. New York, Rhode Island, Massachusetts, Vermont. I get along fine there.

If I go up to a wilderness area by the Canadian border and walk across, am I now inhuman? Does that place the Mark of the Beast on me? Does it make me completely unfit to live in Canadian society?

It changes nothing about me, and cheapens nothing about anyone there.
So get over it.

 

[boomerang]

Immigration is just the migration of a land animal. That administrators like to have some control over movements across national boundaries doesn't make migration outside this some great act against nature. I live in Connecticut. I get along fine here. I've lived in Illinois. I got along fine there. I visited Wisconsin. Ok, so I was banned from driving there for three years after getting caught doing 90 down a back road by only the light of the full moon. I lived in Sicily. I got along fine there. I've visited the Italian mainland, France, and England. Got along fine there. Lived in Virginia. Got along fine there. Lived in Florida. Got along fine there. Visited Kentucky, Tennessee, and Indiana one Memorial Day weekend. (Caught the Indy 500 on a lark) Got along fine there. I visit Arizona a couple times a year. I get along fine there. New York, Rhode Island, Massachusetts, Vermont. I get along fine there. If I go up to a wilderness area by the Canadian border and walk across, am I now inhuman? Does that place the Mark of the Beast on me? Does it make me completely unfit to live in Canadian society? It changes nothing about me, and cheapens nothing about anyone there.

You're being more civil than is typical so I will treat you the same.

In how many of those nations did you receive food, clothing, shelter and healthcare at no cost to you? How many of those nations allowed you into the country without checking the paperwork that gave you passage? How many allowed you to bring your children into the country and enroll them in their educational system? The list goes on and on.

The world does not exist as you perceive it. You dream of a future that does not exist at this point in time and cannot because we are still killing each other over tennis shoes or the god we worship.

Opening our borders, granting amnesty, providing paths to citizenship and the like is just skirting around the underlying problems and won't accomplish what you desire. You don't achieve the results of a ten step plan by ignoring steps 2 through 8.

 

[Texashiker]

Do we put huge nets in the air to stop birds and flying insects from crossing the border? Nets across rivers to stop fish? Huge walls to stop plants from ejaculating over the border and impregnating our plant wimminz? Fences to stop other land animals?

It changes nothing about me, and cheapens nothing about anyone there.
So get over it.

How many fish, birds and other animals use illegal drugs, kill family members in the name of honor, and kill others in the name of religion?

I have yet to see a bird plant a bomb at a marathon, or fly a couple of planes into a building.

My chickens do not go around putting up signs saying this is a sharia controlled zone.

My rabbits do not sale crack to school kids.

I can not remember the last time my brothers goats used a chainsaw to kill rival gang members.

My brothers cattle have never done a drive by shooting.

So get over it.

 

[Svnla]

News flash. EVERY sovereign country on Earth has the right to control its border and the flow of people (in and out). Every single one of them. No exception. Period.

There is no such thing as open borders anywhere on Earth. Please provide one, just one, name of a sovereign country that will let you sneak in ILLEGALLY, fly your own flag, demand your own language and culture in said country, become its citizen, and so on. There is no such country.

 

[Jaskalas]

Immigration is just the migration of a land animal.

So call animal control to "put them down"?

Strays aren't welcomed in many places.

 

[sunzt]

Ok hiker,

What do you propose we do with the 11-12 M of them here? Status quo? Hunt and deport? Make it illegal to hire them (like it already is)?

Any option would push illegals (even the productive and educated ones) into underground activities, being more alienated, and being more vulnerable to gang/violent activities.

 

[poofyhairguy]

Really? I see Republicans voting for it.

The Republican Party is at a crossroads. Their only chance to continue a social conservative platform is by shifting focus to Hispanics.

 

[Texashiker]

Ok hiker,

What do you propose we do with the 11-12 M of them here? Status quo? Hunt and deport? Make it illegal to hire them (like it already is)?

To grant amnesty would be an insult to everyone who has gone through the system.

My only solution is to enforce the current laws.


DominionSeraph, I think my chickens are trying to sale enough eggs to buy some AKs. There might be a turf war going on between my chickens and the rat snakes.

 

[DominionSeraph]

How many fish, birds and other animals use illegal drugs, kill family members in the name of honor, and kill others in the name of religion?

What does that have to do with immigration?
You're conflating policing interpersonal interactions with policing movement. And you're also showing yourself to be very racist.

I'm a citizen by right of birth. Does that mean I get to kill people? No. Wow, lookie that: I'm in this country, I never passed a citizenship exam, and somehow the system still has a say over me! Gee, how ever do they do that?

I have yet to see a bird plant a bomb at a marathon, or fly a couple of planes into a building.

9/11 hijackers entered the country legally.
Boston bombers entered the country legally.

My chickens do not go around putting up signs saying this is a sharia controlled zone.

No, but your neighbors put signs saying, "Whites only," on the fronts of their businesses. And they were made to take them down and forbidden to enforce such a rule. Gee, how ever did we manage that without forbidding whites entry at the border to make sure we kept those nasty racists out?

 

[sunzt]

To grant amnesty would be an insult to everyone who has gone through the system.

My only solution is to enforce the current laws.

So more of the same or hunt and deport is what you're saying. Yeah, welcome to a worse outcome.

 

[Texashiker]

What does that have to do with immigration?
You're conflating policing interpersonal interactions with policing movement.

According to you animal migration is no different then people migrating.

The problem is, people bring their culture and their problems with them.

And you're also showing yourself to be very racist.

I am not racist.

your neighbors put signs saying, "Whites only,"

That is a lie.


DominionSeraph, rather than debating the issues you are attempting to derail this thread with accusations of racism.

 

[woolfe9998]

I am against the government bowing to the will of a minority.

Is there something wrong with our current immigration laws?

Or, are the laws being changed because so many people are ignoring the law?

Lets use your number of around 11 million illegal immigrants. When you have 11 million people who stand up and say they will not follow our laws, what is the government supposed to do? We can not arrest 11 million people, we can not deport 11 million people.

The easiest solution is to change the law and appease those 11 million criminals.

Bear in mind that everyone who smokes weed or exceeds the speed limit is a "criminal."

Not all "crimes" are equal in how they are morally appraised by different people. Virtually everyone has one or more categories of crime that they tend tolerate more than others.

This boils down to a disagreement about the moral underpinning of the particular crime of crossing the border illegally (over-staying a visa is not a crime.) The way I view it, people naturally migrate to achieve better economic opportunity for themselves and their kids, and have done so since time immemorial, sometimes legally, other times illegally. I'm not saying I don't fault them for breaking the law. I'm saying I understand it.

I don't think we can economically afford to allow millions more in. However, that is entirely based on my assessment of the economic impact. It's not based on animus toward the illegals.

 

[Texashiker]

The way I view it, people naturally migrate to achieve better economic opportunity for themselves and their kids, and have done so since time immemorial, sometimes legally, other times illegally. I'm not saying I don't fault them for breaking the law. I'm saying I understand it.

I don't think we can economically afford to allow millions more in. However, that is entirely based on my assessment of the economic impact. It's not based on animus toward the illegals.

There is nothing wrong with people wishing to better their lives, and wanting to a better lives for their children.

I feel that we, the tax payers, are being punished for the failed policies of Central American governments. If life was good in Central America nobody would want to leave.

 

[justoh]

I don't care if they're here illegally. Let them apply for citizenship and wait in line like everyone else. I went through the the proccess with my wife. We're still in the process.... It's difficult and expensive to do

If by difficult and expensive you mean easy and relatively cheap (few hundred bucks). Also, people here illegally cannot apply for permanent residency...

 

[Orignal Earl]

Ok dreamer, how do you feel about gangs beheading people and dumping the bodies in public?

How do you feel about drug gangs killing police and government officials?

Lets just open the borders and let all the drug lords and gangs in.

What about radical islam? Lets allow as many muslims in your area as are needed to get sharia law enforced.

Maybe a fence around Texas might help save the rest of the US from the crazies and their Christian laws

Texas Man Gets Death Penalty for Beheading 3 Kids Under the Age of Four

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-504083_162-20012170-504083.html

Texas DA Killed Two Months After Deputy Shot Dead; Aryan Brotherhood Probed in Killings

http://www.democracynow.org/2013/4/1/texas_da_killed_two_months_after

Texas abortion bill fails to pass after 11-hour Wendy Davis filibuster

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2013/jun/26/texas-abortion-vote-defeated-deadline-wendy-davis

 

[zsdersw]

More often than not, Texas is an example of what to avoid instead of what to adopt.

 

[Incorruptible]

Maybe a fence around Texas might help save the rest of the US from the crazies and their Christian laws

Texas Man Gets Death Penalty for Beheading 3 Kids Under the Age of Four

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-504083_162-20012170-504083.html

Texas DA Killed Two Months After Deputy Shot Dead; Aryan Brotherhood Probed in Killings

http://www.democracynow.org/2013/4/1/texas_da_killed_two_months_after

Texas abortion bill fails to pass after 11-hour Wendy Davis filibuster

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2013/jun/26/texas-abortion-vote-defeated-deadline-wendy-davis

The resident jihadist has arrived.

 

[nehalem256]

Maybe a fence around Texas might help save the rest of the US from the crazies and their Christian laws

Texas Man Gets Death Penalty for Beheading 3 Kids Under the Age of Four

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-504083_162-20012170-504083.html

Texas DA Killed Two Months After Deputy Shot Dead; Aryan Brotherhood Probed in Killings

http://www.democracynow.org/2013/4/1/texas_da_killed_two_months_after

Texas abortion bill fails to pass after 11-hour Wendy Davis filibuster

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2013/jun/26/texas-abortion-vote-defeated-deadline-wendy-davis

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sandy_Hook_Elementary_School_shooting

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2012_Aurora_shooting

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clackamas_Town_Center_shooting

All from liberal states in the last year off the top of my head. Maybe you should be focusing on your own crazies?