IF Miers withdraws nomination

[filterxg]

I think most people agree Bush messed this one up, and is on track for a very bad year (Roberts nomination being the lone bright spot). As I said Miers in a previous post is not the constitutional intellectual the moderates wanted, nor the documentable constructionist the far right wanted. Of course nobody Bush picked would politcally satisfy the Dems (though I'm sure they got some big smiles out of this one).

Anyway with the furor out of the right there is growing speculation that the shy Miers way want to withdraw...IF Bush lets her. Question I have is would Miers withdrawing be a good thing or a bad thing for Bush?

I don't think it is very clear. The moderate wing of the party along with liberals would probably look at as a bad thing. BUT it would be a chance to reenergize the far right, if that is something he would want to do.

Either way I as a republican wouldn't mind the dems getting enough power to at least have an agenda (one wing of congress would do nicely). Its plainly obvious that one party shouldn't have all the power.

 

[glenn1]

I'd say that to answer that question, you'd need to know who the replacement nominee would be. I don't think the average American really wants to see another borking of a SCOTUS nominee though. That leaves the fillibuster. And that weapon would begin to lose its effectiveness after a couple of uses anyway. Bush could in theory keep on sending up appelate justices with a strong conservative pedigree until the voters got fed up and one got through. This isn't to say that I'd want a Clarence Thomas clone to be seated on the court, but the path is there for just such a person at some point should the President choose that option. If he could find another candidate like Roberts I think he'd have a home run, but I don't trust some of the potential uber-conservative candidates to not come out of the hearings looking like a Klingon.

 

[zendari]

Good, so he can pick a real judge and send him/her through.

 

[Rainsford]

Originally posted by: zendari
Good, so he can pick a real judge and send him/her through.

Well, that's good for us...but not for Bush. His selling point is his strong leadership style where he doesn't admit mistakes. I'm not being sarcastic here, that's what his supporters seem to like about him. While I would admire him deciding he made a mistake, I think many of his supporters (already pissed at him for a bad nomination, whatever their reasons) wouldn't like him flip-flopping on the issue (and we all know how they feel about flip-flopping). He's come out way too strongly in his support of Miers to back off without looking weak.

 

[zendari]

Originally posted by: Rainsford

Originally posted by: zendari
Good, so he can pick a real judge and send him/her through.

Well, that's good for us...but not for Bush. His selling point is his strong leadership style where he doesn't admit mistakes. I'm not being sarcastic here, that's what his supporters seem to like about him. While I would admire him deciding he made a mistake, I think many of his supporters (already pissed at him for a bad nomination, whatever their reasons) wouldn't like him flip-flopping on the issue (and we all know how they feel about flip-flopping). He's come out way too strongly in his support of Miers to back off without looking weak.

I can only speak for myself, but its my guess that his base won't really care about Miers if he withdraws her and puts up a real conservative like Luttig in her place.

 

[nageov3t]

if he withdraws the nomination or the nomination is defeated in congress, his lame duck status is cemented and whatever remaining control he has over the Republicans in the senate is gone.

 

[Rainsford]

Originally posted by: zendari

Originally posted by: Rainsford

Originally posted by: zendari
Good, so he can pick a real judge and send him/her through.

Well, that's good for us...but not for Bush. His selling point is his strong leadership style where he doesn't admit mistakes. I'm not being sarcastic here, that's what his supporters seem to like about him. While I would admire him deciding he made a mistake, I think many of his supporters (already pissed at him for a bad nomination, whatever their reasons) wouldn't like him flip-flopping on the issue (and we all know how they feel about flip-flopping). He's come out way too strongly in his support of Miers to back off without looking weak.

I can only speak for myself, but its my guess that his base won't really care about Miers if he withdraws her and puts up a real conservative like Luttig in her place.

I can see the point there I suppose. On the other hand, people who were happy he's nominated two reasonably moderate people will not be too happy.

 

[ShadesOfGrey]

Originally posted by: loki8481
if he withdraws the nomination or the nomination is defeated in congress, his lame duck status is cemented and whatever remaining control he has over the Republicans in the senate is gone.

Not in the least. I think that is at best a wishful thinking scenario on your part. If Miers is defeated or is withdrawn(Bush would never do it but she might) then you can bet that the GOP would rally around the even more Conservative pick that would follow. BTW, this chant by those of you on the left that Bush is a lame duck with more than 3 years left is laughable. His agenda will only strengthen when the GOP makes it's gains in '06.

 

[nageov3t]

Originally posted by: ShadesOfGrey

Originally posted by: loki8481
if he withdraws the nomination or the nomination is defeated in congress, his lame duck status is cemented and whatever remaining control he has over the Republicans in the senate is gone.

Not in the least. I think that is at best a wishful thinking scenario on your part. If Miers is defeated or is withdrawn(Bush would never do it but she might) then you can bet that the GOP would rally around the even more Conservative pick that would follow. BTW, this chant by those of you on the left that Bush is a lame duck with more than 3 years left is laughable. His agenda will only strengthen when the GOP makes it's gains in '06.

since when am I on the left? lol

anyways, if he can't get the republicans in the senate to rally around this supreme court nominee, I fail to see how he'll get them to rally around any other piece of legislation he wants to push through congress. I mean, how's Social Security reform going?

 

[ShadesOfGrey]

Originally posted by: loki8481

Originally posted by: ShadesOfGrey

Originally posted by: loki8481
if he withdraws the nomination or the nomination is defeated in congress, his lame duck status is cemented and whatever remaining control he has over the Republicans in the senate is gone.

Not in the least. I think that is at best a wishful thinking scenario on your part. If Miers is defeated or is withdrawn(Bush would never do it but she might) then you can bet that the GOP would rally around the even more Conservative pick that would follow. BTW, this chant by those of you on the left that Bush is a lame duck with more than 3 years left is laughable. His agenda will only strengthen when the GOP makes it's gains in '06.

since when am I on the left? lol

anyways, if he can't get the republicans in the senate to rally around this supreme court nominee, I fail to see how he'll get them to rally around any other piece of legislation he wants to push through congress. I mean, how's Social Security reform going?

So you are saying you are on the right?

This nominee presents problems for some on the right because she is an "unknown" and we Conservatives have been burned in the past by these sorts of judges. Now if this nominee was defeated or withdrew, you can bet your life that Bush will go with someone the GOP will want to fight for - which means a Brown, Luttig, or other known quantity Conservative.

Social Security is more complex than you are trying to make it. It's not a party line - ram it through item, but you knew that.

 

[OneOfTheseDays]

conservatives don't just want a judge that will agree with their viewpoints. they are looking for a judge with the conviction and determination to overturn Roe v. Wade and make massive changes to the court system.

 

[smack Down]

Originally posted by: ShadesOfGrey

Originally posted by: loki8481
if he withdraws the nomination or the nomination is defeated in congress, his lame duck status is cemented and whatever remaining control he has over the Republicans in the senate is gone.

Not in the least. I think that is at best a wishful thinking scenario on your part. If Miers is defeated or is withdrawn(Bush would never do it but she might) then you can bet that the GOP would rally around the even more Conservative pick that would follow. BTW, this chant by those of you on the left that Bush is a lame duck with more than 3 years left is laughable. His agenda will only strengthen when the GOP makes it's gains in '06.

Republicians defeating Miers would give democrats a hell a lot of cover to block wh ever came up next.

 

[ShadesOfGrey]

Originally posted by: smack Down

Originally posted by: ShadesOfGrey

Originally posted by: loki8481
if he withdraws the nomination or the nomination is defeated in congress, his lame duck status is cemented and whatever remaining control he has over the Republicans in the senate is gone.

Not in the least. I think that is at best a wishful thinking scenario on your part. If Miers is defeated or is withdrawn(Bush would never do it but she might) then you can bet that the GOP would rally around the even more Conservative pick that would follow. BTW, this chant by those of you on the left that Bush is a lame duck with more than 3 years left is laughable. His agenda will only strengthen when the GOP makes it's gains in '06.

Republicians defeating Miers would give democrats a hell a lot of cover to block wh ever came up next.

Do you think they'd filibuster? If not then, then the Conservatives "win" and if they do filibuster, the Constitutional option would be enacted and the judge will be confirmed.

 

[Aegeon]

Originally posted by: ShadesOfGrey
Do you think they'd filibuster? If not then, then the Conservatives "win" and if they do filibuster, the Constitutional option would be enacted and the judge will be confirmed.

I sincerely doubt enough Republicans would have the guts to enact the nuclear option under those circumstances and given the current political enviroment. Such a situation would strongly support any Democratic allegation that Bush lacks sufficient judgement to pick an acceptable Supreme Court justice nominee. Keep in mind that a bunch of Republican Senators are facing election reelection in the relatively near future in either "blue states" or at least states without a solid conservative majority, they have to worry considerably about how the general public perceives the situation.

 

[ntdz]

Bad for Bush, but good for people like me who hate her.

 

[arsbanned]

Originally posted by: ShadesOfGrey

Originally posted by: loki8481
if he withdraws the nomination or the nomination is defeated in congress, his lame duck status is cemented and whatever remaining control he has over the Republicans in the senate is gone.

Not in the least. I think that is at best a wishful thinking scenario on your part. If Miers is defeated or is withdrawn(Bush would never do it but she might) then you can bet that the GOP would rally around the even more Conservative pick that would follow. BTW, this chant by those of you on the left that Bush is a lame duck with more than 3 years left is laughable. His agenda will only strengthen when the GOP makes it's gains in '06.

You can bet I'll be dragging this out to slap you with after the 06 elections if it goes the other way. 😀

 

[Thump553]

I think your assumption that most of the country thinks he made a mistake with this nomination is false.

I also think that the "conservatives" who are bemoaning this nomination are either clueless or crying alligator tears. What they are complaining about, basically, is that Bush sandbagged them by not nominating a candidate with a known agenda. If anyone thinks that Bush has a secret plan to put a "liberal" on the Supreme Court, I have a bridge in Brooklyn to sell you. Frankly, my concern is the exact opposite-does this candidate have extremist Neanderthal views that are not known, and will not be disclosed, due to the now accepted total evasiveness of candidates in their Congressional hearings.

 

[zendari]

Originally posted by: Thump553
I think your assumption that most of the country thinks he made a mistake with this nomination is false.

I also think that the "conservatives" who are bemoaning this nomination are either clueless or crying alligator tears. What they are complaining about, basically, is that Bush sandbagged them by not nominating a candidate with a known agenda. If anyone thinks that Bush has a secret plan to put a "liberal" on the Supreme Court, I have a bridge in Brooklyn to sell you. Frankly, my concern is the exact opposite-does this candidate have extremist Neanderthal views that are not known, and will not be disclosed, due to the now accepted total evasiveness of candidates in their Congressional hearings.

After Bork you just can't be honest at the confirmation hearings anymore. Of course these hearings didn't exist in the first place until 1916.

The filibuster is complete crap. Either you consent or don't consent.

Originally posted by: ShadesOfGrey

Do you think they'd filibuster? If not then, then the Conservatives "win" and if they do filibuster, the Constitutional option would be enacted and the judge will be confirmed.

Na, they wouldn't win, thanks to RINOS like Snowe and Collins. Harry Reid and the Democratic leadership is a hell of a lot better than Frist and company. They properly keep the Dems in line.