If Microsoft was smart

tynopik

Diamond Member
Aug 10, 2004
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include in the OEM contract "no 3rd party apps that the user didn't specifically request"

a huge reason windows has such a bad rep is all the crapware that vendors get paid to install onto systems

a clean install of windows is pretty slick and very responsive, but after dell (or gateway or hp) gets done with it, it feels like 386

vendors don't like it, but they can't help it, because if they don't somebody else will come along and sell the same system for $50 less.

This needs a fiat from a higher authority to force all vendors to play by the same rules

Apple doesn't have this problem because they directly control all sales

If MS values the future of their company, they need to do something to improve the user's experience

of course MS got their hand slapped for something similar when they tried to force all OEMs to include IE on the desktop and fell foul of anti-trust regs, but i think they could get enough support and pull this off without setting off any red flags
 

Exterous

Super Moderator
Jun 20, 2006
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Microsoft can't pull anything off without raising a red flag since are always looking for things to bash them about. This would definitely get them in hot water

Side note: I wonder how much money OEMs get for putting that software on computers. I'll bet its a lot
 

Sqube

Diamond Member
Dec 23, 2004
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MS would get killed for that. More importantly, all that bloatware is money to the OEMs... why the fuck would they ever agree to something that gets them less money?

All you can do is hope that the endless bitching about bloatware will eventually lead to the OEMs stopping. Dell (IIRC) already has.
 

mundane

Diamond Member
Jun 7, 2002
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Originally posted by: Exterous
Microsoft can't pull anything off without raising a red flag since are always looking for things to bash them about. This would definitely get them in hot water

Side note: I wonder how much money OEMs get for putting that software on computers. I'll bet its a lot
Dell gets somewhere up to $60.
 

GTaudiophile

Lifer
Oct 24, 2000
29,776
29
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Just do what I do:

Buy laptop
Receive laptop
Plug in laptop
Insert Windows Installation CD
Turn on laptop
Boot from CD
Delete Partitions
Format
Install
Never see HP/DELL/Sony... BS
 

tynopik

Diamond Member
Aug 10, 2004
5,244
498
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> More importantly, all that bloatware is money to the OEMs... why the fuck would they ever agree to something that gets them less money?

because in the end they don't actually get more money

everybody does it so they have to use the money to lower the price or not be competitive

> Dell gets somewhere up to $60.

they get $60 but then they basically give it right back to the consumer by lowering the price, so they don't get anything out of it
 

tynopik

Diamond Member
Aug 10, 2004
5,244
498
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Originally posted by: GTaudiophile
Just do what I do:

Buy laptop
Receive laptop
Plug in laptop
Insert Windows Installation CD
Turn on laptop
Boot from CD
Delete Partitions
Format
Install
Never see HP/DELL/Sony... BS

yes, that's what i do to

but that's not the point

millions upon millions of consumers DON'T (and SHOULDN'T have to) do that, so they're only experience with windows is PAIN

this is not a good for Microsoft in the long run
 

ElFenix

Elite Member
Super Moderator
Mar 20, 2000
102,265
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i wouldn't be surprised if crapware was responsible for most, if not all, of the profit on a majority of systems. certainly all the ones with short warranties.
 

Sqube

Diamond Member
Dec 23, 2004
3,078
1
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Originally posted by: tynopik
> More importantly, all that bloatware is money to the OEMs... why the fuck would they ever agree to something that gets them less money?

because in the end they don't actually get more money

everybody does it so they have to use the money to lower the price or not be competitive

> Dell gets somewhere up to $60.

they get $60 but then they basically give it right back to the consumer by lowering the price, so they don't get anything out of it
That's $60 that they wouldn't have been able to lower the price before. The OEMs make their money on mass sales, not per-rig profit. The end result is, even if they turn around and give that money back to the consumer, they still end up ahead.

If they weren't ending up ahead on bloatware, they wouldn't include it. They're corporations, and they exist to make profit.
 
Jun 19, 2004
10,861
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Originally posted by: Sqube
MS would get killed for that. More importantly, all that bloatware is money to the OEMs... why the fuck would they ever agree to something that gets them less money?

All you can do is hope that the endless bitching about bloatware will eventually lead to the OEMs stopping. Dell (IIRC) already has.

Yeah, but they charge the end user extra to NOT put that crap on.

I tell my customers buying prebuilt PC's this.....getting a Dell, HP, etc. is like buying a new car from the dealer and having as many logos on it as a Nascar stock car. You essentially pay money for the advertising when if you ask me it should be the other way around.

Granted, I know that the pre loaded advertising MAY lower the cost somewhat of the PC to the end user, but it cant be by that much.


 

Sqube

Diamond Member
Dec 23, 2004
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Originally posted by: MisterJackson
Originally posted by: Sqube
MS would get killed for that. More importantly, all that bloatware is money to the OEMs... why the fuck would they ever agree to something that gets them less money?

All you can do is hope that the endless bitching about bloatware will eventually lead to the OEMs stopping. Dell (IIRC) already has.

Yeah, but they charge the end user extra to NOT put that crap on.

I tell my customers buying prebuilt PC's this.....getting a Dell, HP, etc. is like buying a new car from the dealer and having as many logos on it as a Nascar stock car. You essentially pay money for the advertising when if you ask me it should be the other way around.

Granted, I know that the pre loaded advertising MAY lower the cost somewhat of the PC to the end user, but it cant be by that much.
It doesn't have to be that much. Since Dell et al. aren't boutique shops, they have to make their money on quantity. A couple bucks here and there adds up when you're talking about the numbers that these companies must be pushing on a yearly basis.
 

tynopik

Diamond Member
Aug 10, 2004
5,244
498
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Originally posted by: Sqube
MS would get killed for that.
well they could still have options like

"Include Dell Productivity Bundle - FREE!!!1"
"Add Free HP Media Tools!"

MS wouldn't be saying they couldn't install it, just that the consumer would have to opt-in first
 

Sqube

Diamond Member
Dec 23, 2004
3,078
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Originally posted by: tynopik
Originally posted by: Sqube
MS would get killed for that.
well they could still have options like

"Include Dell Productivity Bundle - FREE!!!1"
"Add Free HP Media Tools!"

MS wouldn't be saying they couldn't install it, just that the consumer would have to opt-in first
Actually, I wouldn't mind an opt-in bundle at all. The end result might even be a superior product since you would have to convince people to choose it instead of dumping it in there.

Good idea.

Originally posted by: Modelworks
So you want MS to become Apple ?
MS could never become Apple. Apple is Apple because they control hardware and software from beginning to end.
 

FlashG

Platinum Member
Dec 23, 1999
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If the OS disk that you paid for from DELL is complete. Than why couldn?t you just do an ?F disc? and start from scratch?
 

tynopik

Diamond Member
Aug 10, 2004
5,244
498
126
Originally posted by: Sqube
It doesn't have to be that much. Since Dell et al. aren't boutique shops, they have to make their money on quantity. A couple bucks here and there adds up when you're talking about the numbers that these companies must be pushing on a yearly basis.
but see they don't actually get that money, they have to use it to lower prices to stay competitive

if NOBODY could get that money, it wouldn't affect vendor bottomlines much at all since they would all be on a level playing field

yes, it would increase PC prices slightly, but i think in the end everyone will be happier (less support calls, better experience, less MS hate)
 

tynopik

Diamond Member
Aug 10, 2004
5,244
498
126
Originally posted by: Modelworks
So you want MS to become Apple ?

every once in a while apple has a good idea

not bundling crapware to reduce the price is one of them
 

tynopik

Diamond Member
Aug 10, 2004
5,244
498
126
Originally posted by: FlashG
If the OS disk that you paid for from DELL is complete. Than why couldn?t you just do an ?F disc? and start from scratch?

the point isn't what you and me would do

the point is what the unwashed masses would do, and what THEIR experience is

it is in Microsoft's best interest to make using Windows as pleasant an experience as possible
 

legoman666

Diamond Member
Dec 18, 2003
3,629
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Originally posted by: tynopik
Originally posted by: GTaudiophile
Just do what I do:

Buy laptop
Receive laptop
Plug in laptop
Insert Windows Installation CD
Turn on laptop
Boot from CD
Delete Partitions
Format
Install
Never see HP/DELL/Sony... BS
basically what I did also. I bought a Thinkpad.
Arrived in the mail
fired it up to make sure it worked
vista = gross
popped in XP cd
rebooted
installed xp
smooth sailing

My sister got an HP laptop:
arrived in mail
fired it up
completely bloated and bogged down with crapware
spend 3 hours removing all of the extra crap
good as new

I shouldve just reinstalled the OS but the damn thing didn't come with an install disc.
 

Soundmanred

Lifer
Oct 26, 2006
10,784
6
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Some of the OEMs ARE opting out of preinstalled software.
Dells Vostro systems for one.
I always do a fresh install on a brand new PC, but alot of people don't know how. I uninstalled a ton of crap from a HP bought at Circuit City the other day, and it took me quite some time.
 

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