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if anything actually reached absolute zero....

Lithium381

Lithium381

Lifer
if something reached absolute zero, would it simply cease to exist....since there woudln't be a feild of energy moving around, the electrons would somehow fall into the protons and cancel out, leaving nothing! right?


thoughts / theorys?
 
Nope

There can never be zero motion.

Heisenberg uncertainty dont-cha-know

If there was zero motion, then both momentum and position could be known at the same time. That's a no-no
 
im in ap chem in high school. i dunno if this is right or not, its just my thoughts about it.
the energy fields in the atom would not cease to exist. any kinetic motion, however, would in theory stop since absolute zero means no energy whatsoever. electrons would actually have a defined position rather than a probability orbital.

with gases and absolute zero.. well they'd cease to exist, since gas compresses as it loses heat. at 0 K, a gas would have 0 volume so yeah it wouldnt exist. absolute zero is a funny thing. i dont think we'll hit it any time soon, but hey, anything is possible.

quoting from above! - Heisenberg uncertainty dont-cha-know

If there was zero motion, then both momentum and position could be known at the same time. That's a no-no - endquote

well, thats for your standard atom with kinetic energy 🙂 with no energy, momentum would be 0 and therefore position could be known, right?
 
Originally posted by: MacBaine
Originally posted by: moshquerade
nothing from nothing
leaves nothing
Click to expand...

Care to elaborate?
Click to expand...

Nothin' from nothin' leaves nothin'
You gotta have somethin'
If you wanna be with me
Nothin' from nothin' leaves nothin'
You gotta have somethin'
If you wanna be with me

I'm not tryin' to be your hero
'Cause that zero is too cold for me, Brrr
I'm not tryin' to be your highness
'Cause that minus is too low to see, yeah
 
Originally posted by: moshquerade
Originally posted by: MacBaine
Originally posted by: moshquerade
nothing from nothing
leaves nothing
Click to expand...

Care to elaborate?
Click to expand...

Nothin' from nothin' leaves nothin'
You gotta have somethin'
If you wanna be with me
Nothin' from nothin' leaves nothin'
You gotta have somethin'
If you wanna be with me

I'm not tryin' to be your hero
'Cause that zero is too cold for me, Brrr
I'm not tryin' to be your highness
'Cause that minus is too low to see, yeah
Click to expand...

So another useless post, correct?
 
Originally posted by: Fenixgoon
im in ap chem in high school. i dunno if this is right or not, its just my thoughts about it.
the energy fields in the atom would not cease to exist. any kinetic motion, however, would in theory stop since absolute zero means no energy whatsoever. electrons would actually have a defined position rather than a probability orbital.

with gases and absolute zero.. well they'd cease to exist, since gas compresses as it loses heat. at 0 K, a gas would have 0 volume so yeah it wouldnt exist. absolute zero is a funny thing. i dont think we'll hit it any time soon, but hey, anything is possible.

quoting from above! - Heisenberg uncertainty dont-cha-know

If there was zero motion, then both momentum and position could be known at the same time. That's a no-no - endquote

well, thats for your standard atom with kinetic energy 🙂 with no energy, momentum would be 0 and therefore position could be known, right?
Click to expand...


It certainly sounds that way, however uncertainty is a fundamental property of elemental particles. While it might be possible to remove all thermal energy (lets say this is so for sake of argument), the vacuum of space still contains energy.

a little bit on zero point energy

Particles never rest completely
 
Originally posted by: WinstonSmith


It certainly sounds that way, however uncertainty is a fundamental property of elemental particles. While it might be possible to remove all thermal energy (lets say this is so for sake of argument), the vacuum of space still contains energy.

a little bit on zero point energy

Particles never rest completely
Click to expand...

wow, that was enlightening, though i don't understand it, it was a nice read!
 
Absolute zero has been reached. It doesn't require zero energy. Temperature is a measure of the average KINETIC energy of a particle. Something can have no kinetic energy and have energy (potential for example).

What they do is cool something down via normal means to a very cold temperature and then they inject the super cold particles into a vacuum chamber. In this chamber there are six lasers which converge at a single point. They are set up so that one fires from the +z, one from the -z, +x, -x, +y, and -y directions at a frequency slightly redshifted from the atom's natural absorbtion frequency. If the atom moves in say, the positive x direction, it the light doppler shifts from the atom's point of view towards it's natural absorbtion frequency. As a result it absorbs energy from the positive x laser and has momentum imparted which directs it back away from that laser and towards the centre of the trap. It doesn't take long for the few atoms to become still.

Gas would not go to zero volume. The atoms would still be there.
 
Originally posted by: silverpig
Absolute zero has been reached. It doesn't require zero energy. Temperature is a measure of the average KINETIC energy of a particle.
Click to expand...

Assuming that you are talking scales of longer than a planck second, the electrons of the atom can't be at rest. Their average kinetic energy should always be some non-zero amount, or we could determine both their location, and their momentum (0). If their momentum is ever 0, we will always be able to tell where they are, because they aren't moving.

 
Originally posted by: Fudssa
Another "Is 1 = 0.9999......" post in the making.
Nice.
Click to expand...

I don't think it will be the same, considering what Chaotic42/WinstonSmith are saying is actually true.
 
Originally posted by: Chaotic42
Originally posted by: silverpig
Absolute zero has been reached. It doesn't require zero energy. Temperature is a measure of the average KINETIC energy of a particle.
Click to expand...

Assuming that you are talking scales of longer than a planck second, the electrons of the atom can't be at rest. Their average kinetic energy should always be some non-zero amount, or we could determine both their location, and their momentum (0). If their momentum is ever 0, we will always be able to tell where they are, because they aren't moving.
Click to expand...

Eh, well yeah. So it's actually a few millionths (or billionths I've heard recently) of a degree.

Also, you CAN stop something perfectly. Just because it's stopped doesn't mean you know where it is (in fact the opposite is true). The problem is that in determining location you would have to bounce something off the stationary particle, thereby imparting momentum. Heisenberg doesn't preclude zero motion.
 
Originally posted by: silverpig
Also, you CAN stop something perfectly. Just because it's stopped doesn't mean you know where it is (in fact the opposite is true). The problem is that in determining location you would have to bounce something off the stationary particle, thereby imparting momentum. Heisenberg doesn't preclude zero motion.
Click to expand...
Which is fine, but it could turn in to a kitten and it wouldn't make any difference. We'll never know what the particle did, and we'll never be able to get any information from it that would tell us it stopped. It can (and I guess it does) happen, but it doesn't really matter.

 
its imposssible to achieve absolute zero. in order to cool something down to a certain degree, the object or thing next to it has to be cooler than the degree you want (since heat travels from hotter to colder things). and since nothing can be colder than absolute zero, its impossible to get to absolute zero.

it reminds me of that keep diving a number by 2 but you will never reach 0 theory
 
Originally posted by: dionx
its imposssible to achieve absolute zero. in order to cool something down to a certain degree, the object or thing next to it has to be cooler than the degree you want (since heat travels from hotter to colder things). and since nothing can be colder than absolute zero, its impossible to get to absolute zero.

it reminds me of that keep diving a number by 2 but you will never reach 0 theory
Click to expand...

That's if you use conductive cooling. If you could somehow determine the momentum of a particle, then you could use light to impart just that exact amount of momentum in the opposite direction, stopping the particle dead. Waayyyy too precise to be reasonable these days though.
 
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