IDC global smartphone numbers, Q1 2013

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Crono

Lifer
Aug 8, 2001
23,720
1,502
136
so what you're saying is that android flagship on top specs have bad battery life and cant get through a day, yet conceding that WP8 phones with old specs have even worse battery life? im confused as to the point you're trying to make here.

Not all Windows Phones have worse battery life, the Nokia Lumia 920 isn't particularly good, though. The point I'm making is that I wouldn't want to see a Lumia 920 with 1080p screen or quad core CPU if they can't maintain or increase battery life. There's definitely a hit to battery life and increased heat by adding a 1080p screen. The only reason the S4 and One don't have horrendous battery life is that the increased battery capacity from the previous generation. Even then you aren't going to get a full day of battery life except in optimal circumstances or where you are using the phone very lightly.

It shouldn't be that hard to see that's the point(s) I'm making, frankly.


and the only reason WP8 is smooth and crisp on 720p is because its entire UI is nothing but flat colored tiles.

Yes. Okay. It's a design choice, and it seems that flat design is actually catching on so... okay? I'm not seeing that Android looks significantly better, especially not in icon design versus tiles. I'm saying that as a user of Android, by the way. What's funny is how defensive other Android users automatically get... I'm not saying 1080p phones are bad. I bought a HTC One, for crying out loud, and I love it. All I'm saying is I want to see better batteries before everyone jumps to adding them.

And like I said in a different thread, 468 DPI and higher quality screens are very nice, but 720p vs 1080p isn't making a world of difference on small screens. I think people are assuming that's the difference is huge, but part of that is from comparing older phones with inferior panels and low DPI to the current high end screens. It takes more power to drive 1080p... I would rather actually have high DPI 720p screens if battery life were to go up. If I could get 16 hours continuous of battery life with heavy use and maximum brightness I would be happy.
 
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s44

Diamond Member
Oct 13, 2006
9,427
16
81
Not all Windows Phones have worse battery life
Name one.

gsmarena_002.jpg


See, you literally know nothing about phone battery life. The One and S4 absolutely destroy the 920 -- and every other Windows phone -- on every count (except the One's deficiency in idle drain, but it still comes ahead overall), and in fact are better in real-world conditions than any phone besides the mega-battery Note 2 and MAXX (i5 may be about level, but it gets killed by bad reception in a way the bigger flagships don't).

More importantly, ~8 hours continuous use is an awesome standard that in no way corresponds to an 8 hour day, unless your job is to sit there and play with your phone all day. It means it absolutely will get you through a full day and will quite possibly get you through the second as well. That I have to explain this to you is amazingly bad for your credibility. Just stop before you dig deeper.

EDITED to be slightly nicer
 
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Crono

Lifer
Aug 8, 2001
23,720
1,502
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Name one.

Easy, the Lumia 720.

I didn't say there were Windows Phones were better than the One or S4, though, just better than the 920. The Lumia 720 is about the same as the One in browsing battery life.

See, you literally know nothing about phone battery life. The One and S4 absolutely destroy the 920 -- and every other Windows phone -- on every count (except the One's deficiency in idle drain, but it still comes ahead overall), and in fact are better in real-world conditions than any phone besides the mega-battery Note 2 and MAXX (i5 may be about level, but it gets killed by bad reception in a way the bigger flagships don't).

Why do you keep posting GSMArena benches?
They aren't the only one. And I would like to know their methodology and settings because clearly it's easy to put a phone on the lowest possible brightness and close all background tasks, enable battery saver, etc which might give you the best possible battery life but maybe not the one closest to reality. Here, let me quote another site's results:

53591.png


54313.png


GSMArena's results looks very optimistic compared to other sites tests which, if I wanted to spend further time (I don't) I could post here. Again, do you know what their methodology is? I would hope and expect a site to be biased more on the side of heavy, almost torturous usage, rather than very light usage to be more reflective of worst-case scenarios when it comes to battery tests.

You keep making this about the 920 vs the Android phones which, again, is not the point I'm making. Seriously. Why you are getting so defensive about the Android platform - and it's clear you are from your mocking tone - is beyond me. I almost "literally" have no clue why you keep bringing up the comparison, go back and read what I posted. I never claimed that Windows Phones have better battery life than Android phones. In any case, I don't even know how GSMArena tests both platforms so as far as I am concerned it's an apples to oranges comparison.

More importantly, ~8 hours continuous use is an awesome standard that in no way corresponds to an 8 hour day, unless your job is to sit there and play with your phone all day. It means it absolutely will get you through a full day and will quite possibly get you through the second as well. That I have to explain this to you is amazingly bad for your credibility. Just stop before you dig deeper.

EDITED to be slightly nicer

Do you have the One or S4? How long do you get on your phone? Do you have to enable battery saver or turn down the brightness to get 12 hours? Because that is how long *minimum* I would expect a phone with purportedly good battery life to last. Even if I work an 8 hour shift, with commute time, lunch break, etc I want a phone that lasts 12 hours with moderate to heavy usage. I have the One. That quoted GSMArena time is above what I get by 2 to 3 hours. Fully charged, It will NOT last me a full 12 hour day with moderate to heavy use, with GPS off, and brightness on medium-high. Furthermore, with 1080p video playing it doesn't last 6 hours and with video taking it lasts 6 to 7 hours. This is from own personal use.
Maybe I'm an outlier, but I don't appreciate someone questioning my credibility when I'm stating the truth from my own experience.

Sure, it's anecdotal, and your mileage may vary, but to me it's better than some test from a single site which you haven't provided the testing methodology or environment for as of yet.

In any case, I'm done arguing and repeating myself, it ceases to be productive after a certain point. I like both Windows Phones and Android phones, I'm just saying very few phones really last a day if actually used anywhere near their full potential. If you are going to put 1080p, 4G, bluetooth, and quad core processors in a phone, and actually use those features, you aren't going to get good battery life out of ANY current phone without adding a massive battery. That's just a fact. My point was and is that adding 1080p to a phone isn't necessarily the best thing if the base model already doesn't have good battery life. You haven't done anything to disprove that, you just went off on a tangent or wild goose chase that I entertained for some reason... maybe just pure annoyance, I don't know.
 
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MichaelBarg

Member
Oct 30, 2012
70
0
0
Wow 75% of the market, it is ridiculous how fast Android has continued to grow and grow.

What I find more amazing is how much of that is just Samsung. The Comscore numbers http://www.gartner.com/newsroom/id/2482816 have them moving 64 million smartphones! That's almost as many as #2-4 combined. Lots of people I think expected that Android would come to dominate over ios for the same reasons Windows did over MacOS. I'm not sure anyone really expected it to be so heavily dominated by one vendor though.
 

krumme

Diamond Member
Oct 9, 2009
5,956
1,596
136
Easy, the Lumia 720.

I didn't say there were Windows Phones were better than the One or S4, though, just better than the 920. The Lumia 720 is about the same as the One in browsing battery life.



Why do you keep posting GSMArena benches?

They aren't the only one. And I would like to know their methodology and settings because clearly it's easy to put a phone on the lowest possible brightness and close all background tasks, enable battery saver, etc which might give you the best possible battery life but maybe not the one closest to reality. Here, let me quote another site's results:

Its easy to find gsmarenas bettery methology. Its here:
http://www.gsmarena.com/gsmarena_lab_tests-review-751p6.php

Full oversight of methology is here:
http://www.gsmarena.com/gsmarena_lab_tests-review-751.php

What is Anandtechs methology, and how is the results updated?

Testing battery life is not an easy thing. But GSM arena, have used the same procedure, and does a lots of phones. Also with updates with new firmware.
 
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krumme

Diamond Member
Oct 9, 2009
5,956
1,596
136
What I find more amazing is how much of that is just Samsung. The Comscore numbers http://www.gartner.com/newsroom/id/2482816 have them moving 64 million smartphones! That's almost as many as #2-4 combined. Lots of people I think expected that Android would come to dominate over ios for the same reasons Windows did over MacOS. I'm not sure anyone really expected it to be so heavily dominated by one vendor though.

Its crazy how they are on a roll. The downside is for the PC vendors. In Europe, pc sales is just going a third down compared to last year.

We can hope for more competition. That the nokia 520 and 720 gain some momentum - they are really nice phones for the price. Sony seems focused on the market. But at least Samsung lifted us away from the Apple only highend choice.
 

Oyeve

Lifer
Oct 18, 1999
22,061
881
126
why is it not an issue? I can't install Hangouts on my Nexus 10 yet.

Edit: The latest update works now, but still not available for my SGS2.

Google, on their own app store, says hang tight, its coming too all android devices.
 

Crono

Lifer
Aug 8, 2001
23,720
1,502
136
Its easy to find gsmarenas bettery methology. Its here:
http://www.gsmarena.com/gsmarena_lab_tests-review-751p6.php

Full oversight of methology is here:
http://www.gsmarena.com/gsmarena_lab_tests-review-751.php

Testing battery life is not an easy thing. But GSM arena, have used the same procedure, and does a lots of phones. Also with updates with new firmware.

They are definitely some issues with the way they test battery life. Not just my observation, just from the comments section on that page alone:

I'm really happy with your tests, especially battery test is important for me. But I'm asking only two improvements to it:

1. Don't favor dim screens but put them at about the same brightness, for example 400 nits, most displays can do it (except for some Samsung AMOLEDs). Or maybe 300 for AMOLEDs and 400 for LCDs and IPS' since at least I've noticed that more contrast means that screen doesn't have to be as bright to be comfortable as with lower contrast.

2. Show us the exact standby consumption. I understand that you don't have time to wait the whole battery to drain in standby but you can tell us the consumption in milliamperes.
would it be possible to have an additional video test with 720p mkv movies.
i think a lot of people download 720p content rather than SD content and with the latest smartphones capable of even 1080p mkv playback it doesnt make much sense to test video playback with sd content
Is it possible to provide more detail testing procedure ?
the screen should view a white page and adjust brightness to obtain defined amount of lux per 1 inch (not tofavour large screens) , thatbrightness level will be the test level, then the web and the movie shouldn't be very dark nor very bright.
cheers,
I was about to post something similar. Using 50% is an awful decision and I can't see how if any of these tests are in any way well performed that they could have come up with such a test method.

The results are worse than meaningless, they are deceptive!

Please set phones to a standard uniform lux setting. You have to also declare the lux setting that could be achieved for the test.
Not declaring the lux output in the current tests is just hiding from people how flawed this test is.

A real shame as that could have been a great feature for this site.
Hi,

thanks for your efforts - however, I think that results concerning the screen are utterly useless (even unprofessional)... let me explain:

First of all you set the screen brightness to 50%. That's not good enough as each smartphone will emit a different brightness at its 50% setting. Results vary immensely. By setting brightness to 50% you punish phones that offer high screen brightness; therewith punishing good outdoor visibility. And all of that totally unnecessary.

You need to choose a certain brightness level in lumens.. or candelas whatever your favorite brightness is. Choose anything that is good indoors. Then measure again.

Let me be clear: That's a complete FAIL on your part and comperability is not given.

Second: The movie. Which one is it? Is it Batman with almost all black parts therewith completely favoring AMOLEDs or is it some documentary on Antarctica - therewith destroying AMOLEDs? That's just not good enough. You need to choose a movie and state which one you use.

Anyway, that's not as much of a fail as the 50% brightness.. Or do you want very dark phones? As you those would rule your test?

Please..
Dear gsmarena,

Please specify the resolution and bitrate of the Video used in Battery life test.

thanks
For the Battery test... I suggest do include battery endurance on GPS.
Please add detailed GPS tests. No website does that and GPS is quite important in modern phones. Most times you just check the lock speed and not much more. Would be good to have tracks displayed, to show accuracy, not only how fast it locks but how precise it is, antenna quality, etc.
That would help in GPS failures like the Galaxy 1.
What is Anandtechs methology, and how is the results updated?
http://www.anandtech.com/show/6914/samsung-galaxy-s-4-review/2

Results are updated on a case-by-case basis, I think. For instance I would assume the S4 results would be updated in the review Part 2 if/when it's posted.

I'm not saying GSMArena's results are completely useless, or that AnandTech's benches are flawless. I think the smartphone battery testing AnandTech does is a bit more thorough, consistent, and demanding, though. In any case, benchmarks are high variable depending on the reviewer's methodology or test environment, or the individual unit. Different sites come up with different numbers.

My issue is that I was called out like I'm a moron by S44 for being wrong about "literally everything". Even if what I stated doesn't cover all user experiences, it certainly is representative of many users - including my own - and simply posting images from one other website doesn't make be off base or incorrect. If anyone else feels I'm a complete idiot feel free to chime in.
 
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krumme

Diamond Member
Oct 9, 2009
5,956
1,596
136
They are definitely some issues with the way they test battery life. Not just my observation, just from the comments section on that page alone:




http://www.anandtech.com/show/6914/samsung-galaxy-s-4-review/2

Results are updated on a case-by-case basis, I think. For instance I would assume the S4 results would be updated in the review Part 2 if/when it's posted.

I'm not saying GSMArena's results are completely useless, or that AnandTech's benches are flawless. I think the smartphone battery testing AnandTech does is a bit more thorough, consistent, and demanding, though. In any case, benchmarks are high variable depending on the reviewer's methodology or test environment, or the individual unit. Different sites come up with different numbers.

My issue is that I was called out like I'm a moron by S44 for being wrong about "literally everything". Even if what I stated doesn't cover all user experiences, it certainly is representative of many users - including my own - and simply posting images from one other website doesn't make be off base or incorrect. If anyone else feels I'm a complete idiot feel free to chime in.

You asked for the methology and it was there. With an open discussion.

Gsmarena gives you the number to judge yourself.
 
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