I was surprised how much difference good tires make

[NoCreativity]

I love Michelin LTX m/s on my old SUV, got 70k miles before I traded it in, probably good for another 20k miles, so they are worth the little bit higher price. My wife's RDX came with Michelin Pilot, they are horrible in wet condition, very noise, we got 40k miles (which isn't bad) out of them. We replaced them with Continental ExtremeContact DWS, they are so much quieter and better.

No kidding. That's what came on my fusion. I swear they would hydroplane if the humidity got too high.

 

[LTC8K6]

umm OK!! Your point???

Oh come on!

http://en.linglong.cn/products_detail/&productId=355.html

 

[slag]

Winter weather in states with snow = snow tires......PERIOD!!!!!!!

Nah, we haven't had more than an inch or two at a time here this year. no need for a dedicated set of snow tires on our cars. Plus, the snow is usually gone within a day or two at most. Both of our vehicles also are 4wd, my tundra and her explorer sport.

 

[LTC8K6]

No kidding. That's what came on my fusion. I swear they would hydroplane if the humidity got too high.

Factory tires are often the cheapest they can contract for, even though they have the same name as a tire you would buy yourself, they don't necessarily ride and wear the same.

 

[Wuzup101]

I love Michelin LTX m/s on my old SUV, got 70k miles before I traded it in, probably good for another 20k miles, so they are worth the little bit higher price. My wife's RDX came with Michelin Pilot, they are horrible in wet condition, very noise, we got 40k miles (which isn't bad) out of them. We replaced them with Continental ExtremeContact DWS, they are so much quieter and better.

Yeah but the Pilot MXM4's that come on the RDX aren't really comparable to the DWS (GT tire vs performance oriented A/S tire). Really the comparison would be between the DWS and the Pilot Sport A/S 3. Michelin makes some great performance tires. That being said, I have owned the DWS and have not owned the Pilot Sport A/S 3. I always recommend the DWS. It's probably the best value in that segment. I have a set that's down to the cords in my garage... need to get them removed from those rims lol...

 

[Midwayman]

Expensive tires doesn't necessarily mean better traction while new, but it typically means more consistent performance as the tire wears and over a range of conditions. They'll have multi-stage tread compounds and better rubber compounds that stay flexible when cold, or don't get greasy when pushed.

The thing is very few people are in a position to make really objective observations about the performance of their tires. They come in with bald, years old tires, and put on fresh no names. Of course they feel better.

 

[JCH13]

Expensive tires doesn't necessarily mean better traction while new, but it typically means more consistent performance as the tire wears and over a range of conditions. They'll have multi-stage tread compounds and better rubber compounds that stay flexible when cold, or don't get greasy when pushed.

The thing is very few people are in a position to make really objective observations about the performance of their tires. They come in with bald, years old tires, and put on fresh no names. Of course they feel better.

This, for sure.

 

[JulesMaximus]

http://www.caranddriver.com/comparisons/ling-long-l688-page-3

Yeah, I don't think I'd buy Ling Long tires for ANY vehicle. They are just shit tires so it's not surprising that you found them to be much worse than your tires.

This Ling Long proves that a complete tire design involves more than just a tread pattern, because the L688’s V-shaped layout is essentially a copy of Yokohama’s AVS Sport tire.

Consistently finishing last in all of the performance categories, the Ling Longs’ dry autocross performance was so far behind the other tires’ that we had to round its score up to zero to keep it from being negative. Geswein used the words “hard” and “skatey” to describe the Ling Longs’ feel. Their best showing was on the skidpad, where an 0.88-g effort tied the Yokohamas’ for last.

Things got worse in the wet, where slip-and-slide behavior required a conservative effort to stay between the cones. The Ling Longs were a full five seconds off the autocross pace and needed 22 more feet—1.5 3-series car-lengths—to stop from 50 mph than did the best Hankooks.

On the street loop, we were irritated by a low-speed drone, and these were the only tires to squeal under semi-aggressive cornering.

Aside from tires, the parent company, Shandong Ling Long, in Zhaoyuan, China, also specializes in cement. Is this a strategic advantage? We’re not sure, but the Ling Longs showed the least wear after testing—we nicknamed them the “Live Longs”—so there may be a connection. But even though they cost half the price of many competing tires, they scored less than half the points of even the eighth-place tire. To us, that doesn’t qualify as a value, even at $57.http://www.caranddriver.com/comparisons/nitto-invo-page-4

 

[DaTT]

I have a nice set of Cooper winter tires, I might as well be driving AWD. I never get stuck. Drives like it's on rails.....in the snow.

 

[BUTCH1]

:thumbsdown: Cost has absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with tread wear ratings.

On my last car I put Michelin performance tires on after my first set wore out. I got about 40,000 miles out of them and they cost me almost $1000 for the set. Next set I bought Riken Raptors for half the cost and they lasted about the same mileage and very similar performance.

Not sure about Chinese ling ling tires but generally speaking, new tires will always be much safer and provide better traction and performance than tires that are worn out.

Ding ding!, correct answer, a more expensive tire might have a better cord construction and offer better handling but that in no way determines tire life. I once bought an expensive set of Cooper tires for my 77 Cutlass (heavy car), I loved the grip and feel of these but they were shot after 20K and yes, I did rotate them. Bottom line is if you have a "sporty" car and want that extra traction a softer compound must be used which will inevitably shorten the tire life. My last 2 sets were bought from Discount called Falken, I believe it's their house brand made in Korea, I find they are a nice riding, decent traction tire that lasts about 40-45K under normal driving. It's not the cheapest tire offered by Discount but a very liveable comprise IMO and cost about $450 out the door.

EDIT: I was wrong about them being offered at Discount only, they are available at other places as well.

 

[IGemini]

I got away with decent all-season Firestone tires learning to drive, even when I was living in an area where 8-12" snowfall was pretty common. Good way to learn how not to be overconfident in winter conditions.

When I got my latest car the previous owner put on Sears brand Superguard performance tires that were absolute junk, even though they had <5k miles of treadwear by the time I got the car. TC sometimes kicked in even on mildly wet roads, and I'm not an aggressive driver. Swapped in Uniroyal Tiger Paws, huge difference in wet traction. Only has trouble with more than a couple inches of untreated/plowed snow. Rides nicer, too. Price difference vs the old pair was maybe $5 per tire new.

These suit my purposes, don't really have a reason for a dedicated set of snow tires with no place to store the main set off-season.

 

[AMCRambler]

Linglong 788 is a non-directional tread. I think those do particularly crappy on snow.

http://factorywheelsandtires.com/lin-205-55-16-linglong-l788-91v-new-tire.html

So if you got some wing dings tires with a directional tread pattern in might be a closer comparo to your michelins.

 

[jagec]

Yes, they do but I'm not looking for max performance. I'm looking for max economy and max comfort/quietness.

I usually use Yokohamas for economy cars, but last year Michelin was running a promotion right when I needed a new set, so I picked up a set of Defenders for a little over $100 each. I have some pretty serious doubts that they'll live up to their mind-boggling 90,000-mile warranty, but per mile they'll probably end up cheaper than the Yokos.

Performance has been more than adequate for an economy car...they made it through winter storm Pandora without much sliding at all considering the conditions.

 

[lavaheadache]

ahhh, tires yes.. Not looking forward to the bill this spring for new sneaks on the 997.

 

[slugg]

I've always believed that the #1 upgrade you can give a car is its tires. Well, maybe a better driver, too.

 

[Eug]

Winter weather in states with snow = snow tires......PERIOD!!!!!!!

Well, it's a little more than that. There are a lot of el crappo snow tires out there. While I'd prefer good snow tires over good all seasons in the snow, I'd prefer good all seasons over bargain basement snow tires in most instances.

 

[soccerballtux]

The best tires I ever had were a set of Michelin's. Unbelievable the difference in drive quality - traction, handling, noise.

Now have a set of Bridgestones which are ok but will replace them with Michelins the next time.

Yeah I've been having great experiences on Michelin.

Also, I can't stand abs. It pushes the pedal towards my foot and reduces the pressure to the pads. It requires user training to press much much harder to immediately continue braking at the same rate as before. It's even worse than if the tire had just skidded.

 

[JCH13]

Yeah I've been having great experiences on Michelin.

Also, I can't stand abs. It pushes the pedal towards my foot and reduces the pressure to the pads. It requires user training to press much much harder to immediately continue braking at the same rate as before. It's even worse than if the tire had just skidded.

This is laughably incorrect. ABS shortens stopping distances, end of story. Modern ABS systems far out-perform humans in every situation you're likely to encounter in the real world.

I say this as someone who owns two cars without ABS, who races cars without ABS, and who has researched and read up a lot on this topic.

 

[Midwayman]

This is laughably incorrect. ABS shortens stopping distances, end of story. Modern ABS systems far out-perform humans in every situation you're likely to encounter in the real world.

I say this as someone who owns two cars without ABS, who races cars without ABS, and who has researched and read up a lot on this topic.

With the exception of loose surfaces, its generally true. The one other instance Ive found ABS scary is over bumpy pavement. It has over activated on me. Can't say for sure if locking the tires would have helped, but it felt like the car took my brakes from me a couple times.

 

[JulesMaximus]

Man, I need new tires. Felt the tires struggling to pump the water out this morning on my drive in to work. 40k miles and these have about had it. Just need to be careful and take it easy on the way home tonight.

 

[JulesMaximus]

With the exception of loose surfaces, its generally true. The one other instance Ive found ABS scary is over bumpy pavement. It has over activated on me. Can't say for sure if locking the tires would have helped, but it felt like the car took my brakes from me a couple times.

Imagine what that's like on a motorcycle with ABS. The ABS on my last bike was pretty crude and I didn't like the way it would activate over bumpy pavement while braking. My new bike has a much better system and it doesn't seem to come on so noticeably, haven't noticed it at all yet really.

That said, I think ABS on motorcycles is a fantastic safety feature and all street bikes should have it. You can turn off the ABS on my bike if you want but I never have. It defaults to on every time you start the bike. Traction control you can turn off and leave off.

 

[JCH13]

With the exception of loose surfaces, its generally true. The one other instance Ive found ABS scary is over bumpy pavement. It has over activated on me. Can't say for sure if locking the tires would have helped, but it felt like the car took my brakes from me a couple times.

The Chassis Handbook which is what the wikipedia article on ABS cites as a source for 'ABS lengthens stopping distances' (I also have access to this book at work) notes the following (on P182):

-Loose surfaces like fresh snow and gravel can see increased stopping distances with ABS
-These are exceptions with very little bearing on real-world driving (when was the last time anyone here drove on completely fresh snow or completely un-packed gravel?)
-In these circumstances the extra control offered by ABS is better than a shorter stopping distance

http://books.google.com/books?id=NS...Dg&ved=0CDgQ6AEwAg#v=onepage&q=gravel&f=false

These are the people who literally wrote the book on it, and one small sliver has been pulled out of context by a number of people to whine about ABS. Let's stop perpetuating the misunderstanding.

 

[Midwayman]

The Chassis Handbook which is what the wikipedia article on ABS cites as a source for 'ABS lengthens stopping distances' (I also have access to this book at work) notes the following (on P182):

-Loose surfaces like fresh snow and gravel can see increased stopping distances with ABS
-These are exceptions with very little bearing on real-world driving (when was the last time anyone here drove on completely fresh snow or completely un-packed gravel?)
-In these circumstances the extra control offered by ABS is better than a shorter stopping distance

http://books.google.com/books?id=NS...Dg&ved=0CDgQ6AEwAg#v=onepage&q=gravel&f=false

These are the people who literally wrote the book on it, and one small sliver has been pulled out of context by a number of people to whine about ABS. Let's stop perpetuating the misunderstanding.

Who is perpetuating a misunderstanding? You just confirmed the exception. I drive on fresh snow and occasionally gravel. Its not like they are surfaces nobody ever has contact with.

 

[3chordcharlie]

Good tires. That's a nice dream.
Try driving a car that needs 195/50 R16 "speed rated" tires

A quick look suggests this is not a problem at all.

Also, you aren't tied to speed rating for snow tires.

If your worry is that they cost a few bucks more than tires for a Civic, buy a Civic.

 

[3chordcharlie]

I love Michelin LTX m/s on my old SUV, got 70k miles before I traded it in, probably good for another 20k miles, so they are worth the little bit higher price. My wife's RDX came with Michelin Pilot, they are horrible in wet condition, very noise, we got 40k miles (which isn't bad) out of them. We replaced them with Continental ExtremeContact DWS, they are so much quieter and better.

LTX M/S is a good tire, and one of the few all seasons that give good snow performance at least when relatively new.

As a truck tire, however, I've never seen them get 70K kilometers before, forget 70k+miles. Granted these have all been on working vehicles.