I was reading a wiki article on Lincoln Town Cars, and apparently the 03 model got a 4.6L V8

[dug777]

In this day & age at least :shocked:

The new Falcon I6 4.0-litre produces 195kW and 391Nm on 91RON fuel, rising to 198kW/409Nm if 95RON fuel is used.

Never mind the other stock Ford options: the I6 turbo 4 is 270kW and 533Nm on 95RON, and the V8 (admittedly 5.4L) 290kW and 520Nm on 95RON.

Why not stick one of those V8s in the LTC?

Heck, even the el cheapo base NA I6 would be an improvement

 

[DougK62]

Because....that's all they need for it to put out? The Town Car is for old people - they just want the car to move under its own power and be reliable. Not everyone is a stoplight drag racer.

 

[StageLeft]

Originally posted by: DougK62
Because....that's all they need for it to put out? The Town Car is for old people - they just want the car to move under its own power and be reliable. Not everyone is a stoplight drag racer.

Old people drive about 600 miles/year. I don't know that they need a particularly reliable car

 

[Demon-Xanth]

Originally posted by: Skoorb

Originally posted by: DougK62
Because....that's all they need for it to put out? The Town Car is for old people - they just want the car to move under its own power and be reliable. Not everyone is a stoplight drag racer.

Old people drive about 600 miles/year. I don't know that they need a particularly reliable car

They need it to last to the 30,000 mile oil change interval.

 

[Sluggo]

The Panther platform, Town Car, Crown Vic and Grand Marquis, got the 4.6 long before '03, more like mid 90's and it has been a rock solid motor for Ford. Except for that pesky plastic intake issue, and that has been resolved.

If the 4.6 is good enough for the Mustang GT, it is good enough for the geriatric line.

 

[Arkaign]

Originally posted by: DougK62
Because....that's all they need for it to put out? The Town Car is for old people - they just want the car to move under its own power and be reliable. Not everyone is a stoplight drag racer.

Ditto.

Not to mention you don't *really* want grandpa and grandma 80 years old out there running a 400hp 32v supercharged V8. Ooops I hit the gas when I meant to hit the brakes, sorry about that!

 

[DivideBYZero]

Stop talking in KW, you nutbag!

 

[alpineranger]

You realize that this drivetrain is essentially what goes into the police crown vic? It's not just for the old folks... It's probably really reliable, at least.

And arkaign, you don't need 400 hp to be effective: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_Russell_Weller

 

[exdeath]

Same exact reason Intel has 15 different CPU speeds from 1 GHz to 3+ GHz all using the same exact piece of silicon. Why do they make a 1.6 GHz CPU at all when you can just overclock it to 3 GHz? Couldn't they just use a smaller CPU die or weaker chip instead of wasting a Core 2 die for such a weak CPU?

They don't need the power, but it's easier and more cost effective to just use existing tooling and "underclock" it and change the dressing on it to make it do the job than it is to make an entirely different engine for every car.

If you are trying to pull the ricer HP/Liter argument, take a look at the 4.6L engines properly built in race cars making 600+ HP N/A and 2000+ HP blown.

It's all about application, target market, consolidating tooling, and parts sharing logistics.

How could anyone possibly build a V8 that only makes 295 ft-lb as well when their I6 already makes 262 ft-lb?

 

[thedarkwolf]

Its not probably really reliable it its really reliable. That version of the 4.6l is setup to have a flat smooth torque curve and get decent mileage in a big fat cruiser not run the 1/4 mile. I'd love to see the 4.0l turbo here but people in the US are pansies and can't drive RWD cars in the rain or snow so we are stuck with FWD and a long straight 6 turbo is hard to pack under the hood transversely. I don't know if it can meet our emission standards either. We are getting a twin turbo 3.5l v6 that will make 340-415hp depending on setup here soon.

 

[Zenmervolt]

It's a big, low-stressed V8 designed to move the car around without much effort. As such, it's optimized for low-RPM torque at the cost of horsepower. Ford realises that no-one is ever going to be running a Town Car up to redline.

ZV

 

[Demon-Xanth]

Doing some looking up on that turbo I6, that engine is a flat out beast. 550LB/ft of torque is just lovely

 

[thecoolnessrune]

The 4.6L V8 put in Crown Vics is almost bulletproof, along with the old 5L that were their predecessors. Our old 1989 Lincoln Towncar with the 5.0L is at 650k miles with only a starter and water pump replacement. When looking for a vehicle I test drove a 10 year old Town Car and it was completely solid, drove straight, made no creaks or funny sounds. It's one of the only vehicles I'd consider purchasing at older than 8 years.

The 4.6 has an extremely flat power curve that gives it solid startup power when it's needed. Additionally, alot of Town Cars can actually run 14s on the track, so it's not really *that* bad.

You can stretch HP/L as far as you want. Heck isn't the Atom in the 2L range? The point is that the 4.6L will last through a 20k mile oil change interval and hardly ever need repairs while the Atom needs extremely frequent oil changes and extensive maintenance.

 

[overst33r]

Originally posted by: thecoolnessrune
The 4.6L V8 put in Crown Vics is almost bulletproof, along with the old 5L that were their predecessors. Our old 1989 Lincoln Towncar with the 5.0L is at 650k miles with only a starter and water pump replacement. When looking for a vehicle I test drove a 10 year old Town Car and it was completely solid, drove straight, made no creaks or funny sounds. It's one of the only vehicles I'd consider purchasing at older than 8 years.

The 4.6 has an extremely flat power curve that gives it solid startup power when it's needed. Additionally, alot of Town Cars can actually run 14s on the track, so it's not really *that* bad.

You can stretch HP/L as far as you want. Heck isn't the Atom in the 2L range? The point is that the 4.6L will last through a 20k mile oil change interval and hardly ever need repairs while the Atom needs extremely frequent oil changes and extensive maintenance.

the atoms powerplant is straight out of the civic type r which is as reliable as a wood burning stove. What is this extensive maintenance you're talking about? Also, a car that lives on a track @ 8k RPM vs a car that will likely never see more than 3-4k RPM is not a good comparison.

 

[dug777]

Originally posted by: exdeath

If you are trying to pull the ricer HP/Liter argument...

q]

Ricer? These are standard Ford motors I'm referring to, and I'd be referring to kW/Litres anyway

Would the 5.4L really be that much less reliable? It's hardly 'stressed' in the guise they throw it into the Falcon, compared to what you can do, even just NA, with that block...

 

[foghorn67]

Originally posted by: mariok2006

Originally posted by: thecoolnessrune
The 4.6L V8 put in Crown Vics is almost bulletproof, along with the old 5L that were their predecessors. Our old 1989 Lincoln Towncar with the 5.0L is at 650k miles with only a starter and water pump replacement. When looking for a vehicle I test drove a 10 year old Town Car and it was completely solid, drove straight, made no creaks or funny sounds. It's one of the only vehicles I'd consider purchasing at older than 8 years.

The 4.6 has an extremely flat power curve that gives it solid startup power when it's needed. Additionally, alot of Town Cars can actually run 14s on the track, so it's not really *that* bad.

You can stretch HP/L as far as you want. Heck isn't the Atom in the 2L range? The point is that the 4.6L will last through a 20k mile oil change interval and hardly ever need repairs while the Atom needs extremely frequent oil changes and extensive maintenance.

the atoms powerplant is straight out of the civic type r which is as reliable as a wood burning stove. What is this extensive maintenance you're talking about? Also, a car that lives on a track @ 8k RPM vs a car that will likely never see more than 3-4k RPM is not a good comparison.

Umm, the same 4.6L is in the Crown Vic police cruisers. If you don't they are being constantly hammered, you may want to rethink your statement.

 

[LordMorpheus]

that's 238 HP. The Town Car has had the 4.6 V8 since the 1991 model year, and in 1991 you either had 190 or 210 HP, depending on which exhaust options you have.

My 1997 has 210 HP (well, it had 210 HP when it was new).

They aren't sports cars.

 

[overst33r]

Originally posted by: foghorn67

Originally posted by: mariok2006

Originally posted by: thecoolnessrune
The 4.6L V8 put in Crown Vics is almost bulletproof, along with the old 5L that were their predecessors. Our old 1989 Lincoln Towncar with the 5.0L is at 650k miles with only a starter and water pump replacement. When looking for a vehicle I test drove a 10 year old Town Car and it was completely solid, drove straight, made no creaks or funny sounds. It's one of the only vehicles I'd consider purchasing at older than 8 years.

The 4.6 has an extremely flat power curve that gives it solid startup power when it's needed. Additionally, alot of Town Cars can actually run 14s on the track, so it's not really *that* bad.

You can stretch HP/L as far as you want. Heck isn't the Atom in the 2L range? The point is that the 4.6L will last through a 20k mile oil change interval and hardly ever need repairs while the Atom needs extremely frequent oil changes and extensive maintenance.

the atoms powerplant is straight out of the civic type r which is as reliable as a wood burning stove. What is this extensive maintenance you're talking about? Also, a car that lives on a track @ 8k RPM vs a car that will likely never see more than 3-4k RPM is not a good comparison.

Umm, the same 4.6L is in the Crown Vic police cruisers. If you don't they are being constantly hammered, you may want to rethink your statement.

Ok, it still doesn't come even close to the environment the atom is used in. 20k between oil changes? Unless each oil change is being analyzed, I doubt that engine will be kicking for long.

 

[LordMorpheus]

Originally posted by: mariok2006

Originally posted by: foghorn67

Originally posted by: mariok2006

Originally posted by: thecoolnessrune
The 4.6L V8 put in Crown Vics is almost bulletproof, along with the old 5L that were their predecessors. Our old 1989 Lincoln Towncar with the 5.0L is at 650k miles with only a starter and water pump replacement. When looking for a vehicle I test drove a 10 year old Town Car and it was completely solid, drove straight, made no creaks or funny sounds. It's one of the only vehicles I'd consider purchasing at older than 8 years.

The 4.6 has an extremely flat power curve that gives it solid startup power when it's needed. Additionally, alot of Town Cars can actually run 14s on the track, so it's not really *that* bad.

You can stretch HP/L as far as you want. Heck isn't the Atom in the 2L range? The point is that the 4.6L will last through a 20k mile oil change interval and hardly ever need repairs while the Atom needs extremely frequent oil changes and extensive maintenance.

the atoms powerplant is straight out of the civic type r which is as reliable as a wood burning stove. What is this extensive maintenance you're talking about? Also, a car that lives on a track @ 8k RPM vs a car that will likely never see more than 3-4k RPM is not a good comparison.

Umm, the same 4.6L is in the Crown Vic police cruisers. If you don't they are being constantly hammered, you may want to rethink your statement.

Ok, it still doesn't come even close to the environment the atom is used in. 20k between oil changes? Unless each oil change is being analyzed, I doubt that engine will be kicking for long.

I'd bet most police departments do routine service like oil changes religiously, even if they beat the crap out of the cars on the road.

 

[thecoolnessrune]

Originally posted by: mariok2006

Originally posted by: foghorn67

Originally posted by: mariok2006

Originally posted by: thecoolnessrune
The 4.6L V8 put in Crown Vics is almost bulletproof, along with the old 5L that were their predecessors. Our old 1989 Lincoln Towncar with the 5.0L is at 650k miles with only a starter and water pump replacement. When looking for a vehicle I test drove a 10 year old Town Car and it was completely solid, drove straight, made no creaks or funny sounds. It's one of the only vehicles I'd consider purchasing at older than 8 years.

The 4.6 has an extremely flat power curve that gives it solid startup power when it's needed. Additionally, alot of Town Cars can actually run 14s on the track, so it's not really *that* bad.

You can stretch HP/L as far as you want. Heck isn't the Atom in the 2L range? The point is that the 4.6L will last through a 20k mile oil change interval and hardly ever need repairs while the Atom needs extremely frequent oil changes and extensive maintenance.

the atoms powerplant is straight out of the civic type r which is as reliable as a wood burning stove. What is this extensive maintenance you're talking about? Also, a car that lives on a track @ 8k RPM vs a car that will likely never see more than 3-4k RPM is not a good comparison.

Umm, the same 4.6L is in the Crown Vic police cruisers. If you don't they are being constantly hammered, you may want to rethink your statement.

Ok, it still doesn't come even close to the environment the atom is used in. 20k between oil changes? Unless each oil change is being analyzed, I doubt that engine will be kicking for long.

1989 Lincoln 5L at 650k miles and counting.. 20k average, 35k at one point. Theres a 1995 at 420k miles in the neighborhood owned by an old lady here who only changes at 25k. Still ticking without a problem.

As I said, the 4.6 in the Crown Vic and Town Car is pretty much bulletproof.

 

[kalrith]

My '92 Mercury Cougar has a 5.0L V8. My '01 Mazda Tribute has a 3.0L V6. They both have 200hp. It seems that a lot changed in just 9 years.

 

[Arkaign]

While that 650k mile Lincoln is impressive, and indicative of a good platform, it's hardly the norm, any more than it's the norm to see a 500k mile Toyota etc.

~250k is the upper limit for almost any make/model under normal circumstances (original engine, drivetrain), and anything else is an exception.

 

[nakedfrog]

My 77 Grand Marquis had a 460 V8 that had some pathetically low HP output. That's 7.5L. The best spec I could find said something like 220-240HP... but the torque number was something like 350ft/lb. Got 11mpg on average